I passed the checkride, now need a good GPS and passenger headset

Vincent,

But some things,
such as the average private pilot's pilotage skills, certainly were.


How about they were just different? I think a pilot who is not able to
work the Garmin 430 in his airplane is lacking skills. But it's a
different set of skills than the one needed to work the ADF.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

vincent p. norris wrote:
Vincent,

But some things,
such as the average private pilot's pilotage skills, certainly were.

How about they were just different? I think a pilot who is not able to
work the Garmin 430 in his airplane is lacking skills. But it's a
different set of skills than the one needed to work the ADF.

My point is that a new private pilot who does not have an IFR rating
does not need an ADF, either! He needs to learn basic skills.

Good luck convincing anyone of that....

Absolutely. Someone who does NOT know where they are without their GPS
is one electrical problem (or electronic failure) away from having no
positional awareness.

The plane I fly most times has a VFR GPS, which occasionally works, and
when it does work, I have it on. When it doesn't work I still make
damn sure I know where I am by virtue of the sectional and when accurate
distances are needed by the DME.

No excuse for not knowing where you are. I doubt that "well my GPS
failed" would work as an excuse in a certificate action for busting
airspace.

vincent p. norris wrote:
Vincent,


But some things,
such as the average private pilot's pilotage skills, certainly were.

How about they were just different? I think a pilot who is not able to

work the Garmin 430 in his airplane is lacking skills. But it's a
different set of skills than the one needed to work the ADF.


My point is that a new private pilot who does not have an IFR rating
does not need an ADF, either! He needs to learn basic skills.

He will not learn them if he can crank a destination into a GPS and
fly there as is led by the hand.

I think he'll get a lot more pleasure, satisfaction, and a sense of
accomplishment from finding his destination without the help of
gadgets (unless you consider a compass and a chart as "gadgets").

And he'll be a safer pilot, less likely to have to make a forced
landing after his GPS fails and he runs out of fuel trying to figure
out where he is.

And if you think it's reasonable to say a pilot is lacking skills if
he can't operate a Garmin 430, then I'll suggest you're incompetent
because you can't do celestial navigation.

vince norris

Vincent,

I think he'll get a lot more pleasure, satisfaction, and a sense of
accomplishment from finding his destination without the help of
gadgets (unless you consider a compass and a chart as "gadgets").

I agree with the first part. I vehemently disagree with the end: If a
GPS is a "gadget", then chart and compass are, too. GPS is an integral
part of the world of today's pilots. Get over it.

And he'll be a safer pilot, less likely to have to make a forced
landing after his GPS fails and he runs out of fuel trying to figure
out where he is.

That scenario has nothing to do with GPS use.

And if you think it's reasonable to say a pilot is lacking skills if
he can't operate a Garmin 430, then I'll suggest you're incompetent
because you can't do celestial navigation.

Apples and oranges...

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

Robert,

Someone who does NOT know where they are without their GPS


Nobody ever doubted that.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

If a
GPS is a "gadget", then chart and compass are, too.

If a chart and compass are gadgets, then so are wings and tail. In my
book, the "gadgetness" of an aviation object has some relationship to
its necessity, complexity, and pronocity for failure. That which is
fundamentally necessary has lower gadgetocity. That which is fluff,
complex, and only peripherally related to the fundamental object in
question has higher gadgetocity.

Jose
--
The monkey turns the crank and thinks he's making the music.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

Jose wrote
If a chart and compass are gadgets, then so are wings and tail. In my
book, the "gadgetness" of an aviation object has some relationship to its
necessity, complexity, and pronocity for failure. That which is
fundamentally necessary has lower gadgetocity. That which is fluff,
complex, and only peripherally related to the fundamental object in
question has higher gadgetocity.

As a gadgetologist, I love gadgets -- especially aviation gadgets -- and the
higher the gagetocity the better. No single gadget has given me more
pleasure than my Garmin 296, both in the plane and in the car.

To the OP: I think you need an aviation GPS.

"Jon Woellhaf" wrote:

No single gadget has given me more pleasure than my Garmin 296, both in
the plane and in the car.


Beware the 396, then. It might be more than you can stand.

--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

"vincent p. norris" wrote

And if you think it's reasonable to say a pilot is lacking skills if
he can't operate a Garmin 430, then I'll suggest you're incompetent
because you can't do celestial navigation

If you have a Garmin 430 in your panel, you had better be able to use it,
while you are taking your private checkride, or BFR, or you won't pass,
right?

Skills are skills, and using a GPS to help you find your place on the
charts, or find the nearest airport, or where the special area's boundaries
are today, are *today's* skills, like it or not.
--
Jim in NC

Skills are skills, and using a GPS to help you find your place on the
charts, or find the nearest airport, or where the special area's boundaries
are today, are *today's* skills, like it or not.

Skills are skills? The skill of the first-grader who can sing two
verses of "America" is equivalent to that of the teenager who can play
Tchaikovsky's First Piano Concerto?

The statement that using a GPS is a "skill" is almost humorous. Using
a GPS demands only slightly more skill than turning on an electric
light.

I'm not condemning the GPS; I'm disagreeing with the view expressed in
the post that initiated this thread that a brand new private pilot
"needs" a GPS--i.e., that it is a "necessity."

I live in central PA, where "Sentimental Journey" was just concluded
at Lock Haven airport. This year, as often before, some pilots flew
their J-3s from CALIFORNIA to central PA without GPS, without radios.
Obviously, GPS is not a "necesssity."

I have a Garmin 396; before that, a 195. For one reason: If I have a
radio or an electrical failure in IMC, I'll have a back-up. In VMC,
it's just an expensive toy.

vince norris