Merry Christmas to Everyone

wrote in message
...
On Sun, 26 Dec 2004 23:35:58 -0800, "C J Campbell"
wrote:


wrote in message
.. .

However, when all the Airedale worshippers on the town council decide
to put a replica of the Holy Airedale on the town green, they've
crossed the line, as far as I'm concerned. I have a feeling a good
number of christians would feel the same, and insist the Holy Airedale
be removed.

Ah yes. The old "I am intolerant because I think they might be as
intolerant
as I am" argument.



It's not a question of "tolerance" or "intolerance".

It's a matter of governent's expressed preferance for a particular
religion, and the Ayatollahs that are bound to eventually emerge when
it does, whether Airedale Ayatollahs, Muslim Ayatollahs, or Christian
Ayatollahs, it don't much matter. They all have the same agenda.

But since you mention it, you make a good point. Christians have
indeed exhibited a level of intolerance over the centuries that many
other religions find hard to match.

So have atheists.

"Jon Kraus" wrote in message
...
Everything I said is true and I stand by my statements. And yes Kwanza's
celebrants DID claim it was an African holiday.

Uh, *who* supposedly said that, when and where? The Kwanzaa web sites I find
say prominently that Kwanzaa is an African-American holiday founded in 1966
by Dr. Maulana Karenga, drawing in part on some African traditions (e.g.
http://www.tike.com/celeb-kw.htm).

That is the bull**** part.

No, it was the term "African American" that you called bull**** ("I don't
believe in the 'African-American' bull****. 99% of black folks have never
set foot in Africa... they are just plain old Americans like me... an
American not a German-American").

According to you, people are apparently supposed to designate themselves by
their nationality but not their ancestry. I fully respect *your* choice to
do so, but you have been unwilling or unable to explain why you object to
others choosing differently.

If you are insulted by my opinion then too ****ing bad. :-) We can agree
to disgree.

If you were confident that your position has merit, you could first make a
good-faith effort to reach agreement, or at least mutual understanding. To
do that, you would have to supply evidence for your claims (not merely keep
repeating them), and attempt to answer the questions I posed.

Instead, you practice a hit-and-run approach: you disparage others' words or
practices as "phony" and "bull****"; then, when questioned, you refuse to
discuss your opinions except to say "too ****ing bad".

Of course you have a right to behave that way, but others have a right to
respond by criticizing your behavior for what it is. That's how free speech
works--it doesn't mean freedom from criticism.

--Gary

Jon Kraus
PP-ASEL-IA
Student Mooney Owner

Gary Drescher wrote:
"Jon Kraus" wrote in message
...

I wouldn't call it a "tirade" at all, you did.


Uh, Jon, no one characterizes their own words as a tirade. But Pete's
characterization is accurate. You disparaged Kwanza as "made-up" (as
though any holiday could be other than made-up) and "phony" (because it's
not a native African celebration--even though its celebrants never
claimed it was!).


I don't believe in the "African-American"
bull****. 99% of black folks have never set foot in Africa and have long
been remove from relatives that are from Africa.


The term "African American" refers to black Americans of African
ancestry. It does not mean "people who have visited Africa, or who speak
to their relatives in Africa", contrary to your peculiar objection.

As with the holiday Kwanza, you take the term "African American" and
misrepresent its meaning in order to make it seem illegitimate. What
motivates you to do so?


Jon Kraus (an American not a German-American)


For many Xs, there are some Americans who prefer to call themselves X
Americans, some who prefer to call themselves Americans, and some who
prefer neither. Why is that difference so hard for you to understand or
respect? Why is it "bull****" for someone's preference to differ from
yours in that regard? Why do you feel the need to insult people for
making a different choice than you as to whether to put their ancestry on
a par with their nationality in their self-description?

--Gary

Gentlemen, gentlemen!

This thread, now about 100 posts long, is cross posted to 4 different
newsgroups, and is clearly off topic in all the groups it is posted to.
Could we just leave it alone, or at least take the discussion to a group
where it is on topic?

I expect that C J Campbell, who was just trying to be nice to y'all, is
ready to withdraw the kind wishes he sent at this point.

Now, let's talk about airplanes...
-Bob Korves
(sorry for cross posting this message)

"C J Campbell" wrote in message
news
May God bless you and yours throughout the coming year.

--
Christopher J. Campbell
World Famous Flight Instructor
Port Orchard, WA


Ne Obliviscaris

"C J Campbell" wrote in message
...
But since you mention it, you make a good point. Christians have
indeed exhibited a level of intolerance over the centuries that many
other religions find hard to match.

So have atheists.

That's true (the USSR, China, etc.). Empires with immense, unchecked power
are inevitably dangerous, regardless of whose creed is nominally in charge.

--Gary

"Gary Drescher" wrote in message
news
"C J Campbell" wrote in message
...
But since you mention it, you make a good point. Christians have
indeed exhibited a level of intolerance over the centuries that many
other religions find hard to match.

So have atheists.

That's true (the USSR, China, etc.). Empires with immense, unchecked power
are inevitably dangerous, regardless of whose creed is nominally in
charge.

--Gary


Or lack of creed...unless you buy into the theory of Government as GodHead.

Jay Beckman
PP-ASEL
Chandler, AZ

"Jay Beckman" wrote in message
news:C_1Ad.4687$yW5.4261@fed1read02...

"Gary Drescher" wrote in message
news
"C J Campbell" wrote in message
...
But since you mention it, you make a good point. Christians have
indeed exhibited a level of intolerance over the centuries that many
other religions find hard to match.

So have atheists.

That's true (the USSR, China, etc.). Empires with immense, unchecked
power are inevitably dangerous, regardless of whose creed is nominally in
charge.

--Gary


Or lack of creed...unless you buy into the theory of Government as
GodHead.

"Creed" can refer to non-religious beliefs as well.

--Gary


Jay Beckman
PP-ASEL
Chandler, AZ

"Gary Drescher" wrote in message
...
"Jay Beckman" wrote in message
news:C_1Ad.4687$yW5.4261@fed1read02...

"Gary Drescher" wrote in message
news
"C J Campbell" wrote in message
...
But since you mention it, you make a good point. Christians have
indeed exhibited a level of intolerance over the centuries that many
other religions find hard to match.

So have atheists.

That's true (the USSR, China, etc.). Empires with immense, unchecked
power are inevitably dangerous, regardless of whose creed is nominally
in charge.

--Gary


Or lack of creed...unless you buy into the theory of Government as
GodHead.

"Creed" can refer to non-religious beliefs as well.

--Gary


True, true...

Jay B

john smith wrote:

You have to be a Druid.

and be washed in the blood of a tree.

George Patterson
The desire for safety stands against every great and noble enterprise.

"Bob Korves" bkorves@winfirstDECIMALcom wrote in message
...
Gentlemen, gentlemen!

This thread, now about 100 posts long, is cross posted to 4 different
newsgroups, and is clearly off topic in all the groups it is posted to.
Could we just leave it alone, or at least take the discussion to a group
where it is on topic?

I expect that C J Campbell, who was just trying to be nice to y'all, is
ready to withdraw the kind wishes he sent at this point.

Now, let's talk about airplanes...
-Bob Korves
(sorry for cross posting this message)

I was thinking that.

wrote in message
...
It seems to be "christian" to do whatever suits a "christian's" mood
and inclination at the time, and then create some convenient aphorism
to authorize and validate it.

That's like saying "it seems to be 'black' to go around shooting people and
dealing drugs".

Your stereotype of Christians is way off the mark, even if it does describe
many Christians accurately.

Pete