First Time in IMC and vacuum problem

I too had my first experience in IMC yesterday. I got my ticket last
summer too and have kept current but haven't had a chance to go solo. I
was going to go from Indianapolis Executive (TYQ) to Capitol City in
Lansing Michigan (LAN). The weather was 1000 OVR until 50 miles north of
TYQ and then it was clear all the way to LAN. THis was going to be a
quick trip because the weather in Indiana was forecast to get worse as
the day wore on.

I was a little bit apprehensive because I have a respect to IMC but I
thought it would be good practice too. I got set up, picked up my
clearance and was off. Just as forecast I entered the clag at 1000 feet.
Right away I spotted something wrong with the attitude indicator. It was
looking like I was in a steep climbing turn. Oh **** I thought great
time for the AI to go out. I had a weird feeling of ending up as an
Aftermath column. I must say that I was pretty scared but strange
enough not panicked. I reduced power, used the Turn Coordinator to level
the wings, used the Airspeed Indicator to level off altitude. I called
ATC and told them that I was having a problem with the AI and needed
their assistance. They asked if I wanted vectors back to TQY to shoot
the ILS 36 there. I said yes. I started back to the field and the AI
started to act like I expected it should. After a few minutes I was
still in the clag but all instruments were working correctly. I thought
about just continuing on back to Lansing but I quickly talked myself out
of it.

Really after I "calmed" down and the AI started acting correctly I
didn't have any problems navigating in the clouds. I shot the ILS 36 and
broke out 1000 feet above the runway, canceled my IFR flight plan and
made an uneventful landing. ATC wanted to know if I wanted to refill my
flight plan and I said no thanks. I was glad to be on the ground. I was
thinking about what just transpired and decided to talk it over with my
CFI.

We determined that what probably happened was that the extended period
of idling on the ground caused the AI gyro to spool down some. It took
several minutes at cruise power for it to come back up to speed and
after that it indicated correctly.

Here is what I'll do different next time:

1. Make sure that I have had the vacuum indicator "in the green" for
several minutes before departing to ensure that the gyros are spooled up.

2. Have the approach for returning to the airport loaded or in standby
just in case you need to return quickly. I did not do this and it added
needless stress loading everything.

It is true what they say:
"It is better to be on the ground wishing you were in the air, then
being in the air wishing you were on the ground"

Jon Kraus
PP-ASEL-IA
Student Mooney Owner

In a previous article, Jon Kraus said:
1. Make sure that I have had the vacuum indicator "in the green" for
several minutes before departing to ensure that the gyros are spooled up.

2. Have the approach for returning to the airport loaded or in standby
just in case you need to return quickly. I did not do this and it added
needless stress loading everything.

It couldn't hurt to have a mechanic look at your vacuum system.


--
Paul Tomblin http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/
"The means of defense against foreign danger historically have become the
instruments of tyranny at home." - James Madison

I didn't mention that in my post but first thing tomorrow I am calling
the shop and have them check everything out. Thanks!!

Jon Kraus
PP-ASEL-IA
Student Mooney Owner

Paul Tomblin wrote:
In a previous article, Jon Kraus said:

1. Make sure that I have had the vacuum indicator "in the green" for
several minutes before departing to ensure that the gyros are spooled up.

2. Have the approach for returning to the airport loaded or in standby
just in case you need to return quickly. I did not do this and it added
needless stress loading everything.


It couldn't hurt to have a mechanic look at your vacuum system.

Jon Kraus wrote:
We determined that what probably happened was that the extended period
of idling on the ground caused the AI gyro to spool down some. It took
several minutes at cruise power for it to come back up to speed and
after that it indicated correctly.

You should be getting full vacuum at normal ground idle speeds (1000 RPM
or so). If your gyros are not spinning up in the time it takes you to
taxi to the runway and do a normal runnup, something is wrong with the
vacuum system or the gyros.

In any case, congrats on a job well done.

"Jon Kraus" wrote:
Right away I spotted something wrong with the attitude indicator. It
was
looking like I was in a steep climbing turn. Oh **** I thought great
time for the AI to go out. I had a weird feeling of ending up as an
Aftermath column.

Holy sh**!

[snip good job of getting back on the ground]

Here is what I'll do different next time:

1. Make sure that I have had the vacuum indicator "in the green" for
several minutes before departing to ensure that the gyros are spooled
up.

2. Have the approach for returning to the airport loaded or in
standby just in case you need to return quickly. I did not do this and
it added needless stress loading everything.

My first thought if I have trouble in IMC is to get to VMC if I can do
it quickly. Did you have any idea of where the tops were? If you could
have made a short, straight ahead climb above the clouds, your
destination was in the clear; you could have avoided a bunch of IMC
maneuvering with a flaky AI.
--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

On Sun, 02 Jan 2005 13:46:31 GMT, Jon Kraus wrote:

Good job Jon! I ran into a similar situation with my VFR ticket and Vacuum
pump failure. It was a night flight. See
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/...ff0985c67799e8
for my experiences. (learning systems on the fly)

Here is what I'll do different next time:

1. Make sure that I have had the vacuum indicator "in the green" for
several minutes before departing to ensure that the gyros are spooled up.

I am surprised that your preflight procedures after engine start up doesn't
check for vacuum. Mine has it twice. Once after engine start, and then
once again after runup.

2. Have the approach for returning to the airport loaded or in standby
just in case you need to return quickly. I did not do this and it added
needless stress loading everything.

VERY GOOD TIP! I have generally had my arrival airport and alternate
airport approaches readily available on my kneeboard, but I will add my own
departure airport for future flights.

I don't have an IFR GPS, but couldn't you have hit the NRST button to
quickly get your airport information loaded???

Allen

"Jon Kraus" wrote in message
...

Glad it worked out. It would be useful to file an ASRS report of the event.

Really after I "calmed" down and the AI started acting correctly I didn't
have any problems navigating in the clouds. I shot the ILS 36 and broke
out 1000 feet above the runway, canceled my IFR flight plan and made an
uneventful landing.

I hope you waited until you were below 700' AGL before canceling IFR. (If
not, that's another good reason for the ASRS report.)

--Gary

You are correct... The tops were just at 4000 but I wanted to get down
so I could clean out my pants!! :-)

Jon Kraus
PP-ASEL-IA
Student Mooney Owner

Dan Luke wrote:

"Jon Kraus" wrote:
Right away I spotted something wrong with the attitude indicator. It
was

looking like I was in a steep climbing turn. Oh **** I thought great
time for the AI to go out. I had a weird feeling of ending up as an
Aftermath column.


Holy sh**!

[snip good job of getting back on the ground]


Here is what I'll do different next time:

1. Make sure that I have had the vacuum indicator "in the green" for
several minutes before departing to ensure that the gyros are spooled
up.

2. Have the approach for returning to the airport loaded or in
standby just in case you need to return quickly. I did not do this and
it added needless stress loading everything.


My first thought if I have trouble in IMC is to get to VMC if I can do
it quickly. Did you have any idea of where the tops were? If you could
have made a short, straight ahead climb above the clouds, your
destination was in the clear; you could have avoided a bunch of IMC
maneuvering with a flaky AI.

Thanks for the advice Gary. I am familiar with what a ASRS report is but
was wondering how to file one and why one is needed?

Yes I was below 700 feet when I cancelled my IFR plan. Thanks again!!

Jon Kraus
PP-ASEL-IA
Student Mooney Owner

Gary Drescher wrote:

"Jon Kraus" wrote in message
...

Glad it worked out. It would be useful to file an ASRS report of the event.


Really after I "calmed" down and the AI started acting correctly I didn't
have any problems navigating in the clouds. I shot the ILS 36 and broke
out 1000 feet above the runway, canceled my IFR flight plan and made an
uneventful landing.


I hope you waited until you were below 700' AGL before canceling IFR. (If
not, that's another good reason for the ASRS report.)

--Gary

"Jon Kraus" wrote in message
...

Well you sure got a lot more practice than you were planning on. After that,
your next flight should seem like a walk in the park.

2. Have the approach for returning to the airport loaded or in standby
just in case you need to return quickly. I did not do this and it added
needless stress loading everything.

This was one of a handful of things my CFII really hammered on about.
Anytime you departed in IMC, the rule was to have the plate for the approach
in use up on the yoke, with one box tuned to the approach in use, and one
box tuned to get you to the first fix in your clearance.

Still, it's good to get tested under pressure and pass. You can't be
prepared for every event. I got my IR back in September and haven't done
solo IMC yet, but I do hope my first experience will be a bit smoother than
yours!

-cwk.