Differences in Italian vs US soaring instruction?

"Simon Walker" wrote in message
...

There is actually no prescribed way to turn at release
of tow in the UK.
You can turn either way, and I regularly do.

Clearly I've been misinformed. I have learned this technique from my local
club and have relatively little experience of other clubs/locations. I shall
definately make enquiries at my local club, I'm sure there must be a good
reason for it.

best wishes
Gail

Gail,

Turn left as I am assuming you have been told. The
tug pilot almost always turns and dives to the right
in the UK unless you are in contact with them i.e.
a situation where you are in a right turn climbing
in a thermal and you agree to reverse the convention.

Owain





At 20:48 16 July 2003, Gail wrote:

'Simon Walker' wrote in message
...

There is actually no prescribed way to turn at release
of tow in the UK.
You can turn either way, and I regularly do.

Clearly I've been misinformed. I have learned this
technique from my local
club and have relatively little experience of other
clubs/locations. I shall
definately make enquiries at my local club, I'm sure
there must be a good
reason for it.

best wishes
Gail

Simon Walker s comments read:

Usually they are pretty good and turn the opposite
way it's only when they are flying on mental autopilot
that they instinctively turn right.

Fine if you can count on your tug pilots ..

with a glider in a climbing right turn and tug in a
descending right turn there should still be no conflict.
So no nasty accidents.

Agreed so whether they are awake or not should be immaterial - unless
you pull of as they are flying to slow for you when you are full of
water ...
--
Tim - ASW20CL "20"

This is a particularly impressive document. The definition
of an accuracy landing includes stopping within 200ft
(120m) but not beyond a reference point.

Last time I checked there were 3.281ft in a metre,
making 120m nearly 400ft. Doh! Looks like it's not
what you think it is either!

At 18:06 16 July 2003, Michael wrote:
'Basil Fairston' wrote
PTS accuracy landing, whats that. In UK all landings
are supposed to be
accurate.

Since I started this mess, I'll try to answer some
of the questions.
While I've replied to this message in particular, I've
included the
points raised in others.

PTS means practical test standards, which are detailed
descriptions of
what is covered on a checkride. http://av-info.faa.gov/
is a web site
that contains them. It includes a description of an
accuracy landing.
If you've not flown in the US, I assure you it's not
what you think
it is.

Well what I do is
1. release
2. watch the rope snap off
3. watch the tug turning
4. turn to the opposite

Only exception would be if I'm towed under a ridge (neither tugs nor
sailplanes take great pleasure to turn into the ridge) - then I just keep
the visual contact to the tug until the vertical seperation is ok.

Bert
"Owain Walters" a écrit
dans le message de ...
Gail,

Turn left as I am assuming you have been told. The
tug pilot almost always turns and dives to the right
in the UK unless you are in contact with them i.e.
a situation where you are in a right turn climbing
in a thermal and you agree to reverse the convention.

Owain





At 20:48 16 July 2003, Gail wrote:

'Simon Walker' wrote in message
...

There is actually no prescribed way to turn at release
of tow in the UK.
You can turn either way, and I regularly do.

Clearly I've been misinformed. I have learned this
technique from my local
club and have relatively little experience of other
clubs/locations. I shall
definately make enquiries at my local club, I'm sure
there must be a good
reason for it.

best wishes
Gail

Flying at Ocana in Spain a couple of years ago, the standard tug response to
releasing the cable was to roll inverted and then pull through! I'm not sure
what the glider pilot should do in these circumstances, other than watch in
amazement.

"Tim" wrote in message
...
Simon Walker s comments read:

Usually they are pretty good and turn the opposite
way it's only when they are flying on mental autopilot
that they instinctively turn right.

Fine if you can count on your tug pilots ..

with a glider in a climbing right turn and tug in a
descending right turn there should still be no conflict.
So no nasty accidents.

Agreed so whether they are awake or not should be immaterial - unless
you pull of as they are flying to slow for you when you are full of
water ...
--
Tim - ASW20CL "20"

Well, in any situation there are always going to be
'Ah but what if's'
That's why we all, hopefully, use a big dash of common
sense when flying, try and anticipate possible problems
and modify our actions to minimise the risk in any
given situation.

Therefore, if you have a ballasted ASW20 being towed
too slowly and you have to release common sense would
dictate a turn to the left.

'Ah, but what if you had gliders thermalling off your
port wing, or the ridge, or cloud, or blah, blah, blah'

But, in most situations when you have energy and as
long as you have acheived separation from the rope
and rings then a climbing turn in either direction
is fine.

I can already hear somebody saying 'Ah, but what if
the widget thrup became disconnected from the thingummy
and then the sky fell on your head'

You can turn either left or right in the UK.


At 09:48 17 July 2003, Tim wrote:
Simon Walker s comments read:

Usually they are pretty good and turn the opposite
way it's only when they are flying on mental autopilot
that they instinctively turn right.

Fine if you can count on your tug pilots ..

with a glider in a climbing right turn and tug in a
descending right turn there should still be no conflict.
So no nasty accidents.

Agreed so whether they are awake or not should be immaterial
- unless
you pull of as they are flying to slow for you when
you are full of
water ...
--
Tim - ASW20CL '20'

On 16 Jul 2003 16:39:49 GMT, Simon Walker
wrote:


Hi Gail,

There is actually no prescribed direction to turn at
release of tow in the UK.
You can turn either way, and I do. However, most people
do assume that it is 'Turn left off tow'
What kind of nasty accident do you imagine might happen
if you turn left instead of right or vice versa?

On my one and only flight in a glider in the UK(Astir 77) I turned
right off tow and so did the towplane! I could see the dirty look the
pilot was giving me. I was told later the glider turns left off tow in
the UK.
In Australia the glider turns right, the towplane turns left. This
guarantees that the two lose sight fo each other and yes we have had a
mid air due to this. As the fighter pilots say " lost sight - lost
fight"

Maybe we should organise things so the two keep sight of each other
until positive separation has been established?

Mike Borgelt

One should of course also roll inverted and pull through
behind the tug to fool hin into thinking that the cable
didn't release. This is guaranteed to give tuggie a
heart attack.


At 11:48 17 July 2003, Chris Reed wrote:
Flying at Ocana in Spain a couple of years ago, the
standard tug response to
releasing the cable was to roll inverted and then pull
through! I'm not sure
what the glider pilot should do in these circumstances,
other than watch in
amazement.

'Tim' wrote in message
.. .
Simon Walker s comments read:

Usually they are pretty good and turn the opposite
way it's only when they are flying on mental autopilot
that they instinctively turn right.

Fine if you can count on your tug pilots ..

with a glider in a climbing right turn and tug in
a
descending right turn there should still be no conflict.
So no nasty accidents.

Agreed so whether they are awake or not should be
immaterial - unless
you pull of as they are flying to slow for you when
you are full of
water ...
--
Tim - ASW20CL '20'

Two pilots in my club have recently completed an assistant instructors
course in the UK. Apparently they are now being taught not to turn, but to
achieve separation from the tug by climbing (i.e. slowing down) straight
ahead.

Stephen

"Mike Borgelt" wrote in message
...
On 16 Jul 2003 16:39:49 GMT, Simon Walker
wrote:


Hi Gail,

There is actually no prescribed direction to turn at
release of tow in the UK.
You can turn either way, and I do. However, most people
do assume that it is 'Turn left off tow'
What kind of nasty accident do you imagine might happen
if you turn left instead of right or vice versa?

On my one and only flight in a glider in the UK(Astir 77) I turned
right off tow and so did the towplane! I could see the dirty look the
pilot was giving me. I was told later the glider turns left off tow in
the UK.
In Australia the glider turns right, the towplane turns left. This
guarantees that the two lose sight fo each other and yes we have had a
mid air due to this. As the fighter pilots say " lost sight - lost
fight"

Maybe we should organise things so the two keep sight of each other
until positive separation has been established?

Mike Borgelt