A aviation & planes forum. AviationBanter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » AviationBanter forum » rec.aviation newsgroups » Piloting
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

C182 Glass Panel



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old February 25th 04, 03:05 PM
Scott Schluer
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default C182 Glass Panel

I've got a question about the glass panel displays in the C182 (or any other
aircraft for that matter). I was reading this month's edition of AOPA Pilot
magazine and the cover story is the C182T and the new glass panel displays
Cessna decided to incorporate and it got me thinking. My question is: how
does a glass panel display take information received from the pitot-static
and gyro systems and translate that into the display? On "standard" panels,
the pitot-static and gyro systems power the instruments be means of a
mechanical linkage between air pressure differentials or gyros and the
instrument display itself. Now, on a glass panel, I'm assuming that
mechanical linkage is no more. Is everything I know about how instruments
work out the window with glass panels?

For example, if my static source becomes clogged, I would assume that the
pitot-staitc instruments on the glass panel would be affected the same as
they always were. But can I still break the glass on one of the other
"standard" instruments using static pressure that the 182T still
incorporates for redundancy (airspeed, altimiter)? If I broke the glass on
the standard altimiter for example (assuming my glass panel was fully
functional so that I wouldn't need to rely on the standard altimiter, but
the static source was blocked causing erroneous indications), would that
allow static air pressure to flow where it needs to in order to accurately
reflect on the glass panel display also?

I'm just a little confused as to how the glass panel instruments actually
work. Can someone provide an explanation?

Thanks,

Scott


Ads
  #2  
Old February 25th 04, 04:00 PM
C J Campbell
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

The glass panel instruments still use the pitot/static system. If your
static port becomes plugged, pull the alternate static source knob. Don't go
breaking any glass instruments.

The glass panel does not use gyros, but the backup instruments do. The
Garmin 1000 gets pitch information by detecting changes in the vertical
component of the Earth's magnetic field and by cross referencing that with
information from the GPS. It does the same with roll information. It sounds
complicated, but it really is just a fancy compass.

If it were not for legacy aircraft in the ATC system we could dump the
excessively complicated dependence on magnetic headings and give all
vectors, winds, headings, etc., relative to true north. Continually mapping
the shifting magnetic field and updating databases, IFR and VFR charts,
radio navigation aids, and training materials is a major expense.


  #3  
Old February 25th 04, 04:06 PM
Earl
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I've got a question about the glass panel displays in the C182 (or any
other
aircraft for that matter). I was reading this month's edition of AOPA

Pilot
magazine and the cover story is the C182T and the new glass panel displays
Cessna decided to incorporate and it got me thinking. My question is: how
does a glass panel display take information received from the pitot-static
and gyro systems and translate that into the display? On "standard"

panels,
the pitot-static and gyro systems power the instruments be means of a
mechanical linkage between air pressure differentials or gyros and the
instrument display itself. Now, on a glass panel, I'm assuming that
mechanical linkage is no more. Is everything I know about how instruments
work out the window with glass panels?


There's a pressure transducer somewhere for the glass panels that convert
the air pressure into an electrical signal that the computer can understand.
The computer then draws the instrument on the display. There are separate
sensors for pitot and static.


For example, if my static source becomes clogged, I would assume that the
pitot-staitc instruments on the glass panel would be affected the same as
they always were. But can I still break the glass on one of the other
"standard" instruments using static pressure that the 182T still
incorporates for redundancy (airspeed, altimiter)? If I broke the glass on
the standard altimiter for example (assuming my glass panel was fully
functional so that I wouldn't need to rely on the standard altimiter, but
the static source was blocked causing erroneous indications), would that
allow static air pressure to flow where it needs to in order to accurately
reflect on the glass panel display also?


Depends on where the clog is. If all the instruments in the cockpit that
depend on static pressure are plumbed to a single static port on the
airplane body, and that static port clogs with ice, then all the instruments
including the computer are affected. You might able to use alternate static
source to get around it. Know your aircraft systems..... the glass displays
may or may not share the pitot static system plumbing with the old gauges.


I'm just a little confused as to how the glass panel instruments actually
work. Can someone provide an explanation?

Thanks,

Scott




  #4  
Old February 25th 04, 08:15 PM
Cub Driver
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


The
Garmin 1000 gets pitch information by detecting changes in the vertical
component of the Earth's magnetic field and by cross referencing that with
information from the GPS. It does the same with roll information. It sounds
complicated, but it really is just a fancy compass.


It sounds like an upgrade of the Garmin 196!

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: (requires authentication)

see the Warbird's Forum at
www.warbirdforum.com
and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com
  #5  
Old February 25th 04, 09:37 PM
Ben Jackson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

In article ,
C J Campbell wrote:

The glass panel does not use gyros, but the backup instruments do. The
Garmin 1000 gets pitch information by detecting changes in the vertical
component of the Earth's magnetic field and by cross referencing that with
information from the GPS.


Those sources aren't responsive enough. I believe the uses MEMS gyros
to provide instantaneous relative attitude information and combine them
in a Kalman filter with the other sources you mention to get long term
absolute attitude reference.

--
Ben Jackson

http://www.ben.com/
  #6  
Old February 25th 04, 10:05 PM
Marc J. Zeitlin
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Cub Driver wrote:

Unnamed Quoted person:
The
Garmin 1000 gets pitch information by detecting changes in the vertical
component of the Earth's magnetic field and by cross referencing that

with
information from the GPS. It does the same with roll information. It

sounds
complicated, but it really is just a fancy compass.


It sounds like an upgrade of the Garmin 196!


Except that the quoted paragraph is incorrect. While the 1000 does use the
GPS and a magnetometer to stabilize the AHRS and to allow for "flying
reboots", it does use a standard AHRS (solid state gyros) for attitude
reference. From the Garmin documentation:

"Advanced AHRS architecture
For reliable output and referencing of aircraft position, rate, vector and
acceleration data, the G1000 uses Garmin's innovative GRS77 Attitude and
Heading Reference System (AHRS). Able to properly reference itself even
while the aircraft is moving, the Garmin AHRS offers all the standard
elements of traditional strap-down AHRS - at a fraction of the cost. What's
more, it uses additional comparative inputs from GPS, magnetometer and air
data computer information to achieve new levels of integrity, reliability
and precision."

Notice the "additional comparative inputs".

--
Marc J. Zeitlin email: |
http://www.cozybuilders.org/
http://marc.zeitlin.home.comcast.net/


  #7  
Old February 26th 04, 12:24 AM
Newps
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Have you ever tried to break the glass on one of them instruments? It's
pretty damn hard to do and impossible if you don't have a good sized
hammer. In my 182 I know exactly where the static lines are under the
panel. In the event both static ports get blocked I will reach for the
static line near my left shin and pull it off the fitting. This is
infinitely easier than busting a pretty small piece of glass and won't
end up costing me any money.

Scott Schluer wrote:

I've got a question about the glass panel displays in the C182 (or any other
aircraft for that matter). I was reading this month's edition of AOPA Pilot
magazine and the cover story is the C182T and the new glass panel displays
Cessna decided to incorporate and it got me thinking. My question is: how
does a glass panel display take information received from the pitot-static
and gyro systems and translate that into the display? On "standard" panels,
the pitot-static and gyro systems power the instruments be means of a
mechanical linkage between air pressure differentials or gyros and the
instrument display itself. Now, on a glass panel, I'm assuming that
mechanical linkage is no more. Is everything I know about how instruments
work out the window with glass panels?

For example, if my static source becomes clogged, I would assume that the
pitot-staitc instruments on the glass panel would be affected the same as
they always were. But can I still break the glass on one of the other
"standard" instruments using static pressure that the 182T still
incorporates for redundancy (airspeed, altimiter)? If I broke the glass on
the standard altimiter for example (assuming my glass panel was fully
functional so that I wouldn't need to rely on the standard altimiter, but
the static source was blocked causing erroneous indications), would that
allow static air pressure to flow where it needs to in order to accurately
reflect on the glass panel display also?

I'm just a little confused as to how the glass panel instruments actually
work. Can someone provide an explanation?

Thanks,

Scott



  #8  
Old February 26th 04, 05:34 AM
Scott Schluer
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Makes sense...also an obvious point about the alternate static air. ;-) I
don't have much experience in newer aircraft, most of my flight time has
been logged in older C172s with no alternate static port.

"C J Campbell" wrote in message
...
The glass panel instruments still use the pitot/static system. If your
static port becomes plugged, pull the alternate static source knob. Don't

go
breaking any glass instruments.

The glass panel does not use gyros, but the backup instruments do. The
Garmin 1000 gets pitch information by detecting changes in the vertical
component of the Earth's magnetic field and by cross referencing that with
information from the GPS. It does the same with roll information. It

sounds
complicated, but it really is just a fancy compass.

If it were not for legacy aircraft in the ATC system we could dump the
excessively complicated dependence on magnetic headings and give all
vectors, winds, headings, etc., relative to true north. Continually

mapping
the shifting magnetic field and updating databases, IFR and VFR charts,
radio navigation aids, and training materials is a major expense.




  #9  
Old February 26th 04, 04:19 PM
Mark
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"Scott Schluer" wrote in message news:NQ2%[email protected]
I've got a question about the glass panel displays in the C182 (or any other
aircraft for that matter). I was reading this month's edition of AOPA Pilot
magazine and the cover story is the C182T and the new glass panel displays
Cessna decided to incorporate and it got me thinking. My question is: how
does a glass panel display take information received from the pitot-static
and gyro systems and translate that into the display? On "standard" panels,
the pitot-static and gyro systems power the instruments be means of a
mechanical linkage between air pressure differentials or gyros and the
instrument display itself. Now, on a glass panel, I'm assuming that
mechanical linkage is no more. Is everything I know about how instruments
work out the window with glass panels?

For example, if my static source becomes clogged, I would assume that the
pitot-staitc instruments on the glass panel would be affected the same as
they always were. But can I still break the glass on one of the other
"standard" instruments using static pressure that the 182T still
incorporates for redundancy (airspeed, altimiter)? If I broke the glass on
the standard altimiter for example (assuming my glass panel was fully
functional so that I wouldn't need to rely on the standard altimiter, but
the static source was blocked causing erroneous indications), would that
allow static air pressure to flow where it needs to in order to accurately
reflect on the glass panel display also?

I'm just a little confused as to how the glass panel instruments actually
work. Can someone provide an explanation?

Thanks,

Scott


Side note... (sorry for the thread jacking).

Has anyone got the endorsement needed to fly a glass panel display
182? I think it's call a "Advance Technology Endorsement"? I'm
wondering what the checkout is like.
  #10  
Old February 26th 04, 06:51 PM
john smith
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Mark wrote:
"Scott Schluer" wrote in message news:NQ2%[email protected]

I've got a question about the glass panel displays in the C182 (or any other
aircraft for that matter). I was reading this month's edition of AOPA Pilot
magazine and the cover story is the C182T and the new glass panel displays
Cessna decided to incorporate and it got me thinking. My question is: how
does a glass panel display take information received from the pitot-static
and gyro systems and translate that into the display? On "standard" panels,
the pitot-static and gyro systems power the instruments be means of a
mechanical linkage between air pressure differentials or gyros and the
instrument display itself. Now, on a glass panel, I'm assuming that
mechanical linkage is no more. Is everything I know about how instruments
work out the window with glass panels?

For example, if my static source becomes clogged, I would assume that the
pitot-staitc instruments on the glass panel would be affected the same as
they always were. But can I still break the glass on one of the other
"standard" instruments using static pressure that the 182T still
incorporates for redundancy (airspeed, altimiter)? If I broke the glass on
the standard altimiter for example (assuming my glass panel was fully
functional so that I wouldn't need to rely on the standard altimiter, but
the static source was blocked causing erroneous indications), would that
allow static air pressure to flow where it needs to in order to accurately
reflect on the glass panel display also?

I'm just a little confused as to how the glass panel instruments actually
work. Can someone provide an explanation?

Thanks,

Scott



Side note... (sorry for the thread jacking).

Has anyone got the endorsement needed to fly a glass panel display
182? I think it's call a "Advance Technology Endorsement"? I'm
wondering what the checkout is like.


You mean FITS?

 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Glass Panel Scan? G Farris Instrument Flight Rules 6 October 13th 04 04:14 AM
Panel Lights - Need Help Barnyard BOb - Home Built 2 May 29th 04 07:51 PM
Air Force Academy Review Panel Releases Report Otis Willie Military Aviation 0 September 19th 03 03:45 AM
Air Force Museum forms review panel Otis Willie Military Aviation 2 August 29th 03 04:41 PM
Lesson in Glass JimC Owning 3 August 6th 03 01:09 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 04:36 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2004-2018 AviationBanter.
The comments are property of their posters.