RIP Edward Teller

(Autocollimator) wrote:

From: Chad Irby

The big problem for the German program was Heisenberg. Before the war,
he'd calculated some fission cross-sections incorractly, and apparently
never recalculated them. He thought the mass for a chain reaction was
something on the order of forty *tons*. If he'd had a somewhat smaller
ego, he might have done some recalculation of his assumptions and gotten
it right.

Even after the war, he insisted that the Americans hadn't actually built
a uranium fission bomb until he was shown the correct cross-section
calculations.

There is a rather extensive body of thought that maintains that
Heisenburg was deliberately obstructionist.

I've also heard that some of the lesser lights among his staff fed him
"confirmed" numbers that went in the wrong direction.

Heisenberg was a known patriot, though he wasn't a Nazi by any stretch.

Once he realized what the end product could do, he might have done the
sabotage himself, though (it was a very small calculation error,
overall).

--


Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

Subject: RIP Edward Teller
From: Chad Irby
Date: 9/13/03 6:54 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id:

(Autocollimator) wrote:

From: Chad Irby

The big problem for the German program was Heisenberg. Before the war,
he'd calculated some fission cross-sections incorractly, and apparently
never recalculated them. He thought the mass for a chain reaction was
something on the order of forty *tons*. If he'd had a somewhat smaller
ego, he might have done some recalculation of his assumptions and gotten
it right.

Even after the war, he insisted that the Americans hadn't actually built
a uranium fission bomb until he was shown the correct cross-section
calculations.

There is a rather extensive body of thought that maintains that
Heisenburg was deliberately obstructionist.

I've also heard that some of the lesser lights among his staff fed him
"confirmed" numbers that went in the wrong direction.

Heisenberg was a known patriot, though he wasn't a Nazi by any stretch.

Once he realized what the end product could do, he might have done the
sabotage himself, though (it was a very small calculation error,
overall).
..

Large enough not to get the job done.




Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

Subject: RIP Edward Teller
From: IBM
Date: 9/13/03 6:44 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id:

(ArtKramr) wrote in
:

Subject: RIP Edward Teller
From: "John Carrier"
Date: 9/13/03 1:40 PM Pacific Daylight Time

Teller wasn't one of the major players in the Manhattan project. I
doubt
his presence in Germany would have materially effected a
half-hearted
effort

Well, it would have been Teller plus Heisenburg working side by side.
You seem to know the outcome of that combination for sure. I am not so
sure, But I guess we'll never know for sure. will we?

Lets see.
Heisenbergs monstrous ego.
Teller, Hungarian, not noted for suffering fools gladly, carries big
honkin' stick.
Yeah, on the whole I'd rather be juggling expired dynamite.

IBM


Conjecture based on bias.

In article ,
"John Carrier" wrote:

Teller wasn't one of the major players in the Manhattan project. I doubt
his presence in Germany would have materially effected a half-hearted effort
to achieve the bomb. His fatherhood of the H-bomb is somewhat exaggerated.
Certainly he was a big proponent of the weapon, but it was Hans Ulam who
figured out the concepts that made the bomb practical and scaleable. When
Teller and his group splintered off from Los Alamos to develop weapons to
his theoretical designs, the results were not spectacular.

Teller spent a lot of time being annoyed at journalists and
others who referred to him as the "father of the H-bomb".

I suspect he'd not argue with you.

(ArtKramr) wrote:

From: Chad Irby :

Heisenberg was a known patriot, though he wasn't a Nazi by any stretch.

Once he realized what the end product could do, he might have done the
sabotage himself, though (it was a very small calculation error,
overall).

Large enough not to get the job done.

That's the problem when you're talking about events that take place in
nanometer scale or smaller. Very small errors give very big differences.

--


Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

(Autocollimator) wrote:

From: IBM
Lets see.
Heisenbergs monstrous ego.
Teller, Hungarian, not noted for suffering fools gladly, carries big
honkin' stick.
Yeah, on the whole I'd rather be juggling expired dynamite.

Conjecture based on bias.

Not a lot of conjecture, and if it's bias, it's bias based on pretty
much every opinion ever uttered on either man.

--


Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

Subject: RIP Edward Teller
From: Chad Irby
Date: 9/13/03 11:25 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id:

(ArtKramr) wrote:

From: Chad Irby :

Heisenberg was a known patriot, though he wasn't a Nazi by any stretch.

Once he realized what the end product could do, he might have done the
sabotage himself, though (it was a very small calculation error,
overall).

Large enough not to get the job done.

That's the problem when you're talking about events that take place in
nanometer scale or smaller. Very small errors give very big differences.

Ah chaos theory rears its ugly head.

Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

"Autocollimator" wrote in message


There is a rather extensive body of thought that maintains that
Heisenburg was deliberately obstructionist.

There is an equally vocal faction, bolstered recently by letters from Niels
Bohr, that says Heisenberg was working full-out on the project and simply
wasn't able to deliver.

See, for instance:
http://physicsweb.org/article/news/6/2/5

--�
Tom Schoene Replace "invalid" with "net" to e-mail
"If brave men and women never died, there would be nothing
special about bravery." -- Andy Rooney (attributed)

(B2431) writes:

http://www.nrdc.org/nuclear/nudb/datab15.asp

....
Interesting chart, but one above ground test is omitted. A satellite detected a
South African test back when they had a program. For the life of me I can't
recall where I read about it.

That one may or may not have existed. There was some evidence it was a joint
South African/Israeli project, and other evidence the bird was just seeing
lightning.

I've read nothing new on it in years.

--
A host is a host from coast to
& no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX
Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433
is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433

I'm surprised that no one here has mentioned his promotion
of Star Wars to Ronnie.

--
A host is a host from coast to
& no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX
Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433
is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433