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#1
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Naval aviator & NFO attire while underway
Just started reading Sherwood's new book "Afterburner," about naval
aviation during the Vietnam War. While examining ready room photos of various naval aviators and NFOs, I noticed many of them are *not* wearing flight suits. Instead, they're wearing trousers, a web belt and a long sleeve shirt that buttons up the front. (Sometimes this garb seems stiffly starched. Other times it's sweat-stained and quite wrinkled.) The same holds true for guys depicted in photos found in other books, such as the two-volume series on MiG killers. By way of contrast, whenever I see current day naval aviators and NFOs in various TV documentaries shot while underway they are *invariably* wearing flight suits in the ready room, dirty shirt wardroom, etc. Can anybody explain the change in underway attire between the Vietnam era and today? Is this controlled by a regulation? By the skipper? By some unwritten tradition? |
#2
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Many commands had a rule that flight suits were only for flying and alert
standby. Also, spending a warm day in a Nomex flightsuit was an itchy experience. Aviation Working Green trousers with khaki shirt and necktie (sometimes) were usually acceptable as Uniform of the Day for aviation officers and Chief Petty Officers. Many wearers, myself included, didn't even own a green blouse because flight jackets were locally allowed with greens. The Navy Relief Thrift Store usually had plenty of trousers in stock. Aviation Working Green was (is?) an optional uniform, not prescribable as Uniform of the Day. Rick "Paul Michael Brown" wrote in message news Just started reading Sherwood's new book "Afterburner," about naval aviation during the Vietnam War. While examining ready room photos of various naval aviators and NFOs, I noticed many of them are *not* wearing flight suits. Instead, they're wearing trousers, a web belt and a long sleeve shirt that buttons up the front. (Sometimes this garb seems stiffly starched. Other times it's sweat-stained and quite wrinkled.) The same holds true for guys depicted in photos found in other books, such as the two-volume series on MiG killers. By way of contrast, whenever I see current day naval aviators and NFOs in various TV documentaries shot while underway they are *invariably* wearing flight suits in the ready room, dirty shirt wardroom, etc. Can anybody explain the change in underway attire between the Vietnam era and today? Is this controlled by a regulation? By the skipper? By some unwritten tradition? |
#3
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pmb- While examining ready room photos of
various naval aviators and NFOs, I noticed many of them are *not* wearing flight suits. Instead, they're wearing trousers, a web belt and a long sleeve shirt that buttons up the front. BRBR ahhhh, 'green bag syndrome. Depends on the command and CO. I have been in squadrons where you had better be in khakis if not on the flght sked and others where we didn't wear anything but a 'bag', as soon as the ship got underway. Remember tho that in the USN, a flight suit is 'flight gear', not a 'uniform', unlike the USAF, where it is. P. C. Chisholm CDR, USN(ret.) Old Phart Phormer Phantom, Turkey, Viper, Scooter and Combat Buckeye Phlyer |
#4
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#5
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ray- Fortunately relieving us the embarrassing necessity of wearing a
scarf! BRBR No kiddin' I wore one of those silly things while on USAF excange duty. Great JOs, great jets, scary upper echelon and rules. P. C. Chisholm CDR, USN(ret.) Old Phart Phormer Phantom, Turkey, Viper, Scooter and Combat Buckeye Phlyer |
#6
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"No kiddin' I wore one of those silly things while on USAF excange duty.
Great JOs, great jets, scary upper echelon and rules. P. C. Chisholm CDR, USN(ret.)" Got any good stories about the AF JOs, jets, upper echelon or rules you'd like to share with us? Tom |
#7
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geezzzer- Got any good stories about the AF JOs, jets, upper echelon or rules
you'd like to share with us? BRBR Nothing major, Just stood tall before the wing commander for things like rolling up my sleeves, wearing brown boots, flying too close when coming into the overhead.. Many JOs leaving at this time(late 70's) for the airlines. Not a lot of happy campers but really good pilots. I think there was more than a little SAC tainted guys around that saw how wierd SAC was during the SE Asia war games. Plus some O-6s that were transitioning to the F-4 for the first time that were pretty scary. A B-52 suadron CO that was going to an F-4 wing in Germany. How they chose their COs still amazes me. Wing Commander picks his COs. When the Wing Commander is new all sorts of O-5s show up suddenly to rush those jobs. My Ops officer went across the state to a O-2 base to try to get a squadron there, flying Cessna push-pulls, which were all down for shucking their aft prop, taking off the tails... P. C. Chisholm CDR, USN(ret.) Old Phart Phormer Phantom, Turkey, Viper, Scooter and Combat Buckeye Phlyer |
#8
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"Plus some O-6s that were transitioning to the F-4 for the first time that
were pretty scary. A B-52 suadron CO that was going to an F-4 wing in Germany." I can imagine that WOULD be scary. Why would the AF even bother spending a lot of time/effort/$ to transition someone that senior to a hot two-seater? Didn't they have anyone already in the F-4 "community" (don't know if they use this term) that would be qualified for command? "How they chose their COs still amazes me. Wing Commander picks his COs. When the Wing Commander is new all sorts of O-5s show up suddenly to rush those jobs." Sounds like a process that might have been left over from the 1930s. This explains a story I just read in the latest issue of Flight Journal some F-86 pilots in Korea who flew across the Yalu in small flights after switching to alternate channels and turning off transponders so they couldn't be easily tracked. The author was obviously a bit ****ed off and make a remark about squadron COs and Wing Commander's favorites. Now I know what he meant. I wonder if this is still USAF practice? Was exchange duty with the AF considered a prize or a booby prize for USN pilots? How about the other way around? By the way, have you ever read the book, "Boyd - The fighter pilot who changed the art of war"? I bet you have. Comments? I bet you have. Thanks, Pechs. Tom |
#9
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Nothing major, Just stood tall before the wing commander for things like
rolling up my sleeves, wearing brown boots, flying too close when coming into the overhead. Brings back a happy memory. As a green, wet-behind-the-ears and smart-ass Midshipman in F- Stage at Saufley Field, back in 1950, I was scheduled to fly with an Air Force pilot on exchange duty named Gschwandtner (unforgettable name). I had already "learned" that an Air Force formation was "two or more airplanes going the same direction on the same day," so I determined to show this guy how we (budding) Naval Aviators fly formation. So I hung in as close to him as I could and was delighted to read on my "report card" that I "holds good formation but flies too close." Made my day! But the brown boots were strictly legal, were they not? Even we cadets wore brown shoes, in those days. vince norris |
#10
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geeweezer- Why would the AF even bother spending a
lot of time/effort/$ to transition someone that senior to a hot two-seater? Didn't they have anyone already in the F-4 "community" (don't know if they use this term) that would be qualified for command? BRBR I doubt anybody knows how wing commanders are actually chosen in the USAF. Seemed pretty arbitrary to me. No boards or 'tanks, like the USN. No rewuirement to have a wing to be a general officer as well. AFAIK, my CO(61st TFS), Mike Ryan, had that command only, then onto the staff world on his way to CoS. great CO, BTW. geeweezer- Was exchange duty with the AF considered a prize or a booby prize for USN pilots? How about the other way around? BRBR It was a one for one trade, some USAF guy to the USN. Difference was I went to a RTU, training squadron, flew in the trunk mostly where my USAF counterpart was in a F-4 squadron, fleet type. It allowed me to stay in the F-4 tho, instead of going to the training command flying TA-4s. P. C. Chisholm CDR, USN(ret.) Old Phart Phormer Phantom, Turkey, Viper, Scooter and Combat Buckeye Phlyer |
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