IFR Cancellation Question

Matt Whiting wrote:



In the case of the nonradar tower, does the flight just "expire" in the
computer or does the approach controller kill the flight once the
hand-off to tower has been confirmed?


You are thinking it's like a VFR flight plan where somebody has to take
some action to stop SAR from beginning. Nobody is on the clock with an
IFR flight plan.


If the pilot misses the approach
and then pops back to approach, do they have to enter the flight back
into the computer?

No.

Everett M. Greene wrote:



He does no such thing. No calls, whatsoever. There's no need to.


Are you saying that a telephone call isn't made or are
you saying that nobody in the tower closes the flight
plan?

Both. Nobody does anything.

Roy Smith wrote:




It might be tough to maintain visual in cruddy weather when the thing
you're trying to watch is moving 60 kts faster than you :-)


Depends on who's flying. The local cargo guys here do that all the
time. Report the guy in sight so you get your visual and the math you
did in your head tells you that the aircraft you are following is far
enough ahead or faster enough that it doesn't matter if you ever see him.

Everett M. Greene wrote:

Are you saying that a telephone call isn't made or are
you saying that nobody in the tower closes the flight
plan?


What is so hard about this? When you cancel IFR inflight all
controllers down the line from whatever point you cancelled must be
notified that you have cancelled. This is normally done by the
computer, controllers receive a "remove strips" message for your
flight. When you land at a controlled field you're at the end of the
line. There are no controllers down the line to advise that you've
cancelled because you're at the end of the line.

A Lieberma wrote:

Again, from your experiences, sounds like I am right....


Right about what? You never answered my question.



Ummm lost pilot doesn't bode well for traffic?????


No, why does what I describe **almost** sound like an emergency
situation for a lost pilot?



Be realistic, clear
day, VMC and the pilot doesn't see the airport within a couple of miles?

Sounds like a problem, not the norm.


No, not if the the pilot doesn't see the field within a couple of
miles, if he doesn't see it until he is within a couple of miles.

Roy Smith wrote:
In article ,
Ron Natalie wrote:

A Lieberma wrote:

What you say Steve could very well be, but in my three short years working
in the IFR system, I have yet to be cleared for a visual with another IFR
plane in front of me in VMC conditions.


Happened to me yesterday at Dulles. Reported the MD80 ahead of me
in sight, got cleared for the visual even though we were both 5 miles
out or so.


It might be tough to maintain visual in cruddy weather when the thing
you're trying to watch is moving 60 kts faster than you :-)


Yes, but you probably won't be following it on a visual approach in
cruddy weather.

Steven P. McNicoll wrote:
Everett M. Greene wrote:

Are you saying that a telephone call isn't made or are
you saying that nobody in the tower closes the flight
plan?



What is so hard about this? When you cancel IFR inflight all
controllers down the line from whatever point you cancelled must be
notified that you have cancelled. This is normally done by the
computer, controllers receive a "remove strips" message for your
flight. When you land at a controlled field you're at the end of the
line. There are no controllers down the line to advise that you've
cancelled because you're at the end of the line.

Does the last computer to handle your IFR flight simply can it after
some time period has expired? I'm just curious what event removes the
last trace of my IFR flight from the ATC computers.


Matt

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in
ps.com:

Ummm lost pilot doesn't bode well for traffic?????


No, why does what I describe **almost** sound like an emergency
situation for a lost pilot?

Ummm, situational awareness comes to mind???? A pilot bumbling around a
busy airport and not seeing the airport sure sounds like an emergency
situation developing to me.

Surely you can't see a bumbling pilot poking along through a pattern of
an airport not causing problems or an emergency situation that may
directly affect the safety of flight. Big sky theory will fail.

Note, it may not even be the bumbling pilot, but another pilot that has
to take evasive action due to the lack of situational awareness from the
lost pilot. Yep, a developing emergency.

Be realistic, clear
day, VMC and the pilot doesn't see the airport within a couple of
miles?

Sounds like a problem, not the norm.


No, not if the the pilot doesn't see the field within a couple of
miles, if he doesn't see it until he is within a couple of miles.

obviously you are playing some type of semantic game as I really have no
clue what you are trying to say above.....

My take for what it's worth, if a pilot does not see an airport within a
couple of miles FROM THE AIRPORT, then you have a potential emergency
situation developing. Loss of situational awareness surely can be
considered an emergency. As stated in an earlier post, this is not
normal that I have seen in my short 5 years of flying.

If you are trying to say that the pilot doesn't see an airport from lets
say 15 miles vs 13 miles out from the airport, then yeah, that isn't a
problem.

Allen

In article ,
Matt Whiting wrote:

Steven P. McNicoll wrote:
Everett M. Greene wrote:

Are you saying that a telephone call isn't made or are
you saying that nobody in the tower closes the flight
plan?



What is so hard about this? When you cancel IFR inflight all
controllers down the line from whatever point you cancelled must be
notified that you have cancelled. This is normally done by the
computer, controllers receive a "remove strips" message for your
flight. When you land at a controlled field you're at the end of the
line. There are no controllers down the line to advise that you've
cancelled because you're at the end of the line.

Does the last computer to handle your IFR flight simply can it after
some time period has expired? I'm just curious what event removes the
last trace of my IFR flight from the ATC computers.


Matt

There is an anti-flight plan floating around in a parallel universe. When
your wheels touch the ground the two universes come into contact and the
flight plan and the anti-flight plan annihilate each other.

Matt Whiting wrote:

Does the last computer to handle your IFR flight simply can it after
some time period has expired? I'm just curious what event removes the
last trace of my IFR flight from the ATC computers.


It times out.