Why did Britain win the BoB?

"Keith Willshaw" wrote in message
...

However the RAF could still have sallied forth to defend
against an invasion and the Germans simply had neither the
resources to get the invasion force across the channel or
any way of stopping the RN from chopping their force to bits.


Wouldn't the Luftwaffe be a way of stopping the RN from chopping their force
to bits?

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
.net...

"Keith Willshaw" wrote in message
...

However the RAF could still have sallied forth to defend
against an invasion and the Germans simply had neither the
resources to get the invasion force across the channel or
any way of stopping the RN from chopping their force to bits.


Wouldn't the Luftwaffe be a way of stopping the RN from chopping their
force
to bits?



Nope. At best the Luftwaffe could intervene in daylight if
they managed to win and maintain air superiority BUT the
invasion force was going to take more than 24 hours to
reach the invasion beaches and the cruisers and destroyers
sortieing from Harwich cwould be in amongst them at
night in the same way the Japanese steamed down the
slot at Guadalcanal. The Germans had no equivalent naval force
to counter those raids.

Keith

"Keith Willshaw" wrote in message
...

Nope. At best the Luftwaffe could intervene in daylight if
they managed to win and maintain air superiority


Aren't we now working under the premise that the Luftwaffe won the BoB and
has air superiority over the channel and southern England?



BUT the
invasion force was going to take more than 24 hours to
reach the invasion beaches and the cruisers and destroyers
sortieing from Harwich cwould be in amongst them at
night in the same way the Japanese steamed down the
slot at Guadalcanal. The Germans had no equivalent naval force
to counter those raids.


Why must the German invasion force operate at night?

In message , Steven
P. McNicoll writes
Wouldn't the Luftwaffe be a way of stopping the RN from chopping their force
to bits?

The Luftwaffe was fully committed to destroying British coastal
defences, since the landing force would have almost no artillery or
armour, and its naval gunfire support was limited to a couple of dozen
barges carrying 37mm guns.

It was _also_ fully committed to sinking the Royal Navy when it came out
to attack the fleet of barges and flat-bottomed boats; the Luftwaffe had
36 destroyers to sink _immediately_ (the anti-invasion flotilla held
ready with no other mission) plus the rest of the Home Fleet within 24
hours, if those ships were to be kept away from the transports. (We'll
ignore all of Coastal Forces' lighter craft)

Finally, the Luftwaffe was also completely committed to destroying the
RAF on the ground and in the air during the invasion.


So, all the Germans had to do was triple the size of the Luftwaffe and
build themselves a decent Navy and be phenomenally lucky....


It just don't add up.

--
When you have to kill a man, it costs nothing to be polite.
W S Churchill

Paul J. Adam MainBoxatjrwlynch[dot]demon{dot}co(.)uk

On Mon, 06 Oct 2003 14:00:35 GMT, "Steven P. McNicoll"
wrote:


"Keith Willshaw" wrote in message
...

However the RAF could still have sallied forth to defend
against an invasion and the Germans simply had neither the
resources to get the invasion force across the channel or
any way of stopping the RN from chopping their force to bits.


Wouldn't the Luftwaffe be a way of stopping the RN from chopping their force
to bits?

No, not at the time. the Luftwaffe did not have "air superiority" over
the Channel, or over Britain. Would the RN have lost ships? Probably,
but not enough to deter or defeat them.

The Germans had no effective landing craft or amphibious warfare
ships, and would have been annihilated in trying to cross.

Al Minyard

Alan Minyard wrote:

On Mon, 06 Oct 2003 14:00:35 GMT, "Steven P. McNicoll"
wrote:


"Keith Willshaw" wrote in message
...

However the RAF could still have sallied forth to defend
against an invasion and the Germans simply had neither the
resources to get the invasion force across the channel or
any way of stopping the RN from chopping their force to bits.


Wouldn't the Luftwaffe be a way of stopping the RN from chopping their force
to bits?

No, not at the time. the Luftwaffe did not have "air superiority" over
the Channel, or over Britain. Would the RN have lost ships? Probably,
but not enough to deter or defeat them.

The Germans had no effective landing craft or amphibious warfare
ships, and would have been annihilated in trying to cross.

Not if the BoB had been lost.

Grantland

Al Minyard

In message , The Raven
writes
"John Freck" wrote in message
. com...
Why did Britain win the BoB?

snip

The setting is July 1st, 1940. What must the Axis do better? And
what must the Allies do better?

snip

Dispersing the aircraft helped a lot, not to mention the underestimation by
the Germans of the British radar, add to that the Germans overestimating the
remaining RAF forces.

I thought they underestimated?

Mike
--
M.J.Powell

"M. J. Powell" wrote in message
...
In message , The Raven
writes
"John Freck" wrote in message
. com...
Why did Britain win the BoB?

snip

The setting is July 1st, 1940. What must the Axis do better? And
what must the Allies do better?

snip

Dispersing the aircraft helped a lot, not to mention the underestimation
by
the Germans of the British radar, add to that the Germans overestimating
the
remaining RAF forces.

I thought they underestimated?


Grossly underestimated

At the 3rd Sept meeting at the Hague were the decision to switch
targets to London was made Luftwaffe Intel was stating
that the RAF was down to its last 300 fighters

In reality the RAF was stronger than it had been at the
start of the battle. Moreover they failed to take into account
their own losses. Only Milch who had been around the
bases in Northern France talking to group commanders
had anything like a true picture of the situation.

Keith

What would have happened if the Germans had successfully over-run England? I
imagine a bloody period followed by protracted fighting until the US decided
to lend a hand. At which time, the German forces would find themselves both
attacking the B

I'm afraid not. Had Britain (not merely England) been occupied by
Germany, there is no way that the U.S. could have gotten at Europa.
The army was green, the landing craft not yet produced, and the only
aircraft capable of attacking Europa from the U.S. was the B-36, which
couldn't have survived German air defenses and probably wouldn't have
made the slightest difference if it had.

No, I think we would have been content to fight our own war against
Japan.


all the best -- Dan Ford
email: www.danford.net/letters.htm#9

see the Warbird's Forum at www.warbirdforum.com
and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com

"Cub Driver" wrote in message
...

I'm afraid not. Had Britain (not merely England) been occupied by
Germany, there is no way that the U.S. could have gotten at Europa.
The army was green, the landing craft not yet produced, and the only
aircraft capable of attacking Europa from the U.S. was the B-36, which
couldn't have survived German air defenses and probably wouldn't have
made the slightest difference if it had.


There was no aircraft capable of attacking Europe from the US during WWII.
The B-36 didn't achieve even nominal operational status until November 1948,
it wasn't truly operational until 1952. However, had the B-36 been
operational ten years earlier, there was nothing German air defenses could
have done to stop it.