A aviation & planes forum. AviationBanter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » AviationBanter forum » rec.aviation newsgroups » Soaring
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

ASW15 vs ASW19



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old March 29th 18, 01:19 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Senna Van den Bosch
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 124
Default ASW15 vs ASW19

Hey everyone

I would like to have some opinions on buying a first glider between these two. There are a couple of both for sale that I've seen and my budget would be 10-20k euros.

Would you say the performance difference justifies the price difference? How would they compare at higher speeds and rigging/derigging?

Would the performance of the ASW15 be pretty much the same or within a few % to the Std Libelle, Std Cirrus, ...?
  #2  
Old March 29th 18, 02:58 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Michael Opitz
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 318
Default ASW15 vs ASW19

At 12:19 29 March 2018, Senna Van den Bosch wrote:
Hey everyone

I would like to have some opinions on buying a first glider between

these
two. There are a couple of both for sale that I've seen and my

budget would
be 10-20k euros.

Would you say the performance difference justifies the price

difference?
How would they compare at higher speeds and rigging/derigging?

Would the performance of the ASW15 be pretty much the same or

within a few
% to the Std Libelle, Std Cirrus, ...?

The -19 is just newer and better. The -15 has balsa wood core
sandwich wings, where the -19 has foam core which will not rot.
There was at least one TM about the balsa sandwich construction
on the -15. Performance of the -15 is similar to STD Cirrus or STD
Libelle. Dive brakes are better than on STD Cirrus because they are
upper and lower. The -19 has only upper, but with the 2 stage mod
(ASW-19B model), they are fine. The -19 has a forward hinged
canopy, where the -15 has the canopy that has to be completely
removed to get out, which is a pain in the rear. There is a -15B
model which has a larger rudder for better yaw control. The -19 has
the new Club Class handicap of 1.0, which will make it a favorite for
Club Class racers because it performs better than that handicap
indicates. You pay for what you get...

RO

  #3  
Old March 29th 18, 04:24 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Phil Chidekel
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 26
Default ASW15 vs ASW19

On Thursday, March 29, 2018 at 10:00:08 AM UTC-4, Michael Opitz wrote:
At 12:19 29 March 2018, Senna Van den Bosch wrote:
Hey everyone

I would like to have some opinions on buying a first glider between

these
two. There are a couple of both for sale that I've seen and my

budget would
be 10-20k euros.

Would you say the performance difference justifies the price

difference?
How would they compare at higher speeds and rigging/derigging?

Would the performance of the ASW15 be pretty much the same or

within a few
% to the Std Libelle, Std Cirrus, ...?

The -19 is just newer and better. The -15 has balsa wood core
sandwich wings, where the -19 has foam core which will not rot.
There was at least one TM about the balsa sandwich construction
on the -15. Performance of the -15 is similar to STD Cirrus or STD
Libelle. Dive brakes are better than on STD Cirrus because they are
upper and lower. The -19 has only upper, but with the 2 stage mod
(ASW-19B model), they are fine. The -19 has a forward hinged
canopy, where the -15 has the canopy that has to be completely
removed to get out, which is a pain in the rear. There is a -15B
model which has a larger rudder for better yaw control. The -19 has
the new Club Class handicap of 1.0, which will make it a favorite for
Club Class racers because it performs better than that handicap
indicates. You pay for what you get...

RO


I feel somewhat qualified to discuss the qualities on the ASW 15--I have the pleasure of flying XC in one quite regularly.

First off, I find the ASW 15 to be delightful to fly... Its handling qualities are outstanding. The ailerons and rudder are well balanced and responsive, and I have never found it to possess the "twitchiness" that people fear with other all-flying-tailed gliders. It thermals slow, and it out-climbs most of the other gliders I fly with regularly. I fly a straight 15, so it doesn't have the bigger rudder of the "B" models, and if I am flying aggressively, there are moments where I would appreciate another teensy bit of rudder authority. Not a big deal, but I suppose Gerhard Waibel shared my sentiments when he designed the B model. Mike Fadden graciously checked me out in his when I was a sophomore in High School, with most of my other time to that point being in 1-26s and Blaniks. The transition wasn't an issue.

The big spoilers are a totally great--the 15 will land on a literal handkerchief, and there have been tight moments where I have appreciated this. That being said, it has taken me a long time to learn how to land the 15 fully gracefully. It will spot landing easily, but I find the touchdown attitude to be very sensitive: two point attitude is *not quite* fully stalled. It could use a slightly bigger wheel--once again, I must not be the only one who thinks this, as the taller gear was added on the B model.

Assembly is a complete joke--the wings are very light, and almost always go together without any serious jiggling. I think John Bird and I could win a timed rigging contest if given the opportunity--if we try, we can have a 15 assembled, taped, PC-checked, and ready to fly in 15 minutes.

The performance? I would describe it as an honest 30:1 glider, but this has not discouraged me. I have learned a lot from flying something that isn't a super ship, and if flown well, it will keep up with a Discus.

The fully removable canopy is annoying.

I have access to a Pegasus (I know, I know, it's not a -19, but it is close), and honestly, I prefer flying the -15. The 15 is a very honest glider, and I can land it anywhere. The Peg is nice, but it doesn't have *that* much more performance, and it is a bit more of a pain to deal with. Given the ease of rigging the 15 and my comfort level in its characteristics, the choice is easy--it allows me to fly more. Plus, the shark tail is so damned good-looking.

The spar inspection is accomplished at annual every year. Keep it dry and give it the love it needs... But I fly it on the [varying levels of violent] ridges of Central PA, and have never worried about the wings falling off. Knock on wood(en wing spars).

Bottom line: for the money, I would totally buy a clean ASW 15. They are great little gliders.

Looks like a ridge day on Sunday...

Cheers.

Phil Chidekel
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
ASW19/20 Canopy strut [email protected] Soaring 10 July 3rd 17 03:16 PM
ASW19 for sale [email protected] Soaring 2 September 12th 16 10:07 PM
ASW19 Inner Tube [email protected] Soaring 1 September 21st 15 03:54 PM
asw19 airbrake kit steve[_2_] Soaring 2 April 7th 11 08:32 PM
ASW15 Site Johan Soaring 0 June 15th 04 04:08 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:15 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 AviationBanter.
The comments are property of their posters.