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FLARM releases firmware for ADS-R and TIS-B



 
 
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  #11  
Old January 14th 21, 08:22 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Andy Blackburn[_3_]
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Posts: 605
Default FLARM releases firmware for ADS-R and TIS-B

Moshe,

Only TIS-B has position uncertainty from the imprecision of SSR, which varies with the distance from the radar station. Both ADS-R and TIS-B have some position error from delay introduced by the reception-processing-rebroadcast sequence. ADS-B is not designed for close proximity collision warning - it's more a traffic separation tool - 5 miles and 1000 feet. I believe you can get ADS-R/TIS-B traffic alerts at, say, 1 mile, depending on on your display.

I have no problem with the small fee (a few tows) to compensate for the trouble and expense to deliver this US-only functionality. It's a significantly complex task to integrate these new target types - at less than a 10% upcharge on the core unit. Keep in mind that they had to do this from a country that doesn't have these services so all the testing and refinement of the code had to be done based on a remote unit installed at my house overlooking SFO followed by flight testing 7 time zones away with emailed flight logs and pilot reports - no direct hands-on. They didn't have to do it at all - the US is a small segment of the total global soaring market for Flarm. I'm glad they did. It works well.

If you get a Fusion it's all included. That might be the preferred choice if you don't like the feature unbundling.

Andy Blackburn
9B


On Wednesday, January 13, 2021 at 3:26:55 PM UTC-8, Moshe Braner wrote:
On 1/13/2021 3:53 PM, MNLou wrote:
I can't say that I'm happy that they choose to charge for this pretty important upgrade.

Lou

Right. It's just a software change, like other firmware updates. And
it enhances safety. Charging (149 euros) for activating the feature
means a lot of people will skip it, and ADS-R "targets" will remain
invisible. And those UAT "targets" are generally small airplanes who
share our altitudes. It's one thing to charge extra for non-safety
bonus features (such as IGC approved logging) and another to cut into
the basic collision avoidance purpose of the device.

Question: the lack of collision warnings due to low accuracy fix, does
that apply to ADS-R or only to TIS-B? You'd think the position of
airplanes transmitting GPS coordinates on UAT is precisely known, just
like those transmitting on 1090? Only airplanes whose position is only
derived from ground RADAR would be imprecise.

Ads
  #12  
Old January 14th 21, 03:12 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Urban Mäder
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Posts: 2
Default FLARM releases firmware for ADS-R and TIS-B

On Thursday, January 14, 2021 at 8:23:00 AM UTC+1, wrote:
Moshe,

Only TIS-B has position uncertainty from the imprecision of SSR, which varies with the distance from the radar station. Both ADS-R and TIS-B have some position error from delay introduced by the reception-processing-rebroadcast sequence. ADS-B is not designed for close proximity collision warning - it's more a traffic separation tool - 5 miles and 1000 feet. I believe you can get ADS-R/TIS-B traffic alerts at, say, 1 mile, depending on on your display.


Yes. We will try enabling traffic alerts for ADS-R, but I'm a bit reluctant since correctly detecting tow trains may be hard, given the (uncertain) time delay.

Honestly, the dual-ADS-B setup in the US - of which ADS-R/TIS-B is the consequence - is a surprisingly complex beast. We're thus happy to hear your feedback, preferably with IGC log files sent along to .

Thanks
- Urban
  #13  
Old January 14th 21, 05:14 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Richard Pfiffner[_2_]
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Posts: 289
Default FLARM releases firmware for ADS-R and TIS-B

On Thursday, January 14, 2021 at 6:12:27 AM UTC-8, Urban Mäder wrote:
On Thursday, January 14, 2021 at 8:23:00 AM UTC+1, wrote:
Moshe,

Only TIS-B has position uncertainty from the imprecision of SSR, which varies with the distance from the radar station. Both ADS-R and TIS-B have some position error from delay introduced by the reception-processing-rebroadcast sequence. ADS-B is not designed for close proximity collision warning - it's more a traffic separation tool - 5 miles and 1000 feet. I believe you can get ADS-R/TIS-B traffic alerts at, say, 1 mile, depending on on your display.

Yes. We will try enabling traffic alerts for ADS-R, but I'm a bit reluctant since correctly detecting tow trains may be hard, given the (uncertain) time delay.

Honestly, the dual-ADS-B setup in the US - of which ADS-R/TIS-B is the consequence - is a surprisingly complex beast. We're thus happy to hear your feedback, preferably with IGC log files sent along to .

Thanks
- Urban



The Benefit for upgrading to 7.03 is that the annual update is reset.

FLARM uses a rolling release cycle, requiring an annual update. Each update can be applied anytime during a rolling one-year period. This makes it easier to align FLARM firmware updates with the yearly aircraft maintenance. It is also in line with the maintenance care that a safety system requires.

The ADS-R and TIS-B reception is important to be able to receive aircraft that have UAT instead of 1090ES or that have no ADS-B Out at all.

You can purchase at:

http://www.craggyaero.com/powerflarm_core1.htm

Happy New Year

Richard
www.craggyaero.com


  #14  
Old January 14th 21, 07:00 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Cliff Hilty[_5_]
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Posts: 5
Default FLARM releases firmware for ADS-R and TIS-B

On Thursday, January 14, 2021 at 9:14:50 AM UTC-7, Richard Pfiffner wrote:
On Thursday, January 14, 2021 at 6:12:27 AM UTC-8, Urban Mäder wrote:
On Thursday, January 14, 2021 at 8:23:00 AM UTC+1, wrote:
Moshe,

Only TIS-B has position uncertainty from the imprecision of SSR, which varies with the distance from the radar station. Both ADS-R and TIS-B have some position error from delay introduced by the reception-processing-rebroadcast sequence. ADS-B is not designed for close proximity collision warning - it's more a traffic separation tool - 5 miles and 1000 feet. I believe you can get ADS-R/TIS-B traffic alerts at, say, 1 mile, depending on on your display.

Yes. We will try enabling traffic alerts for ADS-R, but I'm a bit reluctant since correctly detecting tow trains may be hard, given the (uncertain) time delay.

Honestly, the dual-ADS-B setup in the US - of which ADS-R/TIS-B is the consequence - is a surprisingly complex beast. We're thus happy to hear your feedback, preferably with IGC log files sent along to .

Thanks
- Urban

The Benefit for upgrading to 7.03 is that the annual update is reset.

FLARM uses a rolling release cycle, requiring an annual update. Each update can be applied anytime during a rolling one-year period. This makes it easier to align FLARM firmware updates with the yearly aircraft maintenance. It is also in line with the maintenance care that a safety system requires..

The ADS-R and TIS-B reception is important to be able to receive aircraft that have UAT instead of 1090ES or that have no ADS-B Out at all.

You can purchase at:

http://www.craggyaero.com/powerflarm_core1.htm

Happy New Year

Richard
www.craggyaero.com

So if I have a core and no ads out, do I still have to purchase to do the annual update?
  #15  
Old January 14th 21, 07:52 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Richard Pfiffner[_2_]
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Posts: 289
Default FLARM releases firmware for ADS-R and TIS-B

On Thursday, January 14, 2021 at 10:00:35 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Thursday, January 14, 2021 at 9:14:50 AM UTC-7, Richard Pfiffner wrote:
On Thursday, January 14, 2021 at 6:12:27 AM UTC-8, Urban Mäder wrote:
On Thursday, January 14, 2021 at 8:23:00 AM UTC+1, wrote:
Moshe,

Only TIS-B has position uncertainty from the imprecision of SSR, which varies with the distance from the radar station. Both ADS-R and TIS-B have some position error from delay introduced by the reception-processing-rebroadcast sequence. ADS-B is not designed for close proximity collision warning - it's more a traffic separation tool - 5 miles and 1000 feet. I believe you can get ADS-R/TIS-B traffic alerts at, say, 1 mile, depending on on your display.
Yes. We will try enabling traffic alerts for ADS-R, but I'm a bit reluctant since correctly detecting tow trains may be hard, given the (uncertain) time delay.

Honestly, the dual-ADS-B setup in the US - of which ADS-R/TIS-B is the consequence - is a surprisingly complex beast. We're thus happy to hear your feedback, preferably with IGC log files sent along to .

Thanks
- Urban

The Benefit for upgrading to 7.03 is that the annual update is reset.

FLARM uses a rolling release cycle, requiring an annual update. Each update can be applied anytime during a rolling one-year period. This makes it easier to align FLARM firmware updates with the yearly aircraft maintenance. It is also in line with the maintenance care that a safety system requires.

The ADS-R and TIS-B reception is important to be able to receive aircraft that have UAT instead of 1090ES or that have no ADS-B Out at all.

You can purchase at:

http://www.craggyaero.com/powerflarm_core1.htm

Happy New Year

Richard
www.craggyaero.com

So if I have a core and no ads out, do I still have to purchase to do the annual update?



No you don't have to purchase anything the firmware update is always free.

Yes get the update or your Flarm will not work after the 1 year update cycle. Update is free

Read the following information carefully to ensure that your device is always kept serviceable.

FLARM uses a rolling release cycle, requiring an annual update. Each update can be applied anytime during a rolling one-year period. This makes it easier to align FLARM firmware updates with the yearly aircraft maintenance. It is also in line with the maintenance care that a safety system requires.

As the update cycle is individual, no generic information is sent out on individual firmware expiration dates.

Sign up now for our Newsletter to be informed when new and important firmware is released. You can do this in the Newsletter box at the bottom of the sidebar to the right. After clicking on the link in the email that you will receive, you will also receive information about other upcoming releases introducing additional features.


Richard
www.craggyaero.com
  #16  
Old January 14th 21, 07:54 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Darryl Ramm
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Posts: 2,389
Default FLARM releases firmware for ADS-R and TIS-B

On Thursday, January 14, 2021 at 10:00:35 AM UTC-8, Cliff Hilty wrote:
/snip/
So if I have a core and no ads out, do I still have to purchase to do the annual update?


No. You purchase the option if you want it.
  #17  
Old January 14th 21, 08:48 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Dgtarmichael
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5
Default FLARM releases firmware for ADS-R and TIS-B

On Thursday, January 14, 2021 at 12:54:50 PM UTC-6, Darryl Ramm wrote:
On Thursday, January 14, 2021 at 10:00:35 AM UTC-8, Cliff Hilty wrote:
/snip/
So if I have a core and no ads out, do I still have to purchase to do the annual update?

No. You purchase the option if you want it.



If I dont have ADS-B out will this firmware upgrade do anything for me? I'm on the waiting list for a Fusion so I'm getting it anyway.
  #18  
Old January 15th 21, 01:24 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Ramy[_2_]
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Posts: 557
Default FLARM releases firmware for ADS-R and TIS-B

I’ve been flying with the beta version for several month and it works very well. This is also an opportunity to save by buying the powerflarm fusion in the discounted price of about $1500 which includes all licenses and save on the $160 license fee, then sell your old core when the price goes up.

On Wednesday, January 13, 2021 at 9:34:59 AM UTC-8, wrote:
Hi All - FLARM has announced release of firmware supporting ADS-R and
TIS-B reception. This feature is included in new firmware for Core
Fusion. For original PowerFLARM core and portable, this requires a
license available he
https://flarm.com/shop/ads-r-and-tis-b-reception-adsr/

Firmware is available he
https://flarm.com/support/firmware-u...nload-firmware.

Additional info about this feature he
https://flarm.com/products/product-add-ons/ads-r-tis-b.

Enjoy!
Best Regards, Dave

  #19  
Old January 15th 21, 04:25 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Bruce
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Posts: 26
Default FLARM releases firmware for ADS-R and TIS-B

On Thursday, January 14, 2021 at 5:24:35 PM UTC-7, Ramy wrote:
I’ve been flying with the beta version for several month and it works very well. This is also an opportunity to save by buying the powerflarm fusion in the discounted price of about $1500 which includes all licenses and save on the $160 license fee, then sell your old core when the price goes up.
On Wednesday, January 13, 2021 at 9:34:59 AM UTC-8, wrote:
Hi All - FLARM has announced release of firmware supporting ADS-R and
TIS-B reception. This feature is included in new firmware for Core
Fusion. For original PowerFLARM core and portable, this requires a
license available he
https://flarm.com/shop/ads-r-and-tis-b-reception-adsr/

Firmware is available he
https://flarm.com/support/firmware-u...nload-firmware.

Additional info about this feature he
https://flarm.com/products/product-add-ons/ads-r-tis-b.

Enjoy!




The new Powerflarm Fusion has wifi and blue tooth to feed ForeFlight etc. Does it feed the ADS-B weather info and notams etc to the Electronic Flight Bag systems?

Bruce

  #20  
Old January 15th 21, 06:47 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Darryl Ramm
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Posts: 2,389
Default FLARM releases firmware for ADS-R and TIS-B

On Friday, January 15, 2021 at 7:25:24 AM UTC-8, Bruce wrote:
/s/
The new Powerflarm Fusion has wifi and blue tooth to feed ForeFlight etc. Does it feed the ADS-B weather info and notams etc to the Electronic Flight Bag systems?

Bruce


No. It has no way of doing this, FIS-B data is transmitted over UAT. PowerFLARM devices, (original ones with the "ADS-B option",--which all in the USA should have been purchased with, or the new PowerFLARM Fusion) receive ADS-B In on 1090ES In only. If they had UAT In capability we would not be having this whole announcement about ADS-R support. But just getting FIS-B is easy--you just need a separate UAT or better dual-link ADS-B receiver driving Foreflight, no need for the glider to be equipped with ADS-B to be a "client", that data is just broadcast in the blind as long as you have line of sight/range to towers (for wider area forecasts if you want that you may need line of sight to more distant towers, can be worth reading up on how FIS-B forecast data is transmitted if you plan to use this).

But the big question is did you want that Foreflight system to also display traffic data? Foreflight system driven by a dual-link ADS-B receiver will not display any FLARM only equipped traffic and won't provide FLARM style traffic alerts for any type of Traffic it can see. And without suitable ADS-B Out neither system will reliably display TIS-B traffic. What is the best choice here depends on what traffic threats are of most concern, and if the glider is ADS-B Out equipped, etc. and I sure worry that too many things displaying different data and beeping away in a cockpit is not a good idea.... or if folks do that they really understand what is going on and how to use the different systems.

PowerFLARM Fusion is a nice improvement over existing PowerFLARM units, including for use in the USA. In Europe and the rest of the world it does provide real "Fusion" between FLARM, ADS-B and different display devices but in the USA, with our overly complex ADS-B system not used anywhere else in the world the story is as usual more complicated. Here in the USA "Fusion" does not cover all of ADS-B capabilities (no UAT-In Direct, and no FIS-B) but it's included support for ADS-R and TIS-B is a good step forward.


 




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