Austin, TX

Hello cyber-friends:

I may be moving to the Austin, TX area in the near future and am looking for
information about the area. I've already looked up airport information at
AirNav.

Regarding this area, what is the general attitude toward GA? Are any of the
airports threatened to shut down due to neighbor complaints or development?
Do any of the airports have hangar space available? (I mean open now, not
the ten year waiting list scene.) Is there a big GA presence?

It looks like Houston is the closest class B airspace to Austin. I've heard
that Houston is GA unfriendly. True?

Also, any thing you guys can tell me about the area aviation or not aviation
related would be appreciated.

TIA.

"James Blakely" wrote:
It looks like Houston is the closest class B airspace to Austin.
I've heard
that Houston is GA unfriendly. True?

It can be a pain to get an IFR clearance out of any of the satellite
airports. Other than that, it's ok. Hobby Airport is very GA friendly,
for a busy Class B.

Also, any thing you guys can tell me about the area aviation or not
aviation
related would be appreciated.

If you like "live" music, you will love Austin.
--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

"James Blakely" wrote in
message ...
Hello cyber-friends:

I may be moving to the Austin, TX area in the near future and am looking
for
information about the area. I've already looked up airport information at
AirNav.

Regarding this area, what is the general attitude toward GA? Are any of
the
airports threatened to shut down due to neighbor complaints or
development?
Do any of the airports have hangar space available? (I mean open now, not
the ten year waiting list scene.) Is there a big GA presence?

I've been an ultralighter in the Austin area full-time since I lost my
medical 3 years ago so I'm not as up on the current situation with GA as I
was back then (I can tell you all about the attitude towards UL's - they're
hated more than fire ants and even crop dusters). But, as I recall, the
attitude was generally mixed. Most of the complaints centered around
airports near the city or its suburbs, such as Meuller (now R.I.P.) and
Austin Executive (now Dell Computer). The last major effort was, of course,
'relocating' Mueller to Bergstrom AFB, which is now ABIA (AUS).

Last I checked, what hangar space there was at AUS was prohibitively
expensive, and even tie-downs were costly and hard to come by. This may have
changed over the years, though.

So, if you're going to live in the city, like I do, you'll have to plan on
keeping your plane at a surrounding airport and doing a fair bit of driving.

Airports in the surrounding areas are actually far from being closed and are
even being renovated in some cases. Smithville airport (84R), for example,
has a nice new runway (although with a pair of huge, unfortunate ditches on
each side) and hangars are being planned. I fly out of Lockhart (50R), which
remains pretty busy and may have a hangar or two available (not sure about
that). San Marcos (HYI) is healthy and busy too. There's Georgetown airport
(GTU) to the north of the city, but it has been under the gun to be closed
or otherwise punished somehow by the surrounding community in the past. I'm
unsure about its present status but I imagine it's still going too, what
with the training operations that have been stationed there for some time.

So, GA is around but mostly in the surrounding areas. The hangar space
problem has eased a bit from the days when Executive and Meuller were closed
out from under, sending owners scurrying about trying to find places to keep
their planes.

You might check at the airports I mentioned to see if there's hangar space
(I can find out about 50R).

It looks like Houston is the closest class B airspace to Austin. I've
heard
that Houston is GA unfriendly. True?

I wouldn't go within 100NM of Houston in anything with a prop on it if I
didn't have to (I did do my IFR cross country to HOU though) . So I just
hang out over here in my trike .

Also, any thing you guys can tell me about the area aviation or not
aviation
related would be appreciated.

Again, I am more familiar with the ultralight scene than I am with GA. I can
tell you ultralights are the most hated things that fly through the air in
this area. I used to think I was a 2nd-class citizen when I flew Cessnas
after getting my private, but now that I fly UL's I realize I was treated
like Air Force One in that 150 I used to fly compared to how I'm treated
now. Anyway, just some interesting trivia for ya.....

LS

TIA.

James Blakely wrote:
It looks like Houston is the closest class B airspace to Austin. I've heard
that Houston is GA unfriendly. True?

Houston isn't particularly GA-unfriendly. We've got a lot of airports,
I've never had a problem with Houston approach, and the airspace isn't
particularly restrictive.

Tina Marie
(based at EYQ)

"James Blakely" wrote in
message ...

I may be moving to the Austin, TX area in the near future and am looking
for
information about the area. I've already looked up airport information at
AirNav.

Congratulations. You'll love it. My wife considers MLB purgatory after
living in Austin. I've been away for a few years, but here's what I
remember or have observed from afar.

Regarding this area, what is the general attitude toward GA? Are any of
the
airports threatened to shut down due to neighbor complaints or
development?
Do any of the airports have hangar space available? (I mean open now, not
the ten year waiting list scene.) Is there a big GA presence?

The city of Austin has no use for GA. They closed Mueller and moved to the
old Bergstrom AFB, chasing off 200+ planes based at Mueller with outrageous
rents. Austin executive was privately owned and Dell bought it up for the
land coincidentally within a few weeks of Mueller closing. So everyone was
scrambling off to neighboring towns. I believe Georgetown and San Marcos
got the most. Some went out to Taylor or even to Giddings. Georgetown has
some vocal opponents, but they've been expanding. San Marcos was nice.
Taylor didn't have much, but I hear they've been putting in a few
improvements.

AOPA has been pushing for a new GA airport. Got a bunch of Fed $ to do a
study. It's supposedly in work. I expect it will take years for anything
tangible to happen.

Also, any thing you guys can tell me about the area aviation or not
aviation
related would be appreciated.

First, traffic is a bitch. Two major N-S thoroughfares -- I-35 (IH-35 to
the locals) and Mopac. Always clogged. North of the river, US 183 is the
only E-W hwy and it's 10 miles north of downtown. So you're stuck on
surface streets.

Where you want to live depends on where you work. Generally, prices drop as
you move away from downtown and major business areas. Check the commute.
My 10 mile commute went from 15 min to 30 min in 3 years as traffic was
growing rapidly.

Lots to do. Start with www.austin360.com for info. And be sure to take the
wife to Central Market.

Gerry

Hi James,

I live in Austin, own 2 planes, and instruct part time. My planes are
based at Georgetown, KGTU, 30 miles north of downtown Austin.
I live northwest of the downtown area and it is about a 25 minute drive
to GTU from my house. There is a waiting list for hangars; it took me
about 2 years to get one. Prices recently increased and that caused a
number of people to move elsewhere (Temple, TX another 30 miles
north where the hagars are cheaper and more available) freeing up
some hangars at GTU. My hangar is one of the older and cheapest on
the field at $157 per month. The newest T-hangars there run $260 per
month. There are several larger hangars that rent space also, but the
cheapest is around $180 per month with the possible hassle of having
to move another airplane to get yours out. Tie downs are $35 to $40
per month.

GTU is a very active GA airport; 4 flight schools, corporate turbo-prop
and biz jets, a couple of 135 air taix operators, several maintenance
facilities, etc. Muni fuel sales are self-serve, now 24x7, used to close
at dark. Last 100LL I bought last weekend was $2.20 gal. One of the
FBOs also runs a truck based fueling service, but its more expensive. There
have been plans for the last couple of years for a control tower but it has
not happened yet. On Saturdays and Sundays, GTU pattern can get quite
busy with airplanes sitting in line to depart waiting for a break in the
traffic.

Neighbors to the north don't much like the airport. Typical situation.
The airport has been there since the early '40s, the neighbors less that 20
years, but with the increase in traffic that occurred over the last few
years with Austin Executive and Austin Mueller closing, they are now
complaining.
The City of Georgetown has slowed development plans at the airport to apease
the home owners. The fact that the annual air show had a crash into a house
2
years ago did not help the situation at all. In fact, the city pulled the
plug on the
airshow which had to move to Temple (KTPL) this year.

Here is a link for the various business at GTU:
http://www.georgetown.org/departments/airport/fbo.php

San Marcos airport (KHYI) is about 30 miles south of downtown Austin.
A little larger airport than GTU, with better approaches, but another WWII
training airport. I've never checked into the hangar situation there so
can't provide any info, other than there are quite a few GA airplanes and
hangars there along with a couple of FBOs. I do a lot of instrument
instruction there because of the ILS and non-towered field.

Austin Bergstrom (KAUS - the "big" airport) is quite GA friendly as well.
The two FBOs (Trajen and Signature) are located on the south side of the
field,
as are all GA hangars and facilities. Several flight schools are based
there,
as are a couple of maintenance operations. T-Hangars are the norm for small
piston driven GA aircraft. They are currently $260 or $270 per month and
there is a waiting list. Call Scott at Signature to get on the T-hangar
list. Fuel
is quite expense there - averaging $2.85 during the week and $2.65 on the
weekends if you are based there. I fly with several pilots who keep their
planes there, and I enjoy the services of the larger FBOs. Although both
FBOs cater to the biz jet crowd, they support piston driven GA quite well.
The T-hangars have a nice flight planning and rest room facility at the west
end of the middle row, so you don't even have to set foot in the FBOs if
you don't want to, but you'll miss out on the free popcorn, cookies, and
tea. There is a coffee maker and supplies in the T-hangar break area, so
at least you can still get free coffee!

Austin approach is very friendly and handles IFR ops at all the satellites
airports as well as at AUS. There are clearance delivery RCOs at GTU
and HYI, and when flying from the others, I usually pick up a clearance once
airborne with no problem.

Other options are Lago Vista, Rusty Allen Field, 5R3, northwest of downtown
Austin. If you live NW, it is not bad. It is a municiple runway with
private
hagar lots around it. You buy the lot (not a ground lease) and build your
own hangar. There are lots for sale now that range from $50K to $80K. Add
to
that the cost of the hangar. A friend of mine has about $150K invested in
his lot and hangar, but he has an 80' x 50' hangar that was build several
years
ago. The services on the field are minimum - self-serve fuel at $1.90 per
gallon and a couple of maintenance shops that don't keep regular hours.
There is no FBO or public facilities of any kind.

Burnet, TX (KBMQ) is a nice airport, but about an hour's drive NW of Austin.
Outside tie downs are free, there is an FBO with daylight hours with close
to the
cheapest fuel in the area, and maintenance. There are also covered parking
spaces
and some hangars. Last time I asked, there was a waiting list for the
hangars. When
I'm teaching take-off and landings, I go to Burnet. A nice runway, with
little to no
traffic.

Northeast of downtown Austin is Taylor Muni Airport. Shorter and narrower
runway, but a city run FBO with daylight hours. They built new T hangars
within the last couple of years and are still expanding; I was out there a
couple
of months ago and was told they have another batch of hangar planned for
next year.
The number to call to discuss hangars there is 512-352-5747. Self-serve
fuel is 24x7.
Also resurfaced the runway and built new taxiways earlier this year. What I
call a
friendly, down-home environment.

Another airport I use frequently is Spricewood, 88R. This is about 45 to
50 miles due west of downtown Austin. It is a private airport where hangar
lots are
purchased and the whole airport community maintains the runways. There are
still several vacant lots for sale there and existing hangar come up for
sale from
time to time. Several folks have larger hangars and rent space to
non-owners.
Self-serve fuel is less than $2.00 per gallon. The downside of that airport
is no
night time operations are allowed and there are no runway light or
instrument
approaches. Stricly a daytime only VFR kind of place. There is a mechanic
on the field.

There is also Lakeway, forgot the ID, but I never go in there. Also no
night ops, private lots around the runway, and higher priced real estate
around. Typical house and hangar combos there are $500K and up.
Too rich for me. Rumor has it that the Lakeway police will
issue a citation ($250?) if you land or takeoff after sunset, but before
dark.
They take their no nighttime ops rules seriously.

There are also several private airparks with grass strips around Austin.
Again, the property tends to be $200K and up for the nicer ones.

Hope this helps.

"James Blakely" wrote in
message ...
Hello cyber-friends:

I may be moving to the Austin, TX area in the near future and am looking
for
information about the area. I've already looked up airport information at
AirNav.

Regarding this area, what is the general attitude toward GA? Are any of
the
airports threatened to shut down due to neighbor complaints or
development?
Do any of the airports have hangar space available? (I mean open now, not
the ten year waiting list scene.) Is there a big GA presence?

It looks like Houston is the closest class B airspace to Austin. I've
heard
that Houston is GA unfriendly. True?

Also, any thing you guys can tell me about the area aviation or not
aviation
related would be appreciated.

TIA.

Last hangar I had at HYI was $450.
Years ago at Mueller I paid $350 for a T hangar.
Once I had the money together to buy Executive, but the blatantly corrupt
city government
wouldn't give us any building permits; Dell wanted the land.
In June a thunderstorm destroyed many hangars and airplanes at HYI,
including my Baron.
Austin, Texas sucks. They call themselves "city of ideas", more like "city
of idiots".
Georgetown is ludicrous. "The airport is encroaching on our homes".
imbeciles
The airport manager at San Marcos is committed to preventing growth.
lazy fool
The rest of Texas is just "Mississippi with good roads".
I do not live in Austin anymore.
H.
N502TB

And the traffic is terrible and only getting worse.


"Ronnie D. Hughes" wrote in message
. com...
Hi James,

I live in Austin, own 2 planes, and instruct part time. My planes are
based at Georgetown, KGTU, 30 miles north of downtown Austin.
I live northwest of the downtown area and it is about a 25 minute drive
to GTU from my house. There is a waiting list for hangars; it took me
about 2 years to get one. Prices recently increased and that caused a
number of people to move elsewhere (Temple, TX another 30 miles
north where the hagars are cheaper and more available) freeing up
some hangars at GTU. My hangar is one of the older and cheapest on
the field at $157 per month. The newest T-hangars there run $260 per
month. There are several larger hangars that rent space also, but the
cheapest is around $180 per month with the possible hassle of having
to move another airplane to get yours out. Tie downs are $35 to $40
per month.

GTU is a very active GA airport; 4 flight schools, corporate turbo-prop
and biz jets, a couple of 135 air taix operators, several maintenance
facilities, etc. Muni fuel sales are self-serve, now 24x7, used to close
at dark. Last 100LL I bought last weekend was $2.20 gal. One of the
FBOs also runs a truck based fueling service, but its more expensive.
There
have been plans for the last couple of years for a control tower but it
has
not happened yet. On Saturdays and Sundays, GTU pattern can get quite
busy with airplanes sitting in line to depart waiting for a break in the
traffic.

Neighbors to the north don't much like the airport. Typical situation.
The airport has been there since the early '40s, the neighbors less that
20
years, but with the increase in traffic that occurred over the last few
years with Austin Executive and Austin Mueller closing, they are now
complaining.
The City of Georgetown has slowed development plans at the airport to
apease
the home owners. The fact that the annual air show had a crash into a
house
2
years ago did not help the situation at all. In fact, the city pulled the
plug on the
airshow which had to move to Temple (KTPL) this year.

Here is a link for the various business at GTU:
http://www.georgetown.org/departments/airport/fbo.php

San Marcos airport (KHYI) is about 30 miles south of downtown Austin.
A little larger airport than GTU, with better approaches, but another WWII
training airport. I've never checked into the hangar situation there so
can't provide any info, other than there are quite a few GA airplanes and
hangars there along with a couple of FBOs. I do a lot of instrument
instruction there because of the ILS and non-towered field.

Austin Bergstrom (KAUS - the "big" airport) is quite GA friendly as well.
The two FBOs (Trajen and Signature) are located on the south side of the
field,
as are all GA hangars and facilities. Several flight schools are based
there,
as are a couple of maintenance operations. T-Hangars are the norm for
small
piston driven GA aircraft. They are currently $260 or $270 per month and
there is a waiting list. Call Scott at Signature to get on the T-hangar
list. Fuel
is quite expense there - averaging $2.85 during the week and $2.65 on the
weekends if you are based there. I fly with several pilots who keep their
planes there, and I enjoy the services of the larger FBOs. Although both
FBOs cater to the biz jet crowd, they support piston driven GA quite well.
The T-hangars have a nice flight planning and rest room facility at the
west
end of the middle row, so you don't even have to set foot in the FBOs if
you don't want to, but you'll miss out on the free popcorn, cookies, and
tea. There is a coffee maker and supplies in the T-hangar break area, so
at least you can still get free coffee!

Austin approach is very friendly and handles IFR ops at all the
satellites
airports as well as at AUS. There are clearance delivery RCOs at GTU
and HYI, and when flying from the others, I usually pick up a clearance
once
airborne with no problem.

Other options are Lago Vista, Rusty Allen Field, 5R3, northwest of
downtown
Austin. If you live NW, it is not bad. It is a municiple runway with
private
hagar lots around it. You buy the lot (not a ground lease) and build your
own hangar. There are lots for sale now that range from $50K to $80K.
Add
to
that the cost of the hangar. A friend of mine has about $150K invested in
his lot and hangar, but he has an 80' x 50' hangar that was build several
years
ago. The services on the field are minimum - self-serve fuel at $1.90 per
gallon and a couple of maintenance shops that don't keep regular hours.
There is no FBO or public facilities of any kind.

Burnet, TX (KBMQ) is a nice airport, but about an hour's drive NW of
Austin.
Outside tie downs are free, there is an FBO with daylight hours with close
to the
cheapest fuel in the area, and maintenance. There are also covered
parking
spaces
and some hangars. Last time I asked, there was a waiting list for the
hangars. When
I'm teaching take-off and landings, I go to Burnet. A nice runway, with
little to no
traffic.

Northeast of downtown Austin is Taylor Muni Airport. Shorter and narrower
runway, but a city run FBO with daylight hours. They built new T hangars
within the last couple of years and are still expanding; I was out there
a
couple
of months ago and was told they have another batch of hangar planned for
next year.
The number to call to discuss hangars there is 512-352-5747. Self-serve
fuel is 24x7.
Also resurfaced the runway and built new taxiways earlier this year. What
I
call a
friendly, down-home environment.

Another airport I use frequently is Spricewood, 88R. This is about 45 to
50 miles due west of downtown Austin. It is a private airport where
hangar
lots are
purchased and the whole airport community maintains the runways. There
are
still several vacant lots for sale there and existing hangar come up for
sale from
time to time. Several folks have larger hangars and rent space to
non-owners.
Self-serve fuel is less than $2.00 per gallon. The downside of that
airport
is no
night time operations are allowed and there are no runway light or
instrument
approaches. Stricly a daytime only VFR kind of place. There is a
mechanic
on the field.

There is also Lakeway, forgot the ID, but I never go in there. Also no
night ops, private lots around the runway, and higher priced real estate
around. Typical house and hangar combos there are $500K and up.
Too rich for me. Rumor has it that the Lakeway police will
issue a citation ($250?) if you land or takeoff after sunset, but before
dark.
They take their no nighttime ops rules seriously.

There are also several private airparks with grass strips around Austin.
Again, the property tends to be $200K and up for the nicer ones.

Hope this helps.

"James Blakely" wrote in
message
...
Hello cyber-friends:

I may be moving to the Austin, TX area in the near future and am looking
for
information about the area. I've already looked up airport information
at
AirNav.

Regarding this area, what is the general attitude toward GA? Are any of
the
airports threatened to shut down due to neighbor complaints or
development?
Do any of the airports have hangar space available? (I mean open now,
not
the ten year waiting list scene.) Is there a big GA presence?

It looks like Houston is the closest class B airspace to Austin. I've
heard
that Houston is GA unfriendly. True?

Also, any thing you guys can tell me about the area aviation or not
aviation
related would be appreciated.

TIA.

"Ronnie D. Hughes" wrote in
. com:
Austin Bergstrom (KAUS - the "big" airport) is quite GA friendly as
well. T-Hangars are the norm for
small piston driven GA aircraft. They are currently $260 or $270 per
month and there is a waiting list. Call Scott at Signature to get on
the T-hangar list.

Just a minor note here. Yes, the airport itself (controllers and FBO's)
are happy to have us. But the city considers us to be the scourge of
the universe. It took years to get the few hangars at AUS built (under
threat of court order), and another year (over every attempt by the
city) to be allowed to move into them.

Although there technically *is* a waiting list, Scott will tell you that
as far as anyone knows it will be a cold day in hell before any more are
built. I've been on the list for several years and there is an
estimated 20 to 25 years more wait before I may be able to move in. The
few people who have managed to move in have done so by "knowing
someone" who is moving out and simply sub-letting from them. Probably
illegal, but done all the time. Money talks.

As you have read on this thread, both Georgetown and San Marcos are nice
airports. The drive from central Austin is about 35 minutes to each at
2 in the morning. Can be a couple of hours if there is a wreck on the
freeway.

-----------------------------------------------
James M. Knox
TriSoft ph 512-385-0316
1109-A Shady Lane fax 512-366-4331
Austin, Tx 78721
-----------------------------------------------

On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 04:00:02 GMT, "Ronnie D. Hughes"
wrote:


There is also Lakeway, forgot the ID, but I never go in there. Also no
night ops, private lots around the runway, and higher priced real estate
around. Typical house and hangar combos there are $500K and up.
Too rich for me. Rumor has it that the Lakeway police will
issue a citation ($250?) if you land or takeoff after sunset, but before
dark.
They take their no nighttime ops rules seriously.

Lakeway is 3R9. I've been there a few times and they seem plenty
friendly to transient visitors. No hangar space but they'll lease you
outdoor tiedown space if you join the airport club and if there is
spaces available.

The no-night ops is pretty reasonable at this particular airport due
to the terrain and homes right next to, and at either end of the
runway. Fairly steep approaches are needed at either end of the runway
(no "dragging it in low and slow" here or someone will need a new roof
on their house) plus the large number of deer and other wildlife on
the runway could make it a rather dangerous place for night ops. I
nearly hit a deer on landing there myself.

Am I reading this right, Gerry? You lived in Austin and moved to Melbourne,
FL?

If so, that is very funny because I now live in Melbourne and may be moving
to Austin.

How does Melbourne compare to Austin? In my opinion, Melbourne should be
called Melboring. Anyplace has to be more exciting than Melbourne.

Do you have any compare and contrasts you can share with me?


"Gerry Caron" wrote in message
om...

"James Blakely" wrote in
message
...

I may be moving to the Austin, TX area in the near future and am looking
for
information about the area. I've already looked up airport information
at
AirNav.

Congratulations. You'll love it. My wife considers MLB purgatory after
living in Austin. I've been away for a few years, but here's what I
remember or have observed from afar.

Regarding this area, what is the general attitude toward GA? Are any of
the
airports threatened to shut down due to neighbor complaints or
development?
Do any of the airports have hangar space available? (I mean open now,
not
the ten year waiting list scene.) Is there a big GA presence?

The city of Austin has no use for GA. They closed Mueller and moved to
the
old Bergstrom AFB, chasing off 200+ planes based at Mueller with
outrageous
rents. Austin executive was privately owned and Dell bought it up for the
land coincidentally within a few weeks of Mueller closing. So everyone
was
scrambling off to neighboring towns. I believe Georgetown and San Marcos
got the most. Some went out to Taylor or even to Giddings. Georgetown
has
some vocal opponents, but they've been expanding. San Marcos was nice.
Taylor didn't have much, but I hear they've been putting in a few
improvements.

AOPA has been pushing for a new GA airport. Got a bunch of Fed $ to do a
study. It's supposedly in work. I expect it will take years for anything
tangible to happen.

Also, any thing you guys can tell me about the area aviation or not
aviation
related would be appreciated.

First, traffic is a bitch. Two major N-S thoroughfares -- I-35 (IH-35 to
the locals) and Mopac. Always clogged. North of the river, US 183 is the
only E-W hwy and it's 10 miles north of downtown. So you're stuck on
surface streets.

Where you want to live depends on where you work. Generally, prices drop
as
you move away from downtown and major business areas. Check the commute.
My 10 mile commute went from 15 min to 30 min in 3 years as traffic was
growing rapidly.

Lots to do. Start with www.austin360.com for info. And be sure to take
the
wife to Central Market.

Gerry