Under Entirely New Management, concluded - Turncoat-17E.jpg (1/1)

Grumpy AuContraire wrote:

You can make that 3,000 years and perhaps before.

Oppps, I slipped and missed a zero. My bad.

John

Which witch!

I just saw my spelling too. Ugh!!

wrote in
nk.net:

I have seen pictures of "that item" used as a native American
decoration. It was used long before and far away from "national
socialism" in Germany.

In blue on white, it was also the national marking worn by the air force
of Finland before and during WW2.


"The Visitor" wrote in message
...


CWO4 Dave Mann wrote:


In short form, the Twisted Cross is a symbol of hatred,
intolerance, horror and unlimited cruelty.

From witch it will never recover.

it does have a fascinating 300 year history.

John

Even in the Netherlands in the mid 50's, any plastic model-kit of German
aircraft had decals with the swatika missing.
At the time it was explained to me that the symbol might be "offensive" to
some people. Go figure..

wrote in message
...
Even in the Netherlands in the mid 50's, any plastic model-kit of German
aircraft had decals with the swatika missing.
At the time it was explained to me that the symbol might be "offensive" to
some people. Go figure..

The swastika was missing all the way through the '80s. I don't recall
exactly when the ban was lifted, but only now they are slowly appearing here
and there.
You may not realise where the offense came from. It came from two distinct
events: the large percentage of Dutch jews that never returned from nazi
hospitality (outranked only by the Polish percentage), and the fact that a
very large portion of the country was starved by the german occupation after
the Dutch initiated a railroad strike after "market-Garden" (the notorious
failure of the Arnhem air-assault). The nazis stepped up their
terror-campaign, holding more razzias, and killing 100 resistance members
and deporting all men from the town of Putten to slave labour camps (the
town itself was set ablaze) in revenge for the attempted assasination of the
head of the SD. In addition to this, the coalmines were now on the "wrong"
side of the frontline, so not only food was missing, but heating as well. As
any service-member who served in the Ardennes can tell you, 1944-1945 was
the coldest winter in a very long time. In spite of food-help from Sweden
and Switzerland/IRC (which saved thousands of lives), the situation became
so bad that US and RAF bombercrews were flying to the western provinces with
food instead of bombs during the final days of the war (operations
"Manna"(RAF) and Chowhound (USAF).
Read about that on http://users.interstroom.nl/~heijink/ and you will
understand why the swastika is (to this day) considered to be offensive.

Ron
--
Non urinat in ventum

"Ron" wrote in
:


wrote in message
...
Even in the Netherlands in the mid 50's, any plastic model-kit of
German aircraft had decals with the swatika missing.
At the time it was explained to me that the symbol might be
"offensive" to some people. Go figure..

The swastika was missing all the way through the '80s. I don't recall
exactly when the ban was lifted, but only now they are slowly
appearing here and there.
You may not realise where the offense came from. It came from two
distinct events: the large percentage of Dutch jews that never
returned from nazi hospitality (outranked only by the Polish
percentage), and the fact that a very large portion of the country was
starved by the german occupation after the Dutch initiated a railroad
strike after "market-Garden" (the notorious failure of the Arnhem
air-assault). The nazis stepped up their terror-campaign, holding more
razzias, and killing 100 resistance members and deporting all men from
the town of Putten to slave labour camps (the town itself was set
ablaze) in revenge for the attempted assasination of the head of the
SD. In addition to this, the coalmines were now on the "wrong" side of
the frontline, so not only food was missing, but heating as well. As
any service-member who served in the Ardennes can tell you, 1944-1945
was the coldest winter in a very long time. In spite of food-help from
Sweden and Switzerland/IRC (which saved thousands of lives), the
situation became so bad that US and RAF bombercrews were flying to the
western provinces with food instead of bombs during the final days of
the war (operations "Manna"(RAF) and Chowhound (USAF).
Read about that on http://users.interstroom.nl/~heijink/ and you will
understand why the swastika is (to this day) considered to be
offensive.

Ron

It is also to notice that the swastika was not a "Hochheitszeichen" It
was not the cockarde for Germany (that was the Balkenkreuz) but it was a
sign from the nazi-party and what it stood for.

Having said that, I will not spend 3 weeks detailing a 1/48th scale
messereschmitt cockpit for historical and technical accuracy and then
omit the swastika on the tail fin.
And I also build russian fighters with their red stars. Eventhough what
Stalin did under that star (to millions of his own people) during and
after the war.
Same goes for the Japanese meatball.

my 2 ct.

Cheers,

Dennis Loep

Mechanical Menace wrote:
"Ron" wrote in
:

wrote in message
...
Even in the Netherlands in the mid 50's, any plastic model-kit of
German aircraft had decals with the swatika missing.
At the time it was explained to me that the symbol might be
"offensive" to some people. Go figure..
The swastika was missing all the way through the '80s. I don't recall
exactly when the ban was lifted, but only now they are slowly
appearing here and there.
You may not realise where the offense came from. It came from two
distinct events: the large percentage of Dutch jews that never
returned from nazi hospitality (outranked only by the Polish
percentage), and the fact that a very large portion of the country was
starved by the german occupation after the Dutch initiated a railroad
strike after "market-Garden" (the notorious failure of the Arnhem
air-assault). The nazis stepped up their terror-campaign, holding more
razzias, and killing 100 resistance members and deporting all men from
the town of Putten to slave labour camps (the town itself was set
ablaze) in revenge for the attempted assasination of the head of the
SD. In addition to this, the coalmines were now on the "wrong" side of
the frontline, so not only food was missing, but heating as well. As
any service-member who served in the Ardennes can tell you, 1944-1945
was the coldest winter in a very long time. In spite of food-help from
Sweden and Switzerland/IRC (which saved thousands of lives), the
situation became so bad that US and RAF bombercrews were flying to the
western provinces with food instead of bombs during the final days of
the war (operations "Manna"(RAF) and Chowhound (USAF).
Read about that on http://users.interstroom.nl/~heijink/ and you will
understand why the swastika is (to this day) considered to be
offensive.

Ron

It is also to notice that the swastika was not a "Hochheitszeichen" It
was not the cockarde for Germany (that was the Balkenkreuz) but it was a
sign from the nazi-party and what it stood for.

Having said that, I will not spend 3 weeks detailing a 1/48th scale
messereschmitt cockpit for historical and technical accuracy and then
omit the swastika on the tail fin.
And I also build russian fighters with their red stars. Eventhough what
Stalin did under that star (to millions of his own people) during and
after the war.
Same goes for the Japanese meatball.

my 2 ct.

Cheers,

Dennis Loep


Dennis and Ron, your replies are spot on target. Dennis, "when men
choose ignorance of history, they shall remain ignorant even unto their
graves".

Cheers,

Dave the Historian

"Study History - Know the Future"