I give up, after many, many years!

On May 13, 11:44 pm, "Morgans" wrote:

After tomorrow, I won't need to.

As far as that subject goes, I don't see MX or his dribble,

Well, before you go, it's "drivel"

On May 13, 11:44*pm, "Morgans" wrote:
"romeomike" wrote in message

...

Morgans wrote:
This is not aimed at Dan, but instead, everyone that has put up a
response to the lame thread about pilot's watches, started by MX.

Once I posted a complaint about the OT posts of one of your buddies here,
and you replied with a condescending offer to show me how to use a kill
file. Why don't you just follow your own advice?

After tomorrow, I won't need to.

As far as that subject goes, I don't see MX or his dribble, nor do I see
many of his prime supporters and troll buddies. *I have a larger kill file
by tenfold, than I have ever had before. *I do see some of it in the replies
sent his way, regardless.

There is no way to filter out every one of those, without filtering most of
the group.

Past that, what I object to, is what his presence has done to this group, as
I already stated. *Many good people are not willing to wade through the
crap, and are no longer participating. *There is less and less reason to
look here, any longer. *Tomorrow, I will be gone, with them.

Long ago, when a personality like this appeared, he was shown the door, and
it was made to stick.

No longer, unfortunately.

Oh, by the way, thanks, you are in my trash bin, thanks to your timely
reminder.
--
Jim in NC

I have been posting here since 1994, so I've seen many kinds. Long
ago, when personalities like this appeared, they were dealt with
professionally. MX's naiive questions could be answered in a simple
one-liner, or ignored. But his groupies are constantly barraging with
endless taunts and insults. With the abundance of throw-away email
addresses and perfect anonymity, insults and taunts have now become
the norm.

On May 13, 11:50 pm, HARRY POTTER wrote:

I agree with you on Bertie, but not MX. I honestly think MX posts here
because he genuinely wants to learn about piloting. All his threads starts
on a reasonable tone. Its other people who turn it into a ****fest, which
he then responds to. His "trolling", I feel, is mainly caused by his
frustration of the fact that people judge his opinions solely on who he is,
rather than what he posts. If people treated his opinions like they would
anybody else, he'd stop being so blatantly obtuse.

You haven't been here long enough. Many times Mx or Le Chaud
Lapin will ask a question, get the right answer in a polite manner,
and then argue endlessly against that answer, belittling the teacher.
What reaction would you expect?
Many of the physics and other things in aviation are not
intuitive; that is, they don't make sense to the uninitiated, and
without well-rounded groundschooling and flight instruction they never
will make sense. Flight simulators don't teach these things. Add to
that the fact that there are people who are certain that they're much
smarter than the average bear and so they have "new" answers to
aviation's problems. Those new answers killed a lot of guys a long
time ago but they don't know that. To them, "well-rounded
groundschooling" is equal to standard party propaganda and therefore
false.
Do some searching on past posts and see what I mean. The only
reason I answer him at all, when he asks a legitimate question, is
that there are others lurking here who likely have the same questions
in their minds. Something I've leaned as a classroom teacher: If one
asks, some of the others want the answer, too.
If those lurkers are still here, that is, after all the
electronic mudslinging recently.

Dan

I humbly suggest that you change that criteria.

Geez, Jim -- with ALL the crap that's been going on here lately, you let a
post about a WATCH push you over the edge?

Have another beer and relax. You coming to OSH this year?
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Then why DO you do it? How exactly do you get satisfaction out of making
100
pointless oneliners every day to many people who don't even reply back? I
have not seen MX, Jay Honeck, or many others reply to a single one of
your "trolls" (or whatever you prefer to call them), yet you still
persist.

You're wasting your breath (and, worse, making the troll's posts visible to
those who have killfiled him) -- there is no logic to mental illness.
That's why it's classified as an "illness"...

Trolls are like mosquitoes. Killfiles are like "Off!". I use both, and
spend much less time itching. I suggest you follow suit.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

writes:

You haven't been here long enough. Many times Mx or Le Chaud
Lapin will ask a question, get the right answer in a polite manner,
and then argue endlessly against that answer, belittling the teacher.

That's not true, at least in my case (I haven't audited all the threads in
which Le Chaud Lapin participates).

Many times, I get an answer that the poster believes to be correct, but it
conflicts with other sources I've consulted, so naturally I question it. Or I
get an answer that sounds intriguing, but when I ask for an explanation, the
person who gave me the answer has none--he learned it from someone and simply
accepted it, without caring about or looking up the supporting theory (if
any). Or I get multiple conflicting answers from several people, who then
start arguing with each other and trading insults--they cannot all be
simultaneously right.

I don't belittle anyone, but some people here are so incredibly insecure that
anything other than total, unconditional acceptance of anything they say is an
intolerable blow to their fragile egos, and they become defensive, resorting
to personal attacks, when confronted with anything less than total acceptance.
They are so sensitive, in fact, that they interpret every request for
clarification as a personal affront. People like this are hard to deal with
because they are so hypersensitive and emotional; however, they often don't
know much about anything, so dealing with them isn't always necessary.
Unfortunately, they are often among the first to respond. Once they learn
that their responses may not be instantly and totally accepted, their
subsequent responses consist of nothing more than personal attacks.

Many of the physics and other things in aviation are not
intuitive; that is, they don't make sense to the uninitiated, and
without well-rounded groundschooling and flight instruction they never
will make sense.

It's worse than that. I've discovered that many pilots just don't understand
those concepts, and asking about them only irritates them as they realize how
little they understand. The reality is that many of these concepts don't have
to be understood just to fly an airplane, and of those that might be useful to
understand, few are mandatory for safe flight.

Pilots are instructed by rote, just as most people are instructed by rote in
most things. The threshold of aptitude required to absorbe rote learning is
much lower than that required to understand theory, which is why it is usually
used. And rote learning accomplishes the purpose, as long as experience is
limited to situations covered by that learning. It only fails in situations
where inferences must be made for unforeseen situations based on theory, and
these are thankfully rare.

Flight simulators don't teach these things.

Nobody teaches them, apparently, or at least nobody in flight instruction.

At one time I believed that flight instruction was far more comprehensive. I
now know, from what I see here and from my own investigations of the training
materials, that it is much simpler than I believed it to be. This shouldn't
surprise me (because almost all training is like this), but it does.

No amount of insult, personal attacks, or trolling intimidates me, so I don't
know why people bother. It actually seems to bother them far more than it
does me, when they discover that I don't care.

I'd be content to discuss aviation, but some people turn every discussion into
a discussion of personalities instead.

You haven't been here long enough. Many times Mx or Le Chaud
Lapin will ask a question, get the right answer in a polite manner,
and then argue endlessly against that answer, belittling the teacher.

I have been here forever, and I have NEVER seen MX belittle anyone.

Not once.

Now, either that's because I don't read every, single thread MX responds to,
or it's because my definition of "belittling" differs from yours -- but I
have only seen polite responses from him in the face of some VERY demeaning
attacks.

In this regard, he certainly doesn't fit the M.O. of most trolls.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

"Jay Honeck" wrote in
news:iQDWj.163659$yE1.32309@attbi_s21:

Then why DO you do it? How exactly do you get satisfaction out of
making 100
pointless oneliners every day to many people who don't even reply
back? I have not seen MX, Jay Honeck, or many others reply to a
single one of your "trolls" (or whatever you prefer to call them),
yet you still persist.

You're wasting your breath (and, worse, making the troll's posts
visible to those who have killfiled him) -- there is no logic to
mental illness. That's why it's classified as an "illness"...

Trolls are like mosquitoes. Killfiles are like "Off!". I use both,
and spend much less time itching. I suggest you follow suit.

He did, fjukktard. That's why he can't see your poasts.

Can't you read?

Bertie

"Jay Honeck" wrote in
news:NUDWj.109571$TT4.43765@attbi_s22:

You haven't been here long enough. Many times Mx or Le Chaud
Lapin will ask a question, get the right answer in a polite manner,
and then argue endlessly against that answer, belittling the teacher.

I have been here forever, and I have NEVER seen MX belittle anyone.

Not once.

I've seen him try, but of course, those went over your pointy head.

Now, either that's because I don't read every, single thread MX
responds to, or it's because my definition of "belittling" differs
from yours -- but I have only seen polite responses from him in the
face of some VERY demeaning attacks.

In this regard, he certainly doesn't fit the M.O. of most trolls.


You wouldn't know wat a troll was if it bit you in the nuts.



Bertie

Actually, the last pilot watch thread that I can remember was started
by Jay H. (I gotta admit I dont reference this list that often). I
went and got a pretty decent watch , on sale no less, after reading
that thread. I wear it every time I go flying.

Right -- me, too. It was a good thread, and I ended up with a great,
affordable flying watch, thanks to the recommendations from this group.

Honestly, I don't understand why Jim (or anyone else) gets so riled up over
MX. His threads are almost 100% on-topic, and who really cares if he's not
a "real" pilot? The true harm comes from the trolls who follow him
everywhere like butt-sniffing dogs, creating an atmosphere of bitterness and
anger that poisons the free exchange of information in this group.

How many great posts have been aborted, how many great posters have we lost,
simply because they see what's posted here in response to apparently benign
questions by guys like MX? Hell, if the group was like this ten years ago,
I sure wouldn't have posted all the (probably stupid) questions that I did
back then.

Back then, however, guys like Denny, and gals like Snowbird, and a host of
other incredibly experienced pilots patiently helped me learn the mysteries
and intricacies of flying and aircraft ownership. They reveled in their
ability to share their knowledge, and everyone was polite and grateful for
their help.

Later, after they had passed their knowledge on, many of us became the
"experts" that newbies approached for answers. It was, quite literally, the
perfect use for Usenet, and these groups flourished for many years. There
were simply no trolls, and no killfiles were necessary.

Oh, sure, there was the occasional spirited foray into politics, especially
during the divisive 2000 and 2004 elections -- but it was (mostly) conducted
politely and with good humor. Religion even popped in here once in a
while -- but piloting never lost center stage.

Until now.

What's especially painful is that the worst trolls here are apparently real
pilots. I've always believed that pilots were a cut-above the common man
or woman, and I've built a successful business based on that model. Every
time I come here now, though, I'm shown harsh evidence that mental illness
and a pilot's certificate are not mutually exclusive. THAT is what is so
sad -- and a little scary -- about the current state of our group.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"