MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
oups.com...
Now that's bull****. Aggressive leaning is COOLER when done properly
(i.e.,
using the proper temp range when LOP. It also produces lower internal
cylinder pressures, more through combustion, lower CHT temps.

Not in a carbureted engine.

Yes, in a carburated engine.

The fuel flows are simply not matched well
enough between cylinders to run lean of peak without risking damage.

That's a seperate issue, but even that's not completely right. The issue
there is the ****ty fuel distribution in horizontally opposed engines. That
includes carb engines and FI. The issue IS the sloppy (horrendously) design
and workmanship that the two big boys have been getting us schmucks to buy
into for the past couple generations.

Go and read about the P&W radials and how they ran them during the
carburation days, then put the book on display in your hotels library.


Now, in a fuel-injected engine (especially with GAMI), that's a whole
different world. But in the low compression carbureted world, you run
rich of peak, or you risk destroying your engine.

You run rich of peak in the wrong range and you still mess up your engine,
high compression or low, Mogas or Avgas, carbureted or FI'ed.

"nrp" wrote in message
ups.com...
Dick Collins in Flying mag had a new '75 Skyhawk that he tried to run
on 100LL using aggressive leaning techniques. I recall he got to 800
hours TT before writing a bitter editorial (who would do THAT nowdays?)
about his engine's bad case of lead poisoning, and ended with " a four
cylinder engine running on three cylinders gives a message that's hard
to ignore".

What engine does the 75 Skyhawk carry?

Collins also wrote an article about a year ago (June '05 ?) after putting
GAMI's in his P210 castigating LOP. GAMI and Mac McClellan both returned the
broadside as it was obvious he didn't bother to learn the techniques. The
manager at GAMI, Tim Roehl, stated in an email, "He has never asked us for
assistance in getting it right, or doing it right. We have invited him to
come visit us and fly with us, to no avail. I guess he must know
everything. Disappointing to mislead so many people in the perseverance of
such "old wives tales."

GAMI's Jean-Paul Townsend stated in an email, " I would personally pay the
$995 for him to go to the Advanced Pilot Seminar. He has been offered a
gratis seat before, but he won't take it."

Say le vie, I guess.


--
Matt
---------------------
Matthew W. Barrow
Site-Fill Homes, LLC.
Montrose, CO

People seem to ignore the fact that lead dibromide, the byproduct of
burning 100LL, is acidic highly corrosive when mixed with water, which
is also plenty as a result of combustion.

Lead dibromide is formed when Tetra-ethyl lead react swith lead
scavenging agent ethylene dibromide during the combustion. The lead
scavenging agent is a necessary evil to get rid of the metalic lead
after TEL does it job of retarding the combustion. Without it the
metalic lead will quickly accumulate in the engine as slush.

Other than its high octane value (which isn't needed in 1:7 compression
engines), 100LL isn't such a good fuel to begin with.

Collins 172 engine was same as mine. Lyc O-320E2D low compression.
Only mine has been fed a minimum lead diet to get 1700 hrs TT & 30
years since new (i. e. no OH!).

Interesting RC attitudes on the GAMI observations. I think he was very
aggressive in leaning his 172 to the point of roughness - and he got
plenty of that thru the years he had it. At the time though his 172
problems sure scared hell out of us & our (then) new bird. His is
history. We still have ours.

Jay Honeck wrote:
Geez Jay, better get yourself educated on leaning. Leaning properly on
the ground means way, way lean of peak which by definition is downright
cold EGT's although on the ground at low power there's no such thing as
high EGT.


Welcome to 1952, where you have to move levers on the panel in order to
make your plane run properly while on the ground. And you say MOGAS is
bad?

I never said that. I used it for 7 years in my 182, wish I could still
use it. You seem to have a real bummer of an engine. I don't really
lean on the ground with my 520 and don't have any problems.


Strange how I have to do none of that, when I run with mogas.
The engine just purrs like a kitten, without any input from me at all.

Ditto here.

("M" wrote)
Lead dibromide is formed when Tetra-ethyl lead react swith lead scavenging
agent ethylene dibromide during the combustion. The lead scavenging agent
is a necessary evil to get rid of the metalic lead after TEL does it job
of retarding the combustion. Without it the metalic lead will quickly
accumulate in the engine as slush.


Do you know how many lbs. of actual lead are in ...100 gallons of 100LL?

Curious ....unfortunately, so are the Green Meanies.


Montblack
http://www.sensesofcinema.com/contents/cteq/03/26/yellow_submarine.html
Blue Meanie

"Montblack" wrote:
Do you know how many lbs. of actual lead are in ...100 gallons of
100LL?

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avgas :
"Avgas 100LL contains a maximum of 2 grams of lead per US gallon"

So you point is that lead scavenging agent isn't needed because there's
not that much lead in the 100LL?

"M" wrote in message
oups.com...
People seem to ignore the fact that lead dibromide, the byproduct of
burning 100LL, is acidic highly corrosive when mixed with water, which
is also plenty as a result of combustion.

Lead dibromide is formed when Tetra-ethyl lead react swith lead
scavenging agent ethylene dibromide during the combustion. The lead
scavenging agent is a necessary evil to get rid of the metalic lead
after TEL does it job of retarding the combustion. Without it the
metalic lead will quickly accumulate in the engine as slush.

Other than its high octane value (which isn't needed in 1:7 compression
engines), 100LL isn't such a good fuel to begin with.


Baloney. 100LL is the best fuel made and can't be duplicated Your problems
sound like "The sky is falling"

Karl
ATP CFI ETC
"Curator N185KG

On Thu, 11 May 2006 10:08:01 -0700, "Matt Barrow"
wrote:


"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
roups.com...
Geez Jay, better get yourself educated on leaning. Leaning properly on
the ground means way, way lean of peak which by definition is downright
cold EGT's although on the ground at low power there's no such thing as
high EGT.

Welcome to 1952, where you have to move levers on the panel in order to
make your plane run properly while on the ground. And you say MOGAS is
bad? Strange how I have to do none of that, when I run with mogas.
The engine just purrs like a kitten, without any input from me at all.

Nice change of subject when caught with your pants down.


curious who was right there to jump on, also.

TC