Tales of soaring software + device crashes, wrong or misleadinginformation presented, and user errors?

At 06:26 31 May 2013, Max Kellermann wrote:
On Friday, May 31, 2013 12:57:36 AM UTC+2, Uncle Fuzzy wrote:
I brought it up on the XCSoar forum, but the consensus was that the old
3850 just didn't have the processing power.

Which is bull****.


Agreed, I've never had an problem running any previous versions of xcsoar,
and the latest version 6.6.1 is just fine too.

I've never had it crash either, ( usage ~ 100 hrs a season since it went
open source ), but I always make sure I use the 'last stable' version not
the betas.

The menus, zooming, in fact all operations work fine and quickly for me,
although I don't have the topology or overlay maps turned on, I do have the
flarm radar turned on.

I think xcsoar is by far the best soaring software money can buy.

A big thanks to Max and the team for keeping XCsoar going for those of us
with older hardware, I often don't think they get the recognition they
deserve.

On Friday, May 31, 2013 2:26:38 AM UTC-4, Max Kellermann wrote:
On Friday, May 31, 2013 12:57:36 AM UTC+2, Uncle Fuzzy wrote:

I brought it up on the XCSoar forum, but the consensus was that the old 3850 just didn't have the processing power.



Which is bull****.

A guess: Uncle is using ppc 2002. 5.2.4 worked fine on 2002. 6.x, not so much. My experience with Ipaq 3850/3950, anyway. I had better luck with ppc 2003.

T8

T8

On Friday, May 31, 2013 9:48:01 AM UTC+1, Evan Ludeman wrote:
A guess: Uncle is using ppc 2002. 5.2.4 worked fine on 2002. 6.x, not so much. My experience with Ipaq 3850/3950, anyway. I had better luck with ppc 2003.

PPC2003 may have some performance advantages over 2002, but 2002 should still be entirely usable. I guess people aren't reporting issues with XCSoar on old hardware because either:

a) They're used to planned obsolescence in software, and expect new versions to fail on old hardware

or

b) They think the issue is noticeable enough that the developers will catch it before the next version.

In practice neither is necessarily true. XCSoar has software mechanisms in place to scale back features for slow hardware. As long as those are maintained and extended to cover any new features, old hardware should be supported for the foreseeable future.

However, only a small proportion of the developers have access to Windows CE devices and even fewer are actively using them. If issues are reported the resources are available to fix them, but if they're not reported they'll very likely be missed.

Should anyone _really_ want to solve these problems, then I can send
an iPaq 3850 and probably a cradle. Power adapters I do not own.
My iPaq 3850s are running Familiar Linux 0.8.2, so you'd need to re-
install PPC2002/2003 first.

My gps source is a cambridge 302A. I run XCSoar 5.2.4 on an old iPAQ 3850. It is stone-axe reliable, and has the brightest in-sunlight display I've ever seen. I also have a Dell Streak, but the display is really nowhere near as good as the iPAQ. However.... the iPAQ won't run later versions of XCSoar gracefully.

I've had exactly the same experience as you except I think I can see the Dell Streak screen much more clearly in polarized sunglasses than the iPAQ 3850. In the middle of the contest I upgraded to XCSoar 6.6 Beta2, and only during flight I noticed much slower responses. For example, just before arriving at a turnpoint the XCSoar would freeze for 30 seconds or more, and unintentionally I would make the turn later than planned. Then on a final glide the info boxes would update once every 30 seconds or so, which made me quite uncomfortable too. The same day I reverted back to an older version (I believe it was 6.5.2) which works fine. I did not post a ticket because I did not see anyone else complaining about it.

Wiktor

I upgraded to XCSoar 6.6 Beta2
I reverted back to an older version (I believe it was 6.5.2) which works fine.

Speaks for itself... Stable versions are called "stable" for a reason, while a beta version is introducing new stuff that might still fail every now and then.

This is a good open forum subject (minimum finger pointing)
I fly with both my old Garmin 76S and now my 2nd season with Streak XCSoar 6.6) I still do not have confidence to fly with just one, numerous pilots at my club have mentioned that their external GPS (name unknown) have just stopped receiving for periods of time. In my case about 20 minutes and it just came back (twice in 3 years). In respect to the Streak, I've had finger problems, running too many programs in the background and draining the battery. In 36 hrs so far this season, I've noticed 3-4 times position updating lagged a bit. Repair consisted of going to another waypoint and then going back to the original. Even with both operating simultaneously I've had rejected OLC flights. What is the chance of that? Someone calls this the silly season, hopefully that season will be shorter next year.

IX

Gotta ask: Just what programs do you "need" to be running in the background
of your Streak?

I don't know what OS version you're running, but Max recently released an
Update.zip file to remove all the bloatware that comes with the device. Or
you could root the device and do some picking yourself, if you have the
knowledge to do that.

I use my Streak *only* to run XCSoar and I also installed a
switch-controlled USB power socket to my main DC bus so I never run out of
power.


wrote in message
...
This is a good open forum subject (minimum finger pointing)
I fly with both my old Garmin 76S and now my 2nd season with Streak XCSoar
6.6) I still do not have confidence to fly with just one, numerous pilots at
my club have mentioned that their external GPS (name unknown) have just
stopped receiving for periods of time. In my case about 20 minutes and it
just came back (twice in 3 years). In respect to the Streak, I've had
finger problems, running too many programs in the background and draining
the battery. In 36 hrs so far this season, I've noticed 3-4 times position
updating lagged a bit. Repair consisted of going to another waypoint and
then going back to the original. Even with both operating simultaneously
I've had rejected OLC flights. What is the chance of that? Someone calls
this the silly season, hopefully that season will be shorter next year.

IX

I always bring 2 navigators with me. Have an older DroidX android and a new android both running XCSoar latest stable version. I found the #1 problem is the GPS view of the sky. I always get a few short dropouts if I'm not using my external Bluetooth GPS which is mounted high and as clear a view as possible. Also I've noticed with the external gps that I seem to get better response updates especially while thermaling. It's less likely to lag.. Even my new Galaxy Note2 will hickup if in my lap during flight. Also GPS must be at least 1 foot apart if you're using two. Also fashioned a few very small 12 volt batteries to plug in the Androids. I only rent gliders.

I think XCSoar is amazing. It's very flexible but with that comes complexity. If you don't do your homework and use a checklist for setup you will be sorry. I can't recall any recent lookups freezes whatever.

Garmin Pilot, the power plane app is a great backup too. Sectionals, weather radar, forecast winds aloft all on the sectional. Great for studying a possible landout airport that is unfamiliar. No freeze ups with that app either. Need to be low to get cell.

I also agree some of those old iPaqs still have the best direct sun readability. Under a cloud the Android Oudie etc are a match. I had some freezes with iPaqs running SeeYou Mobile. Even my one year old Colibri II gave me an invalid IGC. I missed a few firmware updates that corrected bugs.

I use cheap, clip on, hinged pola sunglasses. In full sun I slide them up on my regular glasses a bit so that I can see under them when looking at the Android, but get full sunglasses view of everything out the canopy. This helps readability a lot.

1 foot away