Night VFR Soaring (USA)

Mike the Strike wrote:

Night OLC, anyone?

I thought the OLC had a restriction on night flying, but I couldn't find
any reference to it. Does OLC place restriction on flying before or
after sunset?

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (netto to net to email me)

- "Transponders in Sailplanes - Feb/2010" also ADS-B, PCAS, Flarm http://tinyurl.com/yb3xywl

- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation Mar/2004" Much of what you need to know tinyurl.com/yfs7tnz

BT wrote:


"brian whatcott" wrote in message
...
Mike the Strike wrote:
In issuing a new airworthiness certificate, my local FAA FSDO examiner
told me yesterday that the restrictions on experimental aircraft
(which includes a lot of sailplanes) to fly only in day VFR had been
removed, and night VFR was now permitted in aircraft equipped with the
necessary navigation lights.

In Arizona, our short summer days sometimes have us on final glide as
the sun is setting and we do occasionally land around (or even just
after) sunset. I know most contest rules cut off soaring at or before
sunset, but I wonder if there any circumstances where this would be
useful?

Night OLC, anyone?

Mike

It's helpful to remember that the official definition of night is one
hour after civil twilight to one hour before civil dawn (by which time
it is often black as ..well..night.)

Brian W

Brian, Wrong answer. FAR 1.1 defines "night" as the end of evening civil
twilight to the beginning of morning civil twilight as published in the
American Air Almanac, converted to local time. The American Air Almanac
is now maintained by the US Naval Observatory.

For my location today, Morning Civil Twilight started at 5:42am and
Sunrise at 6:09am, 27 minutes later.
Sunset is 7:14pm and End of Civil Twilight is 7:40pm, 26 minutes later.

Not the "hour" that you suggest.

The "aircraft lighting" requirement is from Sunset to Sunrise (excluding
Alaska). 91.209, Not twilight to twilight.

BT

Aw - that's too bad! I have nav lights and landing/taxi and an
anti-collision beacon, and I only got 90% on my recent written - so I
stand corrected - but the Delegated Pilot examiner liked the +1 hour
definition on the Oral last month, so I guess you are one up on her too!
:-)

Regards

Brian W

BT wrote:


It's helpful to remember that the official definition of night is one
hour after civil twilight to one hour before civil dawn (by which time
it is often black as ..well..night.)

Brian W

Brian, Wrong answer. FAR 1.1 defines "night" as the end of evening civil
twilight to the beginning of morning civil twilight as published in the
American Air Almanac, converted to local time. The American Air Almanac
is now maintained by the US Naval Observatory.

For my location today, Morning Civil Twilight started at 5:42am and
Sunrise at 6:09am, 27 minutes later.
Sunset is 7:14pm and End of Civil Twilight is 7:40pm, 26 minutes later.

Not the "hour" that you suggest.

The "aircraft lighting" requirement is from Sunset to Sunrise (excluding
Alaska). 91.209, Not twilight to twilight.

BT


BT - wrong answer: right back at ya! :-)

If you need to get night current to carry passengers, follow the
definition of night as described in FAR 61.57(b), which is the "period
beginning one hour after sunset and ending one hour before sunrise."

Yes, there really are several different definitions in the FARs...

Brian W

"brian whatcott" wrote in message
...
BT wrote:


It's helpful to remember that the official definition of night is one
hour after civil twilight to one hour before civil dawn (by which time
it is often black as ..well..night.)

Brian W

Brian, Wrong answer. FAR 1.1 defines "night" as the end of evening civil
twilight to the beginning of morning civil twilight as published in the
American Air Almanac, converted to local time. The American Air Almanac
is now maintained by the US Naval Observatory.

For my location today, Morning Civil Twilight started at 5:42am and
Sunrise at 6:09am, 27 minutes later.
Sunset is 7:14pm and End of Civil Twilight is 7:40pm, 26 minutes later.

Not the "hour" that you suggest.

The "aircraft lighting" requirement is from Sunset to Sunrise (excluding
Alaska). 91.209, Not twilight to twilight.

BT


BT - wrong answer: right back at ya! :-)

If you need to get night current to carry passengers, follow the
definition of night as described in FAR 61.57(b), which is the "period
beginning one hour after sunset and ending one hour before sunrise."

Yes, there really are several different definitions in the FARs...

Brian W

Brian... but that is not the definition of "night".
It only defines that to carry a passenger between one hour after sunset and
one hour before sunrise you must perform 3 landings and take offs during the
same period, one hour after sunset to one hour before sunrise. Just because
the paragraph (b) starts with night, it does not define "night".

There is only one definition of Night in the FARS, and it is in Part 1.1.

BT

"brian whatcott" wrote in message
...
BT wrote:


It's helpful to remember that the official definition of night is one
hour after civil twilight to one hour before civil dawn (by which time
it is often black as ..well..night.)

Brian W

Brian, Wrong answer. FAR 1.1 defines "night" as the end of evening civil
twilight to the beginning of morning civil twilight as published in the
American Air Almanac, converted to local time. The American Air Almanac
is now maintained by the US Naval Observatory.

For my location today, Morning Civil Twilight started at 5:42am and
Sunrise at 6:09am, 27 minutes later.
Sunset is 7:14pm and End of Civil Twilight is 7:40pm, 26 minutes later.

Not the "hour" that you suggest.

The "aircraft lighting" requirement is from Sunset to Sunrise (excluding
Alaska). 91.209, Not twilight to twilight.

BT


BT - wrong answer: right back at ya! :-)

If you need to get night current to carry passengers, follow the
definition of night as described in FAR 61.57(b), which is the "period
beginning one hour after sunset and ending one hour before sunrise."

Yes, there really are several different definitions in the FARs...

Brian W

Brian... but that is not the definition of "night".
It only defines that to carry a passenger between one hour after sunset and
one hour before sunrise you must perform 3 landings and take offs during the
same period, one hour after sunset to one hour before sunrise. Just because
the paragraph (b) starts with night, it does not define "night".

There is only one definition of Night in the FARS, and it is in Part 1.1.

BT

"brian whatcott" wrote in message
...
BT wrote:


It's helpful to remember that the official definition of night is one
hour after civil twilight to one hour before civil dawn (by which time
it is often black as ..well..night.)

Brian W

Brian, Wrong answer. FAR 1.1 defines "night" as the end of evening civil
twilight to the beginning of morning civil twilight as published in the
American Air Almanac, converted to local time. The American Air Almanac
is now maintained by the US Naval Observatory.

For my location today, Morning Civil Twilight started at 5:42am and
Sunrise at 6:09am, 27 minutes later.
Sunset is 7:14pm and End of Civil Twilight is 7:40pm, 26 minutes later.

Not the "hour" that you suggest.

The "aircraft lighting" requirement is from Sunset to Sunrise (excluding
Alaska). 91.209, Not twilight to twilight.

BT


BT - wrong answer: right back at ya! :-)

If you need to get night current to carry passengers, follow the
definition of night as described in FAR 61.57(b), which is the "period
beginning one hour after sunset and ending one hour before sunrise."

Yes, there really are several different definitions in the FARs...

Brian W

Brian... but that is not the definition of "night".
It only defines that to carry a passenger between one hour after sunset and
one hour before sunrise you must perform 3 landings and take offs during the
same period, one hour after sunset to one hour before sunrise. Just because
the paragraph (b) starts with night, it does not define "night".

There is only one definition of Night in the FARS, and it is in Part 1.1.

BT

On Apr 13, 7:21*pm, Eric Greenwell wrote:
I thought the OLC had a restriction on night flying, but I couldn't find
any reference to it. Does OLC place restriction on flying before or
after sunset?

Per the sporting code:
5.3.2 Certificates
a. PILOT CERTIFICATION OF REGULATORY COMPLIANCE The pilot must certify
that the soaring performance was conducted in accordance with the FAI
Sporting Code, was flown in compliance with all the glider
manufacturer's and national operating limitations, and in accordance
with national flight regulations respecting airspace use, night
flight, etc.

And I believe the OLC tries to follow the SC when practical.

And getting back to the original question, which was not about flying
in darkness, but about flying after sunset. In the US, the aircraft
must have anti collision lights to be legal. In the western US, it's
not uncommon for there to still be lift at sunset or even later. With
the proper equipment, one could easily watch the sun set from the top
of a thermal, then spend the next hour or so gliding home.

If it's a typical desert evening with little if no overdevelopment,
one could expect a fairly benign airmass with no surprises, so making
a conservative glide home with a number of large fields or lighted
airports on the way should, for the experienced and well prepared
pilot, be quite safe.

I recall a flight from central Colorado into southwestern Kansas a few
years ago. I was quite a bit ahead of my crew and attempting to reach
Liberal when the day fizzled out. So I started the engine over a nice
field and started motoring toward a more convenient airport. In this
direction there were some nice late clouds and soon I had the engine
stowed as I flew in the late day thermals. I arrived at the airport
and waited in great lift for Karen to arrive with the trailer. As I
enjoyed the evening and setting sun, it dawned on me that the sun is
setting! So out came the spoilers and very quickly I'd wasted the few
thousand feet to get on the ground a minute or two before official
sunset. A half hour or more later it was still light enough to make a
safe landing on an unlighted runway - if only it were legal...

-Tom

On Apr 13, 7:47*pm, brian whatcott wrote:
If you need to get night current to carry passengers, follow the
definition of night as described in FAR 61.57(b), which is the "period
beginning one hour after sunset and ending one hour before sunrise."

Yes, there really are several different definitions in the FARs...

Nope - one definition, several requirements.

As soon as the sun sets, it becomes hard to see aircraft (and oncoming
cars) if they're not illuminated, yet it's still pretty much daytime
as far as seeing the ground and large obstructions.

It's not until it's quite dark that landings become a bit more
interesting than during the day, so the FAA wants to be sure you're
current at landing IN THE DARK before carrying passengers.

-Tom

sorry for the multiple replies.. the news server stuttered
BT

"brian whatcott" wrote in message
...
BT wrote:


It's helpful to remember that the official definition of night is one
hour after civil twilight to one hour before civil dawn (by which time
it is often black as ..well..night.)

Brian W

Brian, Wrong answer. FAR 1.1 defines "night" as the end of evening civil
twilight to the beginning of morning civil twilight as published in the
American Air Almanac, converted to local time. The American Air Almanac
is now maintained by the US Naval Observatory.

For my location today, Morning Civil Twilight started at 5:42am and
Sunrise at 6:09am, 27 minutes later.
Sunset is 7:14pm and End of Civil Twilight is 7:40pm, 26 minutes later.

Not the "hour" that you suggest.

The "aircraft lighting" requirement is from Sunset to Sunrise (excluding
Alaska). 91.209, Not twilight to twilight.

BT


BT - wrong answer: right back at ya! :-)

If you need to get night current to carry passengers, follow the
definition of night as described in FAR 61.57(b), which is the "period
beginning one hour after sunset and ending one hour before sunrise."

Yes, there really are several different definitions in the FARs...

Brian W

On Apr 13, 8:59*pm, 5Z wrote:
On Apr 13, 7:47*pm, brian whatcott wrote:

If you need to get night current to carry passengers, follow the
definition of night as described in FAR 61.57(b), which is the "period
beginning one hour after sunset and ending one hour before sunrise."

Yes, there really are several different definitions in the FARs...

Nope - one definition, several requirements.

As soon as the sun sets, it becomes hard to see aircraft (and oncoming
cars) if they're not illuminated, yet it's still pretty much daytime
as far as seeing the ground and large obstructions.

It's not until it's quite dark that landings become a bit more
interesting than during the day, so the FAA wants to be sure you're
current at landing IN THE DARK before carrying passengers.

-Tom

As the OP, perhaps I should clarify a few things.

I understand that it was ALWAYS legal to fly a VFR certified aircraft,
including gliders, after sunset (but in twilight) provided that you
have the required navigation lights. This is after sunset, but before
the onset of "legal" night! Night VFR only commences after the end of
civil twilight and is reportedly no longer restricted under
Experimental certification in the USA.

It would certainly be useful to finish our final glides in twilight,
but I believe that we all can (and always could) do this legally
anyway. At our home field, we find landing into the setting sun
greatly reduces visibility and waiting five minutes till it has set
improves safety. There is no question, though, once the sun has set,
you need navigation lights.

AFAIK, no part of any FAI badge flight can be flown at night. I have
not seen any ruling on OLC.

So any rules folk out there - can we or can't we soar at night for
records, badge flights or OLC?

Mike