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inverted Schweizer towhook



 
 
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  #1  
Old July 22nd 20, 08:51 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
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Default inverted Schweizer towhook

Does anyone use, or have a field approval for, the inverted Schweizer towhook Pawnee installation described in Soaring May 1996 pages 7-8? Here is a direct link to that article https://www.dropbox.com/s/bsp9r0oj2n...hooks.doc?dl=0

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  #2  
Old July 22nd 20, 09:55 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Charles Longley
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Default inverted Schweizer towhook

No field approval needed. Just a moderately competent A&P/IA. AC43.13-2B chapter 8 addresses tow hitch installation-
https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/...2043.13-2B.pdf
  #3  
Old July 28th 20, 02:59 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default inverted Schweizer towhook

On Wednesday, July 22, 2020 at 1:55:54 PM UTC-7, Charles Longley wrote:
No field approval needed. Just a moderately competent A&P/IA. AC43.13-2B chapter 8 addresses tow hitch installation-
https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/...043.13-2B..pdf




Charles, thanks for your reply. But I'm informed that the original article quoted in the first post is correct in stating that a 337 and possibly a field approval would be needed. I'm told that Part 43 has approved data for installing tow hooks on aircraft and this modification does not conform to that data.
  #4  
Old July 28th 20, 02:53 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Charles Longley
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Default inverted Schweizer towhook

Sorry I wasn’t clear. A FAA form 337 is required. A field approval is not required.
I live near Seattle if anyone needs a hook installed.
  #5  
Old July 29th 20, 02:22 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Charles Longley
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Default inverted Schweizer towhook

By the way why would you install a Schweizer hook when that Tost hook is a better, safer product?
  #6  
Old July 29th 20, 02:53 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default inverted Schweizer towhook

On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 6:22:48 PM UTC-7, Charles Longley wrote:
By the way why would you install a Schweizer hook when that Tost hook is a better, safer product?


Charles, my club has two pawnees, each with (non inverted) Schweizer towhooks. The proposal being considered is that we invert these existing hooks, since that cost seems much lower than buying two Tost hooks (listed at at about $2,500 each). If cost was no issue, I would prefer to instal two Tost hooks personally. The reason for inverting the Schweizer hooks is to hopefully eliminate the possibility that these hooks fail to release in a kiting incident.
  #7  
Old July 29th 20, 03:21 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Charles Longley
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Default inverted Schweizer towhook

What’s a life worth?
  #8  
Old July 29th 20, 05:27 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default inverted Schweizer towhook

On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 9:53:55 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 6:22:48 PM UTC-7, Charles Longley wrote:
By the way why would you install a Schweizer hook when that Tost hook is a better, safer product?


Charles, my club has two pawnees, each with (non inverted) Schweizer towhooks. The proposal being considered is that we invert these existing hooks, since that cost seems much lower than buying two Tost hooks (listed at at about $2,500 each). If cost was no issue, I would prefer to instal two Tost hooks personally. The reason for inverting the Schweizer hooks is to hopefully eliminate the possibility that these hooks fail to release in a kiting incident.


The inversion of the Schweizer hook is the least that should be done but I agree with Mr Longley, the Tost hook is a better safer product. While you are at it why not insure that the release handle is available to the tow pilot while in the upright, seated position? I can tell you from experience that when you are in a sudden kiting situation, reaching for the handle down on the floor isn't easy. Towing is dangerous as we all know, everything that can be done SHOULD be done to give the tow pilot a fighting chance to stay alive.

What I find most telling is that the last two kiting incidents resulting in the death of the tow pilot had INSTRUCTORS at the controls of the glider. INSTRUCTORS!!! How can you expect a 15 year old kid with her head up her ass to respond correctly when INSTRUCTORS can't seem to do so?

Invert the hook or better yet, spend the money for the Tost system and bring the release handle up where the tow pilot will have a fighting chance when incompetence and lack of attention raises its ugly head. ANYTHING less and you are not serious about safety.

Walt Connelly
Former Tow PIlot
Now Happy Helicopter Pilot
  #9  
Old July 29th 20, 05:55 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
2G
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Posts: 1,439
Default inverted Schweizer towhook

On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 9:28:02 PM UTC-7, wrote:
On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 9:53:55 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 6:22:48 PM UTC-7, Charles Longley wrote:
By the way why would you install a Schweizer hook when that Tost hook is a better, safer product?


Charles, my club has two pawnees, each with (non inverted) Schweizer towhooks. The proposal being considered is that we invert these existing hooks, since that cost seems much lower than buying two Tost hooks (listed at at about $2,500 each). If cost was no issue, I would prefer to instal two Tost hooks personally. The reason for inverting the Schweizer hooks is to hopefully eliminate the possibility that these hooks fail to release in a kiting incident.


The inversion of the Schweizer hook is the least that should be done but I agree with Mr Longley, the Tost hook is a better safer product. While you are at it why not insure that the release handle is available to the tow pilot while in the upright, seated position? I can tell you from experience that when you are in a sudden kiting situation, reaching for the handle down on the floor isn't easy. Towing is dangerous as we all know, everything that can be done SHOULD be done to give the tow pilot a fighting chance to stay alive.

What I find most telling is that the last two kiting incidents resulting in the death of the tow pilot had INSTRUCTORS at the controls of the glider.. INSTRUCTORS!!! How can you expect a 15 year old kid with her head up her ass to respond correctly when INSTRUCTORS can't seem to do so?

Invert the hook or better yet, spend the money for the Tost system and bring the release handle up where the tow pilot will have a fighting chance when incompetence and lack of attention raises its ugly head. ANYTHING less and you are not serious about safety.

Walt Connelly
Former Tow PIlot
Now Happy Helicopter Pilot


The last fatal accident proved conclusively that even if you have the ideal release system (in that case a guillotine that severed the rope) you cannot guarantee that the tow pilot will be saved. You need a KGARS.

Tom
  #10  
Old July 29th 20, 01:45 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Scott Williams[_2_]
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Posts: 83
Default inverted Schweizer towhook

On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 11:55:38 PM UTC-5, 2G wrote:
On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 9:28:02 PM UTC-7, wrote:
On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 9:53:55 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 6:22:48 PM UTC-7, Charles Longley wrote:
By the way why would you install a Schweizer hook when that Tost hook is a better, safer product?

Charles, my club has two pawnees, each with (non inverted) Schweizer towhooks. The proposal being considered is that we invert these existing hooks, since that cost seems much lower than buying two Tost hooks (listed at at about $2,500 each). If cost was no issue, I would prefer to instal two Tost hooks personally. The reason for inverting the Schweizer hooks is to hopefully eliminate the possibility that these hooks fail to release in a kiting incident.


The inversion of the Schweizer hook is the least that should be done but I agree with Mr Longley, the Tost hook is a better safer product. While you are at it why not insure that the release handle is available to the tow pilot while in the upright, seated position? I can tell you from experience that when you are in a sudden kiting situation, reaching for the handle down on the floor isn't easy. Towing is dangerous as we all know, everything that can be done SHOULD be done to give the tow pilot a fighting chance to stay alive.

What I find most telling is that the last two kiting incidents resulting in the death of the tow pilot had INSTRUCTORS at the controls of the glider. INSTRUCTORS!!! How can you expect a 15 year old kid with her head up her ass to respond correctly when INSTRUCTORS can't seem to do so?

Invert the hook or better yet, spend the money for the Tost system and bring the release handle up where the tow pilot will have a fighting chance when incompetence and lack of attention raises its ugly head. ANYTHING less and you are not serious about safety.

Walt Connelly
Former Tow PIlot
Now Happy Helicopter Pilot


The last fatal accident proved conclusively that even if you have the ideal release system (in that case a guillotine that severed the rope) you cannot guarantee that the tow pilot will be saved. You need a KGARS.

Tom


Sadly, No TSO approved, available, reliable, effective and affordable KGARS
Exist.
Scott
 




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