Getting the MOCA

However, if both a MEA and a MOCA are prescribed for a particular route or route segment, a person may operate an aircraft below the MEA down to, but not below, the MOCA, when within 22 nautical miles of the VOR concerned (based on the pilot's reasonable estimate of that distance).

The last paragraph is particulary on-point and is regulatory.

Ok, but that is for actual operation, not for request. It is legal to
request the MOCA, it is just not legal to operate there when further
than 22 miles from the VOR. One may wonder why one would request an
altitued that one does not intend to use, but no violation has been
committed until the operation takes place.

Jose
--
The monkey turns the crank and thinks he's making the music.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

Steven P. McNicoll wrote:

"Sam Spade" wrote in message
news:LTNmg.34520$AB3.5290@fed1read02...

The MOCA cannot be assigned except within 22 miles of the VOR station, nor
can you legally request it. It's your responsibility to use a Victor
airway within the rules.



You're one for three.

No law limits what may be requested.

ATC can assign the MOCA beyond 22 miles of the VOR if radar navigational
guidance is provided until the aircraft is within 22 miles of it and lost
communications instructions are issued.

If the MOCA is below the MIA do you believe a center controller would
clear an aircraft at MOCA beyond 22 miles?

If a pilot complies with that assignment he will be in violation of FAR
91.177.

That often happens with MIAs and MVAs, but FAA headquarters considers it
a "technical" violation.

"Sam Spade" wrote in message
news:P%Xmg.34553$AB3.17954@fed1read02...

If the MOCA is below the MIA do you believe a center controller would
clear an aircraft at MOCA beyond 22 miles?


Do you understand that he can? Do you understand that a pilot can legally
request the MOCA at any point on an airway?

On 6/23/2006 10:56 AM, Sam Spade wrote the following:

But, it is not the MOCA the center assigns you. It's the MIA.


No it's not. I have gotten lower than MIA. Just this Wednesday, in
fact. It was a VFR day but I was on an IFR flight plan.

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in
k.net:


"Sam Spade" wrote in message
news:F7Umg.34528$AB3.5292@fed1read02...

You have never heard that it would be illegal to request anything?


I haven't. What requests are prohibited by law?

I can't think of any aviation related ones, but I believe there are certain
specific requests that one can make that are indeed illegal.

Most of them are legal in Nevada.

Some of them are illegal even there.

The law is a funny thing.

"Mitty" wrote in message
...

No it's not. I have gotten lower than MIA. Just this Wednesday, in fact.
It was a VFR day but I was on an IFR flight plan.


So you were cleared via airways and got the MEA or the MOCA which was lower
than the MIA?

"Dan" wrote:

What are the odds of getting the MOCA instead of the MEA going from the
Phoenix area to Santa Fe? Anyone know? I like to be IFR for the
services, but the MEAs are a pain....

--Dan


Not good, in my limited experience. I tried filing IFR from Phoenix to Show Low last summer just to see
how I would be handled, and requested direct at 11,000. I was given V190 and assigned 13,000. Hardly
worth the effort for such a short trip.

Mike

Steven P. McNicoll wrote:

"Sam Spade" wrote in message
news:P%Xmg.34553$AB3.17954@fed1read02...

If the MOCA is below the MIA do you believe a center controller would
clear an aircraft at MOCA beyond 22 miles?



Do you understand that he can? Do you understand that a pilot can legally
request the MOCA at any point on an airway?


No, I don't. I keep reading the FARs, unlike you.

Mitty wrote:



On 6/23/2006 10:56 AM, Sam Spade wrote the following:

But, it is not the MOCA the center assigns you. It's the MIA.


No it's not. I have gotten lower than MIA. Just this Wednesday, in
fact. It was a VFR day but I was on an IFR flight plan.

How do you know you were cleared below the MIA. Do you have an MIA chart?

On 6/23/2006 8:25 PM, Steven P. McNicoll wrote the following:
"Mitty" wrote in message
...
No it's not. I have gotten lower than MIA. Just this Wednesday, in fact.
It was a VFR day but I was on an IFR flight plan.


So you were cleared via airways and got the MEA or the MOCA which was lower
than the MIA?


Typing speed ovecame brain speed. I was cleared below the MEA, not
the MIA.