Low towing thought

Proper release procedure for low tow is to release from that position.
How do we know the "right" position? It is just below the tug wake
such that occasionally you will feel the wake on the top of the
vertical tail. Most people not well trained tend to fly too low.
When you release in "proper" position, the rope will go straight
forward and not up over the glider. If it goes up, you were too low.
Tuggie will feel release as in high tow. The difference is that he
will feel no trim change due to glider being on the thrust line of the
tug in low tow.
These comments based on 10,000+ tows at the back end and 5000+ at the
front end in low tow.
Cheers UH- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I've flown with UH's club here in the U.S., Valley Soaring
(Middletown, NY), which uses low tow as standard. My glider only has a
belly hook but I never had any problems releasing without any special
maneuvering. I prefer high tow but I do use low tow for long aerotows
(e.g., when retrieving) because it's less work. As UH says, if the
tug's wake is bumping the vertical tail occasionally, you're in the
right position.

Chip Bearden
ASW 24 "JB"

This topic is most interesting. I was never taught the low tow, or
presented with the concept at any of the 3 places I took lessons
(Estrella, Seminole Lakes and Turf, 3 years ago). How is it easier for
the glider driver? Wouldn't it create more work for the tug driver?

Are there any enthusiasts of the low tow who are also enthusiasts of
high wing loading for those good days? I've been in the "low tow"
position unintentionally at max wing loading when the tug driver musta
thought he was pulling a 2-33. Seems like there would be no room for
error if one started out in that position, and the tug then slowed
down!

~ted/2NO

wrote:
I have only a CG hook, and would be kind of uncomfortable with the
tow rope rubbing the side of my glider during the entire tow.

If you are just below the wake (where you should be) there is enough sag
in the rope to clear the nose. The major disadvantage of low tow with a
CG hook is that if you let the rope get too slack (as may happen if you
encounter turbulence), it makes a loop underneath the glider and the
back release will do its thing...

Marc

"Tuno" wrote in message
oups.com...
This topic is most interesting. I was never taught the low tow, or
presented with the concept at any of the 3 places I took lessons
(Estrella, Seminole Lakes and Turf, 3 years ago). How is it easier for
the glider driver? Wouldn't it create more work for the tug driver?

Are there any enthusiasts of the low tow who are also enthusiasts of
high wing loading for those good days? I've been in the "low tow"
position unintentionally at max wing loading when the tug driver musta
thought he was pulling a 2-33. Seems like there would be no room for
error if one started out in that position, and the tug then slowed
down!

~ted/2NO


I probably flew hundreds of low tows at the old El Mirage Field. Gus
Brigleib insisted on low tow.

If you are flying a low performance glider, the technique for slack is to
just push the nose lower. The glider will just move down and take the slack
out. If, however, you are flying a Nimbus, it will outrun the tug pasing
under it. Pulling up puts in more slack even as the glider slows down
ending in a jerk.

In the end, I suspect the reason Gus insisted on low tow was the TG-3's he
used as trainers. It was very difficult for the instructor, sitting 8 feet
or so behind the student, to see the tug while in high tow. There was a lot
of rollover structure and greenhouse canopy between the front and rear
cockpits. Low tow gives the instructor a great view of the tug. I really
can't think of another reason for low tow.

BTW, low tow seems easier only because there are fewer references, like the
horizon, to help detect being out of position. If you can't tell you are
out of position, it seems OK. In fact, the opposite may be true. In high
tow, the tugs wingtip vortices tend to push a glider back to center
position. In low tow, they tend to pull it out of position.

Bill Daniels

(from OZ)
heard an interesting radio chat when last at the feild, this is the shortened version
tuggie- "(glider id)your too low, please come up higher"
I assume all the waggles and signs were also going on, then, with no radio response heard from the glider
tuggie-"(glider id) I am going to have to release you as I am running out of down elevator authority, tow higher immediately"
shortly after, tuggie advises feild that he has released the glider and is returning to the pie cart for a new rope, no big deal.
Please dont read into this what is not there. I beleive there was perhaps a radio failure in the glider as well, but all said, this was an extreme case and there was no problems or danger during the whole process. The chatter went on over a period of a couple of minutes, the tuggie did not sound bothered at any time (to me)

Now imagine if this occured in a high tow situation, with the glider too high -all reversed.
The tuggie would have about 3 milliseconds to release before being in grave danger of going in.
Thats why we low tow.

I was taught to release the rope, visually ensure it was gone (and say so to the instructor) then turn away (right in OZ). In turbulence I have seen the rings a couple of times beside me after release, but havent been hit by them, I daresay it does happen. In reality your doing the same speed as the rings/rope so it should only be a tap anyhow.
The tug pulls the rope away fairly smartly, I have not been a tuggie, but I have not heard of a tow continuing far because the tug hadnt noticed the glider was missing!

I always release in lift, too. I am in rising air, the tug has just passed through it and is sinking, usually, so the system works well. I am often amazed at people saying they pulled the plug at 2500' or 3000' or wherever, only to find no lift and return to the feild.
Give yourself a minimum release height specific to the day and circumstances, go past that height and wait behind the tug untill you hit a thermal. Get off, turn right, thermal, and go XC. simple



bagger

so what happened to that poor glider in low tow when 200ft of rope went back
over the top?

BT

"bagmaker" wrote in message
...

(from OZ)
heard an interesting radio chat when last at the feild, this is the
shortened version
tuggie- "(glider id)your too low, please come up higher"
I assume all the waggles and signs were also going on, then, with no
radio response heard from the glider
tuggie-"(glider id) I am going to have to release you as I am running
out of down elevator authority, tow higher immediately"
shortly after, tuggie advises feild that he has released the glider and
is returning to the pie cart for a new rope, no big deal.
Please dont read into this what is not there. I beleive there was
perhaps a radio failure in the glider as well, but all said, this was
an extreme case and there was no problems or danger during the whole
process. The chatter went on over a period of a couple of minutes, the
tuggie did not sound bothered at any time (to me)

Now imagine if this occured in a high tow situation, with the glider
too high -all reversed.
The tuggie would have about 3 milliseconds to release before being in
grave danger of going in.
Thats why we low tow.

I was taught to release the rope, visually ensure it was gone (and say
so to the instructor) then turn away (right in OZ). In turbulence I
have seen the rings a couple of times beside me after release, but
havent been hit by them, I daresay it does happen. In reality your
doing the same speed as the rings/rope so it should only be a tap
anyhow.
The tug pulls the rope away fairly smartly, I have not been a tuggie,
but I have not heard of a tow continuing far because the tug hadnt
noticed the glider was missing!

I always release in lift, too. I am in rising air, the tug has just
passed through it and is sinking, usually, so the system works well. I
am often amazed at people saying they pulled the plug at 2500' or 3000'
or wherever, only to find no lift and return to the feild.
Give yourself a minimum release height specific to the day and
circumstances, go past that height and wait behind the tug untill you
hit a thermal. Get off, turn right, thermal, and go XC. simple



bagger




--
bagmaker

"Graeme Cant" gcantinter@tnodedotnet wrote in message
...
In Oz it's a no-no to pop up into high tow as you release (with all due
respect to Oscar's experience and SA's rules) because it's been known to
initiate a kiting situation. I guess our experience is that a 'slow' move
through a turbulent slipstream into high tow isn't all that easy to accomplish
for ab initio and low experience pilots...

That trip up (and/or down) through the wake is part of the drill for the
"boxing the wake" manuver. I would never solo a student who couldn't do that.

Vaughn

My club is probably about the only one in the US that flies low-tow as
default. I fly an ASW-20 (cg hook only) in low-tow all the time.
Concur that if you are in the correct position (just below the wake)
and initiate immediate turn upon release, there is absolutely no issue
with the rope. It goes forward, I turn - no issue.

Should also say that unfortuantely (since I'd prefer to be in my
glider) I spend as much or more time at the front end of the rope and
have to agree with bagger - never had an issue running out of elevator
when someone gets a bit (or even a lot) low on low tow, but reversing
that if someone gets 1/4 as out of poistion going high on high tow, it
gets nasty fast or they get fed the rope. Thats why we fly low-tow.

IC

Vaughn Simon wrote:
"Graeme Cant" gcantinter@tnodedotnet wrote in message
...
In Oz it's a no-no to pop up into high tow as you release (with all due
respect to Oscar's experience and SA's rules) because it's been known to
initiate a kiting situation. I guess our experience is that a 'slow' move
through a turbulent slipstream into high tow isn't all that easy to accomplish
for ab initio and low experience pilots...

That trip up (and/or down) through the wake is part of the drill for the
"boxing the wake" manuver. I would never solo a student who couldn't do that.

Vaughn

Good.

Your point is?

GC

On Mar 6, 9:11 am, "Tuno" wrote:
This topic is most interesting. I was never taught the low tow, or
presented with the concept at any of the 3 places I took lessons
(Estrella, Seminole Lakes and Turf, 3 years ago). How is it easier for
the glider driver? Wouldn't it create more work for the tug driver?

I had to demonstrate satisfactory low tow at Estrella as a condition
of taking their 1-26 on a Silver XC attempt. Aero retrieve from the
milk run to Eloy was standard procedure. The reason given for low tow
was that it was easier for the glider pilot to keep in position and
keep tension in level flight during the retrieve.

I was taught low tow at Thruxton (UK) for descent on tow. Normal tows
were in high position.

I suspect that the vertical position difference between proper high
tow, just above the wake, and proper low tow, just below the wake, is
less than the range of vertical positions seen in US high tow. I've
been horrified at how high some pilots will tow and think they are in
the right position.

The single seaters I've flown most have had belly or CG hooks and I
prefer to tow just above the wake. That position is close to the
trust line of the tug. I don't have nearly as much experience on the
front to the rope as the back but I like to see the glider in the
mirror and proper high tow works well for that.

I have to wonder if the kiting argument is really a valid reason for
low tow. The difference between proper low low and proper high tow is
so small that I suspect an incapacitated pilot with full up elevator
will pass through the wake in much less than a second.

Rather than trying to convert the high towers to low tow, I'd like to
see them taught to fly high tow in the right place.

Andy