Picking up a Clearance Airborne

I was departing Harford Co MD airport yesterday (0W3) enroute to
Chesterfield MD (FCI). 0W3 is a small non-towered field with no ground
communications to ATC or FSS. In trying to pick up my clearance on the
ground, I attempted to contact Leesburg FSS on the 1-800-WX-BRIEF. Due to
call volume, I was routed to Altoona FSS, which did not have access to my
flight plan and said that I needed to call Leesburg directly. So I called
the direct Leesburg number, and after staying on hold for 15 minutes
(meanwhile my cellphone battery charge is ticking away) I decided to hang
up, and get my clearance airborne.

The weather was VFR, albeit a bit hazy. Even though 0W3 is just north of
the ADIZ, I really wanted to get my clearance prior to departure just
because my route would eventually take me into the ADIZ.

I ultimately decided that I would depart VFR to the north, and circle if
necessary, until I was cleared enroute.

After taking off, I contacted the departure freq on the approach chart for
0W3. The controller chewed me out for departing VFR, made a comment that it
was unsafe, and sent me to another frequency. I tried the new freq, and
this controller chewed me out even further, refused to get my clearance, and
told me I should have gotten it on the ground. Explaining to my passenger
(1st time flying with me) that the ground was a better place to deal with
this than the air, I returned to the field to start making phone calls.

I finally got the number for Potomac approach, got my clearance. I was told
to call back right before I was airborne. (Is a cell phone now a require
piece of comm equipment in an IFR aircraft?)

I know the controllers were busy at that moment and that's why refused my
clearance. Why didn't they just issue a sqawk code with the instructions
"remain vfr"? Does it have to do with the nearby ADIZ? I guess my
confusion is this: I've picked up clearances in the air on numerous
occasions. I thought it made it easier for them because they did not have
to block out airspace for my departure. I've even been denied a clearance
through an RCO on the ground at a Charlotte area airport and asked to pick
it up airborne. While I didn't appreciate the on-air chew out from the
controller, I am not really upset, I just want to know how I should know
these things ahead of time. I haven't been able to find guidance from the
AIM or 7110.65, NOTAMS or otherwise.

Brad

Maybe this is a Potomac area thing. In Colorado I have never been refused a
clearance by Denver Approach. The worst that ever happened was about 5
minutes of circling while I waited for the controller to have enough time to
take care of me. The only time I ever get a clearance on the ground is if it
is IFR weather for the departure, and that is rare in Colorado.

I usually depart VFR and pick up my clearance after takeoff with departure
at the nearby Class C. Often I won't even have to ask for it .. when I
report
airborne they'll say .. "I'll bet you're looking for your clearance .. "
and give it
to me. I'm in Nebraska. Unless they've got a notice out about not picking
up clearances airborne .. what grounds would they have to chew you out?

Sounds to me like you've just got a bunch of overworked, crabby
controllers out there.



"Michael 182" wrote in message
news:Gls1b.173511$Oz4.45613@rwcrnsc54...
Maybe this is a Potomac area thing. In Colorado I have never been refused
a
clearance by Denver Approach. The worst that ever happened was about 5
minutes of circling while I waited for the controller to have enough time
to
take care of me. The only time I ever get a clearance on the ground is if
it
is IFR weather for the departure, and that is rare in Colorado.

I'm surprised you didn't just fly around the ADIZ. My flight planning
software says it would have only taken 5 minutes more.

Sandy Mustard

Brad Z wrote:

I was departing Harford Co MD airport yesterday (0W3) enroute to
Chesterfield MD (FCI).

The weather was VFR, albeit a bit hazy. Even though 0W3 is just north of
the ADIZ, I really wanted to get my clearance prior to departure just
because my route would eventually take me into the ADIZ.

Brad

"Sandy Mustard" wrote in message ...

I'm surprised you didn't just fly around the ADIZ. My flight planning
software says it would have only taken 5 minutes more.

The most direct route not within the ADIZ puts you through several
frequently hot on weekends restricted areas and over the top of a nuke
plant (Calvert Cliffs).

Frankly, I'm not one to shy away from airspace on the direct path unless
someone can convince me some damn good reason why I should.
Back before all this paranoid horse****, I could go direct VKX to the
Tappan Z bridge almost directly over ADW, BWI, PHL and just west
of EWR without hardly a few degrees of heading change from the
various approach controls.

Brad Z wrote:
: I was departing Harford Co MD airport yesterday (0W3) enroute to
: Chesterfield MD (FCI). 0W3 is a small non-towered field with no ground
: communications to ATC or FSS. In trying to pick up my clearance on the
: ground, I attempted to contact Leesburg FSS on the 1-800-WX-BRIEF. Due to
: call volume, I was routed to Altoona FSS, which did not have access to my
: flight plan and said that I needed to call Leesburg directly. So I called
: the direct Leesburg number, and after staying on hold for 15 minutes
: (meanwhile my cellphone battery charge is ticking away) I decided to hang
: up, and get my clearance airborne.

I flew a friend up to Ft. Meade, MD about a month ago, and had
similar problems getting through to FSS. Since the airport was in the
ADIZ and I had been warned not to even do a lap in the pattern without
getting a squawk, I didn't depart. I had to wait on hold for 20 minutes
to get to talk to someone and open an ADIZ VFR flight plan and get a
code... the whole time watching a dark rain cell come closer and closer.
Ended up getting clearance in time, and hauling-ass away from the rain.
That whole mess up there is completely unnecessary and pretty much just a
pain for everyone.

-Cory


--
************************************************** ***********************
* The prime directive of Linux: *
* - learn what you don't know, *
* - teach what you do. *
* (Just my 20 USm$) *
************************************************** ***********************

"Brad Z" wrote:
After taking off, I contacted the departure freq on the approach chart for
0W3. The controller chewed me out for departing VFR, made a comment that
it
was unsafe, and sent me to another frequency. I tried the new freq, and
this controller chewed me out even further, refused to get my clearance,
and
told me I should have gotten it on the ground.

I've had similar problems with the Houston TRACON, and they don't have the
excuse of a bunch of red hot TFR's, ADIZ's, etc. to deal with. They do NOT
like pilots picking up their clearances airborne off satellite airports.
--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

I know the controllers were busy at that moment and that's why refused my
clearance. Why didn't they just issue a sqawk code with the instructions
"remain vfr"? Does it have to do with the nearby ADIZ?

My guess is yes. They also could tell you to stand by while looking
for it. During a time between 9/11 and the introduction of the ADIZ,
I was able to pick up my clearance while airborne from BayBridge (W29)
to Frederick (FDK) while circling over the bay. It took the
controller a couple of minutes, but once she found it, everyting went
fine.

That was a big hassle you went through, call FSS, call another FSS,
take off, get chewed-out twice, land, call Potomac, take off again,
....

At my home airport, I always pick up my clearance from FSS via GCO. If
there is any reluctance or problem on the part of FSS with
coordinating/issuing a clearance from Center, I get very nervous. Recently
I asked for clearance and after few minutes, FSS guy came back on the line
and told me that he could not make contact with Center and recommended that
I depart VFR and pick up clearance once airborne. Very unusual. Weather
was VFR but lots of convective activity, sky broken. I departed and once
airborne, discovered Center was very very busy. I didn't know why. After
many radio calls and leveling off at appropriate VFR altitude, Center
responded to my calls. I picked up my clearance but not "as filed". Turns
out that Center radar was out of service (was not mentioned in FSS briefing
of notams) and thus pilots having to fly airways only and provide numerous
position/altitude reports to Center. So, after Center gave me my clearance,
I had to scramble to check charts to make sure I could comply before
accepting. Everything worked out fine but this falls into the "never again"
category for me. If I have trouble getting clearance on ground I will make
sure I understand why before making decision to pick up clearance in air.
It's amazing that I have become, over time, uncomfortable going VFR cross
country. bty, I enjoy lurking in this group and learning from you all.
"Roger Tracy" wrote in message
...
I usually depart VFR and pick up my clearance after takeoff with departure
at the nearby Class C. Often I won't even have to ask for it .. when I
report
airborne they'll say .. "I'll bet you're looking for your clearance .. "
and give it
to me. I'm in Nebraska. Unless they've got a notice out about not picking
up clearances airborne .. what grounds would they have to chew you out?

Sounds to me like you've just got a bunch of overworked, crabby
controllers out there.



"Michael 182" wrote in message
news:Gls1b.173511$Oz4.45613@rwcrnsc54...
Maybe this is a Potomac area thing. In Colorado I have never been
refused
a
clearance by Denver Approach. The worst that ever happened was about 5
minutes of circling while I waited for the controller to have enough
time
to
take care of me. The only time I ever get a clearance on the ground is
if
it
is IFR weather for the departure, and that is rare in Colorado.

"PA28Rdrvr" wrote:
Weather was VFR but lots of convective activity, sky broken.
[...]
It's amazing that I have become, over time, uncomfortable going VFR cross
country.

With lots of convective activity, I'd rather be VFR. I don't want to
fly into a CB, so VFR will allow me to visually navigate around the
buildups. IFR, I'm at the mercy of the controller as to where I go.
Once he puts me into a cloud, I can no longer see what's ahead. My
first hint that the benign-looking CU I flew into has turned into
something nastier may be my head bouncing off the cabin top.