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#31
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Libelle
On Sun, 24 Jun 2018 17:37:23 -0700, fthacorpgov wrote:
In respect to the turbulence Schumann claimed as being the entire undersurface of the wing perhaps a turbulator tape applied in the right place on the under surface would provide a better flow. My Libelle, an early H.201 with balsa surfaces and both top and bottom surface brakes, has lower surface turbulation. This is zigzag tape a bit forward from where the undercambered rear part of the lower surface starts. It was fitted when I bought it but I'm fairly certain the tape and instructions were supplied by Glasfaser. Mine runs comfortably at 80 kts without much height loss. I do not have root fairings fitted: would like fairings but I don't think the fuselage would fit in the trailer with them on - very narrow trailer. -- Martin | martin at Gregorie | gregorie dot org |
#32
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Libelle
I have built a number of wing wheels and WingRiggers for both the 201 and 301. I can definitely say that the airfoils are very different. The 201 is thicker, with more curvature on the bottom.
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#33
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Libelle
The 301 aerofoil is a lot thinner & designed for flaps so very different.
I have spoken to Christian Streifeneder regarding turbulators, he has pointed out that there may be a case for putting them on the top surface of the wing, but then it would be difficult to wash the wings. He's not convinced they are effective on the underside. By the way, there is no H in 201 (regardless of what Wikipedia says) - the H in H301 denotes Hutter who was involved in it's design, but the 201 did not. Cheers, Nick. |
#34
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Libelle
I just sold my H301 with the Scheumann wing mods. The leading edge is sharper and the entry (stagnation point) is lower. The flaps actuator is modified to let the ailerons move closer to the flaps for cambering.
The Libelle 201 has a much thicker wing and you'll see that if you try to put a H301 canopy on a Libelle 201. |
#35
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Libelle
The airfoils on the Standard Libelle (201) and the H301 Libelle are different. The 201 uses the (Wortmann) FX 66-17AII-182 airfoil, which is 18.2-percent-chord thick. Wil Schuemann brilliantly observed that the 301 airfoil is very similar to an FX 67-K-XXX airfoil except near the leading edge---thus the leading-edge "extension" of the Schuemann modification.
Dan Somers Port Matilda, Pennsylvania, USA |
#36
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Libelle
This clarifies the airfoil matter for me thanks.
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#37
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Libelle
I'm looking at going ahead with purchasing a 201 project. It was damaged and needs to be thoroughly checked out with minimum repairs being fiberglass to the leading edge of one wing that had contacted a fence post or small tree on an off field landing and a new canopy. I'd like to find a person who may be able to transport the glider for me to California from Pennsylvania. I can't afford to pay a lot. Maybe someone knows someone who happens to be road tripping out to California from the East Coast?
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#38
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Libelle
On Tuesday, 11 July 2017 21:22:19 UTC+1, bertvaneyken wrote:
Bought my libelle 13j ago also from an 'importer', he even claimed someone flew it after he bought it. Not registered on a glider pilot nor any trace of the "testflight". Google cache and plain old Phone learned that he had bought te libelle €4500 less than he had it for sale. By then he knew the gliding world is too small and he dropped the price to a reasonable level. The e-libelle might indeed rise the price somewhat but the mod will be expensive anyway. I overhauled my libelle, did the 4000hr check, fitted winglets and know them inside out ... but this one will need a LOT of work to look acceptable, not mentioning the parts to be replaced/overhauled. Only interesting if one wants to put a lot of his own time in it and enjoying a great old ship. Have you removed the under carriage from the glider ? I need to look at mine on a later 201. I've found the holes in the side, just need to know how all comes apart. |
#39
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Libelle
On Mon, 13 Aug 2018 11:08:06 -0700, gregorywheldon wrote:
On Tuesday, 11 July 2017 21:22:19 UTC+1, bertvaneyken wrote: Bought my libelle 13j ago also from an 'importer', he even claimed someone flew it after he bought it. Not registered on a glider pilot nor any trace of the "testflight". Google cache and plain old Phone learned that he had bought te libelle €4500 less than he had it for sale. By then he knew the gliding world is too small and he dropped the price to a reasonable level. The e-libelle might indeed rise the price somewhat but the mod will be expensive anyway. I overhauled my libelle, did the 4000hr check, fitted winglets and know them inside out ... but this one will need a LOT of work to look acceptable, not mentioning the parts to be replaced/overhauled. Only interesting if one wants to put a lot of his own time in it and enjoying a great old ship. Have you removed the under carriage from the glider ? I need to look at mine on a later 201. I've found the holes in the side, just need to know how all comes apart. Take the wheel off first, followed by the short links to the main part of the rear undercarriage assembly. This leaves the front and rear main undercarriage assemblies on the front and rear axles. The axles are the thin-walled tubes the undercarriage pivots on when it retracts. The use of relatively soft, thin walled tube for the axles is intended to adsorb the shock of a hard landing by bending the tube. Disconnect the retraction lever from the right end of the rear axle. There's an 8mm thread in both the front and rear axles at the end facing the access holes. Use some 8mm studding or a rod with 20mm or so of 8mm thread on its end - to extract the axle, screw this tool into the axle and pull it out through the side hole. Assuming the axles are not bent, the front axle should just slide out because the front undercarriage assembly rotates freely on it with a spacer washer on each side to keep it centered. You need to remove the two bolts through the rear axle and disconnect the retraction drive crank from the right end of the rear axle before it will slide out. If the axles are bent they will be a lot harder to remove - be careful not to break the brass axle bearings out of the wheel box. The undercarriage assemblies have a 20mm wide bearing surface at each end: the middle part of the tube does not touch the axle, which can bend inside the bearing surfaces. Glasfaser can supply replacement axles quite promptly if you need them. Note that new rear axles are NOT pre-drilled and that Glasflugel didn't use a drilling template, so the exact placement of holes must be taken from the rear undercarriage assembly and the relative angle between that and the retraction drive crank must be copied from the old axle. -- Martin | martin at Gregorie | gregorie dot org |
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