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To the guy writing the heli lesson diary:



 
 
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  #1  
Old September 7th 04, 07:20 AM
helicopterandy
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default To the guy writing the heli lesson diary:

I don't post here often but I have read w/ interest your diary of
flight lessons. A few questions if you don't mind:
Why are you cooling down an R22 ( I assume from your threads that is
what you're flying) for five minutes before you disengage the clutch?
R22 checklists state a 2 minute cooldown before clutch disengage. The
factory says it doesn't need even 2 minutes if you get substantial
cylinder head temp reduction in less time. I cannot imagine a flight
school allowing for one second more cooldown than is required by the
factory. Unless you are paying for time on the skids, instead of
collective time. If so, if you are paying for total Hobbs time, they
may be screwing you, check it out. No R22 needs a five minute cooldown
before clutch release. Just two minutes for coolodown, then release
clutch for thirty seconds, then get mixture guard off and pull mixture
out. Call Robinson Helicopters yourself and check it out. You may be
asked for that additional cooldown time simply to run up your tab if
you are paying for Hobbs time.
Also, in one of your posts you state that after bringing the ship to a
hover after an approach you had a wind gust that pushed the ship into
a right yaw that was so extreme you had to add FULL left pedal to stop
it. I've flown R22s for a while and I have NEVER approached the need
for full left pedal. Ever. The R22 has very good tail rotor
characteristics as opposed to some of the Bell's and others that can
get you in trouble quickly with their less than ideal tail rotor
designs that allow tail rotor vortices to form quickly in the wrong
wind conditions, so I find it incredible that you got the ship so
twisted that it was necessary for you to bottom the left pedal to get
the ship back in trim.
And that your CFI never took over??!!!!!! Maybe you just thought you
used all left pedal? If not, get your ship checked out pronto, though
I seriously doubt that you used all left pedal as you stated. Your CFI
would have been on the controls very fast had this actually been the
case or either he's wanting to get a new ship!
You also mention "shimmy and shaking" all the way down during an
approach. Are you getting into a settling w/ power situation? If you
are experiencing violent shaking let me assure you this isn't normal.
A little vibration for sure, but nothing like you are describing, or
is this again a bit of exageration on your part? Not trying to provoke
you here, as I have been there myself (learning to fly helis) and it
can be VERY tense at times. It's just that this Google Rotorcraft
forum seems to be frequented by mainly remote control helicopter
enthusists and the Rotorway/Safari/experimental deathwish crowd that
have very limited knowledge about flying and I would really want to
make ceratin that a novice flyer like yourself will give an accurate
account here so as not to confuse all the other readers here who have
not became heli pilots.
Please understand I'm not trying to ridicule or be derisive of your
descriptions, I've been right where you are and I know the feelings
very well. I'd just like to urge you to write a diary with less
adjectives and bluster than what you are sometimes doing now. You are
(inadvertatntly I'm sure)making it sound as if some of your flights
are more akin to "The Right Stuff" movie footage than true flight
training, especially the "full left pedal" and "shaking" stuff. Either
that or your instructor needs to do a better job of instructing as I
can assure you this is not the way it's done.
Regards,
Mark
N26394
  #2  
Old September 7th 04, 04:45 PM
helicopterandy
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

(helicopterandy) wrote in message . com...
I don't post here often but I have read w/ interest your diary of
flight lessons. A few questions if you don't mind:
Why are you cooling down an R22 ( I assume from your threads that is
what you're flying) for five minutes before you disengage the clutch?
R22 checklists state a 2 minute cooldown before clutch disengage. The
factory says it doesn't need even 2 minutes if you get substantial
cylinder head temp reduction in less time. I cannot imagine a flight
school allowing for one second more cooldown than is required by the
factory. Unless you are paying for time on the skids, instead of
collective time. If so, if you are paying for total Hobbs time, they
may be screwing you, check it out. No R22 needs a five minute cooldown
before clutch release. Just two minutes for coolodown, then release
clutch for thirty seconds, then get mixture guard off and pull mixture
out. Call Robinson Helicopters yourself and check it out. You may be
asked for that additional cooldown time simply to run up your tab if
you are paying for Hobbs time.
Also, in one of your posts you state that after bringing the ship to a
hover after an approach you had a wind gust that pushed the ship into
a right yaw that was so extreme you had to add FULL left pedal to stop
it. I've flown R22s for a while and I have NEVER approached the need
for full left pedal. Ever. The R22 has very good tail rotor
characteristics as opposed to some of the Bell's and others that can
get you in trouble quickly with their less than ideal tail rotor
designs that allow tail rotor vortices to form quickly in the wrong
wind conditions, so I find it incredible that you got the ship so
twisted that it was necessary for you to bottom the left pedal to get
the ship back in trim.
And that your CFI never took over??!!!!!! Maybe you just thought you
used all left pedal? If not, get your ship checked out pronto, though
I seriously doubt that you used all left pedal as you stated. Your CFI
would have been on the controls very fast had this actually been the
case or either he's wanting to get a new ship!
You also mention "shimmy and shaking" all the way down during an
approach. Are you getting into a settling w/ power situation? If you
are experiencing violent shaking let me assure you this isn't normal.
A little vibration for sure, but nothing like you are describing, or
is this again a bit of exageration on your part? Not trying to provoke
you here, as I have been there myself (learning to fly helis) and it
can be VERY tense at times. It's just that this Google Rotorcraft
forum seems to be frequented by mainly remote control helicopter
enthusists and the Rotorway/Safari/experimental deathwish crowd that
have very limited knowledge about flying and I would really want to
make ceratin that a novice flyer like yourself will give an accurate
account here so as not to confuse all the other readers here who have
not became heli pilots.
Please understand I'm not trying to ridicule or be derisive of your
descriptions, I've been right where you are and I know the feelings
very well. I'd just like to urge you to write a diary with less
adjectives and bluster than what you are sometimes doing now. You are
(inadvertatntly I'm sure)making it sound as if some of your flights
are more akin to "The Right Stuff" movie footage than true flight
training, especially the "full left pedal" and "shaking" stuff. Either
that or your instructor needs to do a better job of instructing as I
can assure you this is not the way it's done.
Regards,
Mark
N26394

PS
Take a look at the "RobinsonR22helicopters" forum on Yahoo Groups for
a bit more educational forum.
Regards,
Mark
  #3  
Old September 7th 04, 07:30 PM
Steve R.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Hi Kevin,

"The OTHER Kevin in San Diego" skiddz *AT* adelphia *DOT* net wrote in
message ...
On 6 Sep 2004 23:20:19 -0700, (helicopterandy)
wrote:


A little vibration for sure, but nothing like you are describing, or
is this again a bit of exageration on your part? Not trying to provoke
you here, as I have been there myself (learning to fly helis) and it
can be VERY tense at times. It's just that this Google Rotorcraft
forum seems to be frequented by mainly remote control helicopter
enthusists and the Rotorway/Safari/experimental deathwish crowd that
have very limited knowledge about flying and I would really want to
make ceratin that a novice flyer like yourself will give an accurate
account here so as not to confuse all the other readers here who have
not became heli pilots.


My postings are anectdotal only. They are for entertainment PERIOD.
If anyone is assuming this is part of some freebie flight training,
they need to look into another hobby/profession.

Please understand I'm not trying to ridicule or be derisive of your
descriptions, I've been right where you are and I know the feelings
very well. I'd just like to urge you to write a diary with less
adjectives and bluster than what you are sometimes doing now. You are
(inadvertatntly I'm sure)making it sound as if some of your flights
are more akin to "The Right Stuff" movie footage than true flight
training, especially the "full left pedal" and "shaking" stuff. Either
that or your instructor needs to do a better job of instructing as I
can assure you this is not the way it's done.


Since I'm not a professional writer and am not trying to write a
column for any aviation related magazine or fill out the pages of some
training manual, I'll continue to write what I'm feeling. If you
choose to assume "shaking" is "violent" and "full left pedal" really
isn't (funny, I don't remember seeing you in the cockpit next to me)
that's fine. I don't take offense at what you're saying and I do see
your point. However, since (again) these posts are anecdotal in
nature, I don't see the need to accurately document each and every
control movement and its associated effect on the helicopter.


I don't know who this guy is but please don't take him too seriously. Your
stories have been great. Please keep em coming!

I've met a few rotorcraft rated pilots (of the full size and FAA certified
variety) with 8k, 10k, 20k, etc. hours under their belts that weren't as
sharp on some issues as they like to think they were. I'm not saying that
they are not competent pilots. Just that, with all their time, they
sometimes start thinking they can do no wrong. It's not uncommon amoung
pilot types for any kind of aircraft.

Yes, there are more than a few RC pilots that lurk around here. So what.
The high time, full size pilots really shouldn't "assume" that we're all
totally ignorant about helicopters and their dynamics just because we don't
sit in the thing. I've done a LOT of studying with regards to helicopter
dynamics through the years in an attempt to better understand why my model
did what it did the other day. I'm not claiming to be an expert by any
stretch of the imagination but I think I've got certain basics down pretty
solidly. :-)

Perhaps my "bluster" will make the "Rotorway/Safari/experimental
deathwish crowd" (Talk about derisive) consider additional training
before strapping in.


I certainly hope so. I'd also hope the same would go for those like the guy
you're responding to. I don't care if he's got 8k hours or more under his
belt or not. Additional training is never a bad thing.

If I may quote Steve R;

You certainly may! :-D

Fly safe.

Steve R.

PS: I was surprised by this high time pilot asking "why" you do a cool down
period on the R22. I know that the cool down procedure is required on
turbine machine but I can't remember being in any full size helicopter
(piston or turbine) where they "didn't" do a cool down of some sort at the
end of the flight.


  #4  
Old September 7th 04, 08:32 PM
Shiver Me Timbers
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Steve R. wrote:

I don't know who this guy is but please don't take him too seriously.


You know Steve I'm just a lurker, and armchair pilot like many in this
group but it did seem like he had a bone to pick with that post.

Your stories have been great. Please keep em coming!


Hear hear..... Some of the best postings in this group is some time.

Informative, detailed, kinda makes you feel your sitting their beside
him.

Don't know about the rest of the people in this group but that's the
sorta stuff I like to read.
  #5  
Old September 7th 04, 11:47 PM
helicopterandy
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"Steve R." wrote in message ...
Hi Kevin,

"The OTHER Kevin in San Diego" skiddz *AT* adelphia *DOT* net wrote in
message ...
On 6 Sep 2004 23:20:19 -0700, (helicopterandy)
wrote:


A little vibration for sure, but nothing like you are describing, or
is this again a bit of exageration on your part? Not trying to provoke
you here, as I have been there myself (learning to fly helis) and it
can be VERY tense at times. It's just that this Google Rotorcraft
forum seems to be frequented by mainly remote control helicopter
enthusists and the Rotorway/Safari/experimental deathwish crowd that
have very limited knowledge about flying and I would really want to
make ceratin that a novice flyer like yourself will give an accurate
account here so as not to confuse all the other readers here who have
not became heli pilots.


My postings are anectdotal only. They are for entertainment PERIOD.
If anyone is assuming this is part of some freebie flight training,
they need to look into another hobby/profession.

Please understand I'm not trying to ridicule or be derisive of your
descriptions, I've been right where you are and I know the feelings
very well. I'd just like to urge you to write a diary with less
adjectives and bluster than what you are sometimes doing now. You are
(inadvertatntly I'm sure)making it sound as if some of your flights
are more akin to "The Right Stuff" movie footage than true flight
training, especially the "full left pedal" and "shaking" stuff. Either
that or your instructor needs to do a better job of instructing as I
can assure you this is not the way it's done.


Since I'm not a professional writer and am not trying to write a
column for any aviation related magazine or fill out the pages of some
training manual, I'll continue to write what I'm feeling. If you
choose to assume "shaking" is "violent" and "full left pedal" really
isn't (funny, I don't remember seeing you in the cockpit next to me)
that's fine. I don't take offense at what you're saying and I do see
your point. However, since (again) these posts are anecdotal in
nature, I don't see the need to accurately document each and every
control movement and its associated effect on the helicopter.


I don't know who this guy is but please don't take him too seriously. Your
stories have been great. Please keep em coming!

I've met a few rotorcraft rated pilots (of the full size and FAA certified
variety) with 8k, 10k, 20k, etc. hours under their belts that weren't as
sharp on some issues as they like to think they were. I'm not saying that
they are not competent pilots. Just that, with all their time, they
sometimes start thinking they can do no wrong. It's not uncommon amoung
pilot types for any kind of aircraft.

Yes, there are more than a few RC pilots that lurk around here. So what.
The high time, full size pilots really shouldn't "assume" that we're all
totally ignorant about helicopters and their dynamics just because we don't
sit in the thing. I've done a LOT of studying with regards to helicopter
dynamics through the years in an attempt to better understand why my model
did what it did the other day. I'm not claiming to be an expert by any
stretch of the imagination but I think I've got certain basics down pretty
solidly. :-)

Perhaps my "bluster" will make the "Rotorway/Safari/experimental
deathwish crowd" (Talk about derisive) consider additional training
before strapping in.


I certainly hope so. I'd also hope the same would go for those like the guy
you're responding to. I don't care if he's got 8k hours or more under his
belt or not. Additional training is never a bad thing.

If I may quote Steve R;

You certainly may! :-D

Fly safe.

Steve R.

PS: I was surprised by this high time pilot asking "why" you do a cool down
period on the R22. I know that the cool down procedure is required on
turbine machine but I can't remember being in any full size helicopter
(piston or turbine) where they "didn't" do a cool down of some sort at the
end of the flight.


Dear Sir or whomever you are (I am responding NOT to the diary writer
here but to the other guy who chose to jump into the middle of this),
I was refering to Mr. Diary writer's stated FIVE MINUTE COOLDOWN of a
helicopter that requires two minute max before clutch disengagement!!!
What's so hard to understand about that? If the guy's school is
making him "cooldown" for five minutes and he's paying for Hobbs time
(and again maybe you don't know what Hobbs time means, it stands for
every second the engine has oil pressure) then he's paying for time
that is absolutely not required and all he's doing is paying for time
"easy time" that the school is not earning. PS I notice he (Mr Diary
Writer)chose not to respond to this question so maybe he's going to
take it up w/ his school as he should!!
$200 plus an hour adds up really fast. Oh yeah...one more thing if I
may: Believe me when I say with absolute certainty that you don't have
the "basics" down at all, in any form or fashion if you've never taken
a lesson. RC hobbycrafts are a wee bit different than the real thing.
Go give it a try.

Dear Mr Diary Writer,
Thanks for the reply. I apprecaite the fact that you aren't a
professional writer and I only wanted to urge you to be careful in
your descriptions as you/we never know who will read this stuff and
take you literally. Seriously, the experimental crowd may do so. And
you were right re my "derisive" comments about calling the
Rotorway/Safari crowd "deathwishers" and I shouldn't have used that
term. Although I wouldn't fly one of those ships at gunpoint.
Take care and blue skies, and if you ARE using full left pedal and
your CFI didn't jump on the controls, he's got more guts than me!

Regards,
Mark
N26394
  #6  
Old September 8th 04, 05:20 AM
Steve R.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"helicopterandy" wrote in message
m...
Dear Sir or whomever you are (I am responding NOT to the diary writer
here but to the other guy who chose to jump into the middle of this),
I was refering to Mr. Diary writer's stated FIVE MINUTE COOLDOWN of a
helicopter that requires two minute max before clutch disengagement!!!
What's so hard to understand about that? If the guy's school is
making him "cooldown" for five minutes and he's paying for Hobbs time
(and again maybe you don't know what Hobbs time means, it stands for
every second the engine has oil pressure) then he's paying for time
that is absolutely not required and all he's doing is paying for time
"easy time" that the school is not earning. PS I notice he (Mr Diary
Writer)chose not to respond to this question so maybe he's going to
take it up w/ his school as he should!!
$200 plus an hour adds up really fast. Oh yeah...one more thing if I
may: Believe me when I say with absolute certainty that you don't have
the "basics" down at all, in any form or fashion if you've never taken
a lesson. RC hobbycrafts are a wee bit different than the real thing.
Go give it a try.

Regards,
Mark
N26394


Hi Mark,

First, as a matter of fact, I DO know that a Hobbs meter is.

Second, the post I responded to "was" a response from "Mr. Diary Writer."
If you'd have paid a little more attention, you might have caught that, and
he "did" explain the situation with his particular flight school with
regards to the extended cool down time. Maybe you ought to reread that
part.

Third, I do have a bit of duel instruction if full size helicopters so I've
got a better idea of what's involved than you'll probably give me credit
for. Frankly, you don't have a clue as to what I do and do not know on the
"basics" of rotorcraft dynamics. Your response to me simply proves my point
as far as I'm concerned. I've been flying RC helicopters for 22 years and
the little bit of duel instruction I've received in the full size birds only
proved to me that the machines you know and the one's I know aren't that
different in the grand scheme of things. The biggest difference is the
pilots point of view. I'll throw your last statement back at you, "Have you
ever tried the RC side?"

Again, I don't claim to be an expert on everything related to rotorcraft but
I, and a lot of RCer's out there, aren't as ignorant as you seem to think.
Many of us are, but not all! Your attitude was pretty smug with regards to
RCer's and those who choose to fly experimental full size helicopters,
whether you intended it to be or not. Just because the machine is FAA
certified doesn't mean isn't so superior. Yes, there are standards the
machines have to meet but they can still have significant problems. Do a
search on the early history of Robinson's R22. They got off to a pretty
rocky start in the beginning.

Fly Safe,
Steve R.


  #7  
Old September 8th 04, 06:58 PM
helicopterandy
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"Steve R." wrote in message ...
"helicopterandy" wrote in message
m...
Dear Sir or whomever you are (I am responding NOT to the diary writer
here but to the other guy who chose to jump into the middle of this),
I was refering to Mr. Diary writer's stated FIVE MINUTE COOLDOWN of a
helicopter that requires two minute max before clutch disengagement!!!
What's so hard to understand about that? If the guy's school is
making him "cooldown" for five minutes and he's paying for Hobbs time
(and again maybe you don't know what Hobbs time means, it stands for
every second the engine has oil pressure) then he's paying for time
that is absolutely not required and all he's doing is paying for time
"easy time" that the school is not earning. PS I notice he (Mr Diary
Writer)chose not to respond to this question so maybe he's going to
take it up w/ his school as he should!!
$200 plus an hour adds up really fast. Oh yeah...one more thing if I
may: Believe me when I say with absolute certainty that you don't have
the "basics" down at all, in any form or fashion if you've never taken
a lesson. RC hobbycrafts are a wee bit different than the real thing.
Go give it a try.

Regards,
Mark
N26394


Hi Mark,

First, as a matter of fact, I DO know that a Hobbs meter is.

Second, the post I responded to "was" a response from "Mr. Diary Writer."
If you'd have paid a little more attention, you might have caught that, and
he "did" explain the situation with his particular flight school with
regards to the extended cool down time. Maybe you ought to reread that
part.

Third, I do have a bit of duel instruction if full size helicopters so I've
got a better idea of what's involved than you'll probably give me credit
for. Frankly, you don't have a clue as to what I do and do not know on the
"basics" of rotorcraft dynamics. Your response to me simply proves my point
as far as I'm concerned. I've been flying RC helicopters for 22 years and
the little bit of duel instruction I've received in the full size birds only
proved to me that the machines you know and the one's I know aren't that
different in the grand scheme of things. The biggest difference is the
pilots point of view. I'll throw your last statement back at you, "Have you
ever tried the RC side?"

Again, I don't claim to be an expert on everything related to rotorcraft but
I, and a lot of RCer's out there, aren't as ignorant as you seem to think.
Many of us are, but not all! Your attitude was pretty smug with regards to
RCer's and those who choose to fly experimental full size helicopters,
whether you intended it to be or not. Just because the machine is FAA
certified doesn't mean isn't so superior. Yes, there are standards the
machines have to meet but they can still have significant problems. Do a
search on the early history of Robinson's R22. They got off to a pretty
rocky start in the beginning.

Fly Safe,
Steve R.



STEVE,
POINT TAKEN. WELL PUT. I DO HAVE TO EXPLAIN THAT THIS SITE IS ONE OF
THE MOST DIFFICULT I'VE EVER SEEN TO EVEN BE ABLE TO KNOW WITH ANY
CERTAINTY OF WHO IS SAYING WHAT TO WHOM. I KNOW IT'S A FREE SITE BUT
IT REALLY SEEMS LIKE GOOGLE COULD COME UP WITH A BETTER WAY TO
ORGANIZE THESE FORUMS. GO LOOK AT THE YAHOO GROUPS FORUM OR VERTICAL
REFERENCE'S FORUMS OR PRUNE'S OR MANY OTHERS TO SEE HOW MUCH EASIER
THEY ARE TO READ AND KEEP UP WITH.
REGARDS,
MARK
PS
COME TO VIRGINIA AND I'LL GIVE YOU A RIDE.
  #8  
Old September 9th 04, 04:54 PM
Steve R.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"helicopterandy" wrote in message
om...
STEVE,
POINT TAKEN. WELL PUT.

REGARDS,
MARK
PS
COME TO VIRGINIA AND I'LL GIVE YOU A RIDE.


Thanks Mark. I may just take you up on that! :-)

Fly Safe,
Steve R.


  #9  
Old September 10th 04, 12:37 AM
Andrew Crane
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"helicopterandy" wrote in message
om...
I don't post here often


and judging by your attitude later in this thread I'm sure most of us are
glad you don't.

I cannot imagine a flight
school allowing for one second more cooldown than is required by the
factory. Unless you are paying for time on the skids, instead of
collective time.


The R22 datcon works on engine running. The 44 runs on collective time.

If so, if you are paying for total Hobbs time, they
may be screwing you, check it out. No R22 needs a five minute cooldown
before clutch release.


Depends how hot you got it and the ambient temperature. You are looking for
_significant_ CHT reduction so as not to shock cool the engine, not an
arbitrary time. If the school owns the aircraft I'm sure they want the
engine to go TBO and so treat it kindly.

Just two minutes for coolodown, then release
clutch for thirty seconds, then get mixture guard off and pull mixture
out. Call Robinson Helicopters yourself and check it out. You may be
asked for that additional cooldown time simply to run up your tab if
you are paying for Hobbs time.


And I suppose they then run the clock back so they can avoid the time-due
maintenance the extra hobbs time would have clocked up?

Also, in one of your posts you state that after bringing the ship to a
hover after an approach you had a wind gust that pushed the ship into
a right yaw that was so extreme you had to add FULL left pedal to stop
it. I've flown R22s for a while and I have NEVER approached the need
for full left pedal. Ever.


Presumably then you haven't flown one in a stiff wind? A gusty crosswind
from the right can easily demand some heavy left pedal.

You also mention "shimmy and shaking" all the way down during an
approach. Are you getting into a settling w/ power situation? If you
are experiencing violent shaking let me assure you this isn't normal.


He didn't say violent, just shimmying and shaking. A slow and high approach
will do this. Once ETL is lost the thing will be hovering OGE and bangs
about bit. OK it's on the wrong part of both the curves that matter but
sometimes it's the safest or only way into a landing area. It doesn't make
it abnormal, just not ideal.

It's just that this Google Rotorcraft
forum seems to be frequented by mainly remote control helicopter
enthusists and the Rotorway/Safari/experimental deathwish crowd that
have very limited knowledge about flying and I would really want to
make ceratin that a novice flyer like yourself will give an accurate
account here so as not to confuse all the other readers here who have
not became heli pilots.


This is usenet, nothing to do with google.

Please understand I'm not trying to ridicule or be derisive of your
descriptions, I've been right where you are and I know the feelings
very well. I'd just like to urge you to write a diary with less
adjectives and bluster than what you are sometimes doing now. You are
(inadvertatntly I'm sure)making it sound as if some of your flights
are more akin to "The Right Stuff" movie footage than true flight
training, especially the "full left pedal" and "shaking" stuff. Either
that or your instructor needs to do a better job of instructing as I
can assure you this is not the way it's done.


From memory I think I found the whole training thing full of adjectives.
What seems normal now seemed fraught a few years ago.

Regards
Andrew


  #10  
Old September 10th 04, 04:03 AM
Shiver Me Timbers
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

GW De Lacey wrote:

It just occurred to me that I'm x no-archived and he won't see the
message unless it's quoted by someone else.


Are you sure...????

I don't see anything in your post or headers that would indicate that.

Now I suppose if I wasn't so lazy I'd go check your last post to see
if it showed up in GOOGLE, but as I said... If I wasn't so lazy.
 




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