Bush flew fighter jets, but never over VIETNAM.

On Mon, 19 Jul 2004 11:19:17 +0000, WalterM140 wrote:

[snip]

Maybe he did, but no one has shown any reasonable proof of it.

Please to define "reasonable proof" in an unambigouous
way. It would help if the kind of proof you want was the
kind that ought ( in a standard procedural sense ) to exist.

IBM

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Subject: Bush flew fighter jets, but never over VIETNAM.
From: "ian maclure"
Date: 7/19/2004 10:20 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

On Mon, 19 Jul 2004 11:19:17 +0000, WalterM140 wrote:

[snip]

Maybe he did, but no one has shown any reasonable proof of it.

Please to define "reasonable proof" in an unambigouous
way. It would help if the kind of proof you want was the
kind that ought ( in a standard procedural sense ) to exist.

IBM


The word"reasonable" is in itself ambigious


Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

What little I know indcates that most pilots will do about anything to keep
flying and stay current in their aircraft.

The key word is *most*. There are pilots, and their actions I'll admit confound
me, that just want to be pilots because the Chief of Staff has always been a
pilot. I know several guys who got to a staff job as quick as they could and
only plan on returning to fly long enough to punch the squadron commander
ticket and then head back to staff. They're goals and desires are the exact
opposite of mine, but their service to this country is no less honarable than
anyone else.

This didn't seem to be a factor for
Bush.

Perhaps he wasn't interested in becoming an airline pilot or logging 5,000
hours. Unless your goal is one of those two, why would you attempt to keep
flying?


BUFDRVR

"Stay on the bomb run boys, I'm gonna get those bomb doors open if it harelips
everyone on Bear Creek"

(BUFDRVR) wrote:

Perhaps he wasn't interested in becoming an airline pilot or logging 5,000
hours. Unless your goal is one of those two, why would you attempt to keep
flying?

Answer: A pilot bud whom happens to be quite a bit older than me
used to fly the F-4S off carriers and now flies 767's for Delta says
that he can't wait to go off duty so that he can fly the light stuff
(he has a hangar chock full of cool light sport aircraft, including a
trike, or "kite").

He's still a bachelor, but hasn't slept with a nice looking stew since
the '80's. And since 9/11, he said that things just went from bad to
horrible. He still earns over $4000 per month, however, he may be
forced to retire early lest he lose 80-percent of his retirement
pension.

"Mike Marron" wrote

Answer: A pilot bud whom happens to be quite a bit older than me
used to fly the F-4S off carriers and now flies 767's for Delta says
that he can't wait to go off duty so that he can fly the light stuff
(he has a hangar chock full of cool light sport aircraft, including a
trike, or "kite").

A pilot bud of mine just retired, but when he got done with his rotation,
he spent all of his time working on his hot rods, and his rental properties
in several states. The only reason he kept flying was to retire, but he
said his last four years have been very hard, because he really can't
stand modern transports, as they put him to sleep. He didn't like a lot
of his crew mates, because they always smelled of alcohol, or had no
interest in flying except the high pay and the trophy-wife upkeep.

I asked him if he would ever try to land with a thunderstorm over the
runway like the American pilots in Little Rock, and he said he would
never have left Dallas, but 90% of his crew mates would probably
make the run, as they had no regard for the SLUG's in back (Self-
Loading Undesirable Goats).

He said that his USAF flying was very exciting, but civilian transports
was pretty much the pits. The difference is the military guys have a
mission outside of just flying. Moving aircraft to a battle, is much more
intense than moving aircraft to another hub. Plus there was additional
duties that were just as challenging, and the respect one had from the
troops. In the airline business, you're just another union ******* who
keeps the mob fresh in cash.

Mike Marron wrote:

Answer: A pilot bud whom happens to be quite a bit older than me
used to fly the F-4S off carriers and now flies 767's for Delta....

[....]

...still earns over $4000 per month....

That would be per _week_, MM.



Jack

Jack wrote:
Mike Marron wrote:

Answer: A pilot bud whom happens to be quite a bit older than me
used to fly the F-4S off carriers and now flies 767's for Delta....

...still earns over $4000 per month....

That would be per _week_, MM.

Nope, according to him it's only 4K per mo. But that's by choice since
it seems he's almost always off-duty playing with his toys and doing
other stuff. Don't get me wrong, he once showed me an offer in writing
that a real estate agent gave for one of his properties in Southern
California. No doubt the guy is a millionaire, but he deeply hates
his job as would I if I flew for the airlines in this day and age.
Moolah's nice, but it ain't everything.

On Tue, 20 Jul 2004 11:34:00 GMT, Mike Marron
wrote:

Jack wrote:
Mike Marron wrote:

Answer: A pilot bud whom happens to be quite a bit older than me
used to fly the F-4S off carriers and now flies 767's for Delta....

...still earns over $4000 per month....

That would be per _week_, MM.

Nope, according to him it's only 4K per mo. But that's by choice since
it seems he's almost always off-duty playing with his toys and doing
other stuff. Don't get me wrong, he once showed me an offer in writing
that a real estate agent gave for one of his properties in Southern
California. No doubt the guy is a millionaire, but he deeply hates
his job as would I if I flew for the airlines in this day and age.
Moolah's nice, but it ain't everything.

Sorry, Mike, but if your bud is telling the truth about flying 76's
for Delta, he's doing $4K/week not month. Not even the yesterday hire
FE on a Fokker is making as little as$48K/year.

Old F-105 bud of mine just retired (mandatory) last year from Delta
after flying 747-400s. I asked him how he was doing and he said he'd
been making $350-375K/yr, but he did weekend and holiday standby
reserve which paid double-time so he tweaked his annual up closer to
$450K.

If you can say "no doubt the guy is a millionaire" you probably gotta
recognize he didn't get there on $48K/yr.

Unless he's paying alimony to several trophies....

Ed Rasimus
Fighter Pilot (USAF-Ret)
"When Thunder Rolled"
Smithsonian Institution Press
ISBN #1-58834-103-8

Nope, according to him it's only 4K per mo. But that's by choice since
it seems he's almost always off-duty playing with his toys and doing
other stuff. Don't get me wrong, he once showed me an offer in writing
that a real estate agent gave for one of his properties in Southern
California. No doubt the guy is a millionaire, but he deeply hates
his job as would I if I flew for the airlines in this day and age.
Moolah's nice, but it ain't everything.


They have an hourly guarantee that is far far far above that. Maybe 14K per
month, but there
is not any Delta pilot who is currently flying for them making that little.




Ron
PA-31T Cheyenne II
Maharashtra Weather Modification Program
Pune, India

"Ed Rasimus" wrote:
On Tue, 20 Jul 2004 11:34:00 GMT, Mike Marron
wrote:

Jack wrote:
Mike Marron wrote:

Answer: A pilot bud whom happens to be quite a bit older than me
used to fly the F-4S off carriers and now flies 767's for Delta....

...still earns over $4000 per month....

That would be per _week_, MM.

Nope, according to him it's only 4K per mo. But that's by choice since
it seems he's almost always off-duty playing with his toys and doing
other stuff. Don't get me wrong, he once showed me an offer in writing
that a real estate agent gave for one of his properties in Southern
California. No doubt the guy is a millionaire, but he deeply hates
his job as would I if I flew for the airlines in this day and age.
Moolah's nice, but it ain't everything.

Sorry, Mike, but if your bud is telling the truth about flying 76's
for Delta, he's doing $4K/week not month. Not even the yesterday hire
FE on a Fokker is making as little as$48K/year.

Those flying for Delta Connection probably do.

Old F-105 bud of mine just retired (mandatory) last year from Delta
after flying 747-400s.

He wasn't flying for Delta if he was in 747-400's, Delta's equipment
includes 777's, 767-200/-300/-400, MD-11, 757-200 .... The top of the heap
at Delta should be on 777's and 767-300ER/-400ER's

I asked him how he was doing and he said he'd
been making $350-375K/yr, but he did weekend and holiday standby
reserve which paid double-time so he tweaked his annual up closer to
$450K.

If you can say "no doubt the guy is a millionaire" you probably gotta
recognize he didn't get there on $48K/yr.

Unless he's paying alimony to several trophies....

Ed Rasimus
Fighter Pilot (USAF-Ret)
"When Thunder Rolled"
Smithsonian Institution Press
ISBN #1-58834-103-8