The Boeing Triple 7

"Dave S" wrote in message news:GCjle.47

Also, at altitude, the system is DEFINITELY in the heat mode, as the
outside air temp is well below 0*F.

OAT will run about -50 to -55F at altitude. Surprisingly, though, with a
near full airplane, you don't have to pump as much heat as you'd think.
Body heat from 400 folks @98.6 builds up fast in a closed tube.

wrote in message
...
[...]
Not sure if the sock really sees much/any moisture at altitude, but
have had personal experience with them freezing during TO & climb.

That's what I'm saying. For a jet to have any noticeable difference in
"dryness" from another jet, the difference would have to exist during
cruise. Yes, it can be quite humid down near the ground, but a) the air in
the cabin doesn't get dehumidified that much (hardly at all compared to what
happens at altitude, just through the naturally low humidity up there) and
b) the plane (and thus the passengers) spend very little time in that
environment.

Pete

In article , Matt Barrow wrote:
And, yes, even being honest, an executive can **** up a company royally (HP,
Diebold, Apple, DEC...)

Actually, Apple is a great example of this. Compare the difference
between Apple's fortunes under John Sculley and more recently under
Steve Jobs. It's like night and day.

--
Dylan Smith, Castletown, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net
"Maintain thine airspeed, lest the ground come up and smite thee"

Hi Jim,

The lightplates on the overhead have transflective lightpipes with
lettering that is lit up at night by LEDs. The 777 was the first
Boeing airplane to utilize LED lighting instead of incandescent bulbs
for the lightplates. The lines you see represent power busses,
hydraulic lines, and the like. The large pushbuttons are used to
connect power busses, fuel systems, and hydraulic systems together (or
separate them) as needed.

The photo(s) were taken by the Boeing photography staff. The flight
deck was shot in one of the simulators, and the photo of the runway at
Boeing field was then photoshopped together with the simulator photo to
create the final image. You can buy this poster at the Boeing gift
shop online if you want it. I think Sportys also carries it...

Dean

"John Gaquin" wrote in message
...

"Chris" wrote in message


The 777.... has a reputation for being very dry. Try it on an 11 hour
flight. Last month I got through three litres of water during a flight
from Beijing to London

That's actually a little on the low side. When I was flying the 747-100
and -200, we'd each drink about 4-5 litres on a 7-8 hour flight. Maybe
the 777 is not so dry as you think.

I slept for 7 hours of the 11.

The interesting thing is that Steve Jobs isn't drawing a salary, whereas Mr.
Sculley was paid handsomely.

A huge issue in whether or not a company is successful is the attitude and
esprit des corps of the employees. When the executives are getting bonuses
for successfully cutting the employees salaries, you're headed for a death
spiral.

Mike Schumann

"Dylan Smith" wrote in message
...
In article , Matt Barrow wrote:
And, yes, even being honest, an executive can **** up a company royally
(HP,
Diebold, Apple, DEC...)

Actually, Apple is a great example of this. Compare the difference
between Apple's fortunes under John Sculley and more recently under
Steve Jobs. It's like night and day.

--
Dylan Smith, Castletown, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net
"Maintain thine airspeed, lest the ground come up and smite thee"

Boeing lists the cruising speed for both the 777 and 747 as .84 mach at
35,000 feet.

The 747SP cruises at .86

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Also, at altitude, the system is DEFINITELY in the heat mode, as the
outside air temp is well below 0*F.


The air going into the air-cycle system from the engines runs about
600 degrees from compression no matter what altitude. In other words,
they are DEFINITELY ALWAYS cooling.

Since the air cycle machines are such great coolers, hot air has to be
introduced down stream of their outlet to keep everything from
freezing up. They also have a water separator that centrifuges any
water out so you don't get ice in the cabin ducts.

At normal cruise altitudes the temperature is -57C and the humidity
runs less than 1%. At those altitudes, the water separator is just
along for the ride as it has nothing to do. A large aircraft flows
about 120 ppm from the air system and out the leaks and outflow
valves, so I doubt very much that people respiration changes the
humidity much at all.

Bombardier attempted to put a humidifier in the Global Express, a
corporate aircraft that can fly M.86 for 14 hours. In the aft
equipment bay was a boiler device heated by bleed air and water from
the normal water system did the trick. The only problem was the
moisture in the air froze all over the structure that was touching
that -57C temp outside. No problem until decent when the ice melts
and rains water all over the interior materials and ruins them. They
are all de-activated now.

By the way, the ozone at altitude is very high, so modern jets have
cat converters installed to get rid of it. The air from the engines
is hot enough to make them work. After that it goes through
pre-coolers and the air cycle system.


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Don Hammer wrote:

Bombardier attempted to put a humidifier in the Global Express, a
corporate aircraft that can fly M.86 for 14 hours. In the aft
equipment bay was a boiler device heated by bleed air and water from
the normal water system did the trick. The only problem was the
moisture in the air froze all over the structure that was touching
that -57C temp outside. No problem until decent when the ice melts
and rains water all over the interior materials and ruins them. They
are all de-activated now.


The problem was that were not used as per manual, they had to be
switched on after a certain flight time and switched of a prescribed
time before descent.
When that was not done properly you had rain and Bombardier worried
about corrosion.
Most were deactivated, but now can be reactivated.
In the new XRS humidifiers are standard equipment.

"Paul kgyy" wrote in message

The 777 is awesome for its size but slow for international trips - flew
on one to England a couple years ago and en route saw a 747 overhauling
us easily - might have cut an hour off the travel time.

Highly unlikely on both counts. More likely an illusion.

Vertical and horizontal spacing requirements and the mode of operation in
the NATrack system make it highly unlikely that one aircraft will overtake
another, and if it will happen, the separation will be such that visual
perception will be unreliable. It is possible that you saw another aircraft
in the distance that happened to be enjoying a substantially higher tailwind
component. When operating to Europe, you would generally be assigned a
track route, altitude, AND an in-trail mach number, thus ensuring lateral
and longitudinal separation while out of radar coverage.

Both the 747 and the 777 have a nominal best cruise speed, expressed in M,
but both are capable of operating within a range of speeds to accomodate
traffic requirements. When I flew the 747 (--100s and -200s), we had tables
to cover speeds from M.80 to M.85. Although I have no first-hand knowledge
of the 777, that cruise speed range is pretty representative of most
sub-sonic jet transports. The actual speed difference between M.80 and M.85
is only about 40 kt or so (slightly variable). That difference over an
entire 2700 nm trip would only yield an advantage of about 25 minutes, max.