Instrument Approaches in High Winds

On Fri, 4 Aug 2006 01:01:11 -0500, "Jim Macklin"
wrote:

I have taken off with calm winds and had 40 knots 1/2 an
hour later. If you don't teach students to fly in strong
winds, you are not preparing them for changes in the
weather.

First solo at 25 knots isn't a problem, we have probably
flown many dual lessons at 25 knots or more. We also seek
out strong crosswinds.

Long after getting my PPL I requested a X/wind landing for practice to
see what I could cope with. I managed about 15Kt in a PA28 with
demonstrated 17Kt. It went very well and I was pleased but I later
heard a comment from another pilot wondering what I was doing in those
conditions!

A more serious problem was a normal landing with about 25Kt gusting
38Kt less than 30° from the runway heading. All went well untill I
suddenly dropped onto the runway very hard. Normal approach is 63Kt so
I used about 70Kt. The pilot at the side of me said he saw the
airspeed indicator fall from 70Kt to 40Kt. That was not my best
landing :-(

If you want practice in these conditions you should try Maui (Hawaii)
as they apparently always have gusting and cross winds. Makes landing
interesting and watching the commericals coming in fast with less flap
proves the conditions.

I have been flying in the midwest for 20 years and we often have 20 -
35 knot crosswinds. I landed a Grumman Cheetah on a runway with 30G40
crosswinds at about 60 deg to the runway, it skidded a little but was
OK. On the departure there was a taxi-way that led to the run way at
about 50 deg - pretty direct headwind. I used that for departure
figuring it was safer than trying to use the runway. Worked great and
completely legal (for that airport - no tower). At our local airport
we have seen people using the frozen bean field for departure instead
of the runway during high wind days.
So don't be afraid to be a little creative when faced with strong
winds. But be sure you know what you are doing.
Greg J.

On Fri, 4 Aug 2006 01:08:10 -0500, "Jim Macklin"
wrote:

Yes, they do think that. It is a fact that was just as much
wind as was blowing the day they did the proving test for
certification. The FAR 23 sets a minimum wind as a function
of stall speed, but with proper technique the actual limit
is much higher. Just to make the point, if the runway is
3,500 x 150 feet and the crosswind is 40 knots, you can land
at an angle on the runway, reducing the crosswind component.

The maximum demonstrated cross wind component for the Debonair I fly
is 12 knots. It is quite capable of handeling a direct (90 degree)
cross wind of 25 knots. That BTW is both its limit and my limit (when
I've been practicing and am proficient).

The 150s I've flown could handle at least that much, but it took far
more skill to handle them in strong cross winds than it does the Deb.
They are much ligher with far less inertia and react much more quickly
to the wind changes.

My first cross long cross country was in winds that at times reached
30 knots and I had at least a 15 knot, 90 degree cross wind at the
first landing. I took the approach (no pun intended) that I would give
it a try but I didn't have to land and would only do so if every thing
went well. It did.

Flying in high winds is not at all uncommon in the Mid West and
particularly the Great Planes states. If you really want winds use
the airports just off the "Front Range". OTOH They consider less than
75 miles poor visibility while the Great Lakes states consider 1500
and three great VFR.

Any one remember how the story goes about the pilot from the Great
Lakes and the one from out West feeling their way around a hangar in
fog and 10 knot winds or something like that?

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

On 3 Aug 2006 09:07:39 -0700, " wrote:
snip
However, my actual destination was FCH, a nearby uncontrolled
field. The pattern was
uncomfortable, pitch black, high winds, and turbulence. After
landing, I thought - "Gee,
an ILS would have been nice". Or at least a GPS approach. Not because
of bad visibility - it
was severe clear except for being dark - but rather because instrument
approaches do
not feature much maneuvering at low altitudes. And I personally find
turbulence more

Ahhhh...what about those approaches that end with a "circle to
land":-)) Low, close in, and lots of power.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com
comfortable if I'm not turning..... Next time this happens, I might
just swing over to FAT
and use the ILS.

- Jerry Kaidor (
)
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

On 08/05/06 12:22, Roger (K8RI) wrote:
On Fri, 4 Aug 2006 01:08:10 -0500, "Jim Macklin"
wrote:


Flying in high winds is not at all uncommon in the Mid West and
particularly the Great Planes states. If you really want winds use
the airports just off the "Front Range". OTOH They consider less than
75 miles poor visibility while the Great Lakes states consider 1500
and three great VFR.

Any one remember how the story goes about the pilot from the Great
Lakes and the one from out West feeling their way around a hangar in
fog and 10 knot winds or something like that?

They both agreed that what they were feeling was an elephant, right?

;-)

--
Mark Hansen, PP-ASEL, Instrument Airplane
Cal Aggie Flying Farmers
Sacramento, CA

What is the stratregy for figuring out how to safely use the taxiway?
Since I've never done this before, I am wondering how you inspect for
available length and obstacles along the departure path.


gregscheetah wrote:
I have been flying in the midwest for 20 years and we often have 20 -
35 knot crosswinds. I landed a Grumman Cheetah on a runway with 30G40
crosswinds at about 60 deg to the runway, it skidded a little but was
OK. On the departure there was a taxi-way that led to the run way at
about 50 deg - pretty direct headwind. I used that for departure
figuring it was safer than trying to use the runway. Worked great and
completely legal (for that airport - no tower). At our local airport
we have seen people using the frozen bean field for departure instead
of the runway during high wind days.
So don't be afraid to be a little creative when faced with strong
winds. But be sure you know what you are doing.
Greg J.

Andrew Sarangan wrote:
What is the stratregy for figuring out how to safely use the taxiway?
Since I've never done this before, I am wondering how you inspect for
available length and obstacles along the departure path.



I think the strategy is to look. And know your airplane. And use the
sectional.
If you are not sure, or can not determine runway length visually, you
should not stray from the normal runways. Only try something outside of
the normal boundaries if you are confident, capable, experienced and
comfortable. If you feel that odd, nervous tightness in your belly,
don' t do it.

Greg J.