IFR Cancellation Question

A Lieberma wrote:



IFR would be then cancelled once wheels touch ground???

ATC takes no overt action to cancel an IFR aircraft landing at a towered
field. You just land.

Robert Chambers wrote:

Or unless you cancel in the air which is sometimes easier to do at a
field with no RCO or a tower that is closed.

You can also cancel in the air to help people out, I've been on an IFR
plan (but by the time I was approaching the field was VFR conditions)
and I heard a Jet at the hold short "ready for release" the tower said
"I have one IFR arrival inbound, expect a 3 minute delay" once that was
acknowledged I said "N1234 is cancelling IFR at this time" got the
cancellation and they released the jet to go before I got there. The
jet jockey (which surprised me) threw me a thank you before he got
switched over to approach.

Anything to make the system work that makes sense is ok in my book.



Three lousy minutes? The tower should have used visual separation and
let the jet go.

Mark Hansen wrote:



So I wonder if the confusion came when ATC told Allen to Squawk VFR?
This just means that you're no longer in radar contact, and not that
you're no longer IFR, right?

No, that measn the controller thought you were VFR.




Or, are you supposed to maintain your transponder code until changed
by ATC or you cancel IFR - even if radar service is terminated?

If you are terminated you still stay on your code unless you are now
going to be VFR.

Steven P. McNicoll wrote:
Yes, you can get an altitude assignment while VFR, but you can't (properly)
get one from Seattle Center while VFR. Reporting the field serves a purpose
if you're IFR, but not if you're VFR.

When I get flight following from New York Approach, they always ask me to
report the field in sight. (This is for both controlled and uncontrolled
fields.) This is for airports that are NOT in the Bravo airspace --
they're either near or underneath it.

I assume the purpose it serves is it tells them when they can terminate
flight following.

.... Alan
--
Alan Gerber
PP-ASEL
gerber AT panix DOT com

Robert Chambers wrote in news%keh.20495
:

You can also cancel in the air to help people out, I've been on an IFR
plan (but by the time I was approaching the field was VFR conditions)
and I heard a Jet at the hold short "ready for release" the tower said
"I have one IFR arrival inbound, expect a 3 minute delay" once that was
acknowledged I said "N1234 is cancelling IFR at this time" got the
cancellation and they released the jet to go before I got there. The
jet jockey (which surprised me) threw me a thank you before he got
switched over to approach.

Anything to make the system work that makes sense is ok in my book.

Absolutely agree Robert. I like to be a "good neighbor" but not at the
cost of safety of course.

Once I get a visual on my airport (KMBO - uncontrolled), I do cancel IFR
as soon as I can.

The very same situation happened to me, and I was on the ground, and I
had really appreciated it myself so because one person did it for me, I
am determine to "pay it forward" any chance I get so long as my skin is
not jeapordized.

I generally can tell approach also appreciates my cancellation by the
sound of their voice when they say "cancellation received" as I am sure
it helps them as well.

One other time, I was on the ground, picking up my clearance on a MVFR
day, and CD was kind enough to clue me in to depart visually (was never
taught this in my IFR training) and pick up my clearance in the air as
there would have been a 15 minute delay for incoming IFR traffic.
Ceilings were 2500, so I had no problem with the choice given.

Allen

Mark Hansen wrote in
:

So I wonder if the confusion came when ATC told Allen to Squawk VFR?
This just means that you're no longer in radar contact, and not that
you're no longer IFR, right?

Mark,

My experiences operating in areas of no radar coverage (NOT what happened
here in my original post) is that you maintain your transponder code and
work with "reporting points" as required under IFR enroute rules.

I was in Charlie airspace when I was told to squawk VFR in my original
post, thus my confusion

Or, are you supposed to maintain your transponder code until changed
by ATC or you cancel IFR - even if radar service is terminated?

For no radar coverage, you maintain your transponder code. I had asked
when this happened to me the first time and Center advised me to retain
the code and when I come out of the non radar environment, he would pick
me up. I'd rather sound dumb on the radio then do something dumb :-))

I think the only thing that was missing in Allen's case was the
clearance to fly the visual approach.

EXACTLY right! AND the IFR cancellation received, squawk VFR" buzz words
I learn to know and love.

Those rank up there with "cleared to land" at a controlled airport :-)

Allen

Alan Gerber wrote in
:

I assume the purpose it serves is it tells them when they can
terminate flight following.

Alan,

VFR flight following is workload permitted basis.

So, like you, I have experienced the same, approach asking me to advise
airport in sight. Approach can tell you to squawk VFR, have a good day
well before you have a visual on VFR flight following. In my area, I have
never had that done except once when I was arriving after the ATC shut down
for the night.

Generally IN MY AREA, if it's that busy, approach much rather you squawk
and talk then not. But I am only dealing with C airspace.

For IFR, a visual approach requires sight of the airport / runway
environment, and ATC cannot terminate your IFR until you request it (I.E
cancel IFR like in my case at an uncontrolled airport) or land at a
controlled airport.

Allen

A Lieberma wrote:
Alan Gerber wrote in
I assume the purpose it serves is it tells them when they can
terminate flight following.
VFR flight following is workload permitted basis.

I guess I worded that poorly. Of course they can terminate flight
following whenever they need to. Once the field is in sight, you pretty
much *need* to terminate flight following -- either to contact the tower,
for a towered field, or to start talking on CTAF, otherwise.

So, like you, I have experienced the same, approach asking me to advise
airport in sight. Approach can tell you to squawk VFR, have a good day
well before you have a visual on VFR flight following. In my area, I have
never had that done except once when I was arriving after the ATC shut down
for the night.

I've had that done on occasion -- including my long student X-C solo. I
assumed they weren't able to do the handoff, especially since they gave me
the frequency to try myself later.

.... Alan
--
Alan Gerber
PP-ASEL
gerber AT panix DOT com

On 12/08/06 17:50, A Lieberma wrote:
Alan Gerber wrote in
:

I assume the purpose it serves is it tells them when they can
terminate flight following.

Alan,

VFR flight following is workload permitted basis.

So, like you, I have experienced the same, approach asking me to advise
airport in sight. Approach can tell you to squawk VFR, have a good day
well before you have a visual on VFR flight following. In my area, I have
never had that done except once when I was arriving after the ATC shut down
for the night.

Generally IN MY AREA, if it's that busy, approach much rather you squawk
and talk then not. But I am only dealing with C airspace.

For IFR, a visual approach requires sight of the airport / runway
environment,

.... or sight of the airplane ahead of you...

and ATC cannot terminate your IFR until you request it (I.E
cancel IFR like in my case at an uncontrolled airport) or land at a
controlled airport.

Allen



--
Mark Hansen, PP-ASEL, Instrument Airplane
Cal Aggie Flying Farmers
Sacramento, CA

Newps wrote:


Three lousy minutes? The tower should have used visual separation and
let the jet go.


Our tower is special, there's lots of things they "should" do but don't.