EU Heavy Bomber ideas?

Alan Minyard writes:
On Tue, 22 Jun 2004 00:10:25 +0100, "Paul J. Adam" wrote:

In message , Alan Minyard
writes
Interesting comment, since the EU does not have "modern fighters"

Eurofighter? Rafale? Gripen?

Not capable, modern a/c

Bit hard to deny that Gripen is (and has been since '97) the most
"modern" fighter in service.

As for "capable", on usenet, who knows.

/Tomas

In message , Alan Minyard
writes
On Tue, 22 Jun 2004 00:10:25 +0100, "Paul J. Adam"
wrote:
Eurofighter? Rafale? Gripen?

Not capable, modern a/c

Based on what analysis?

Tornado GR.4? Harrier GR.9?

Harrier is not a capable strike a/c,

The results tend to disprove this.

although it has been used
as such on occasion. The Tornado is OK if you have air supremacy.

And no slouch if you don't (when have US aircraft been so tested?)

Lynx AH.7? Tiger? Mangusta?

Not in the same league as Apache, etc.

That's a sizeable "et cetera" - the Cobra's a good attack helo and
performed well in TELIC, but it's still a much-updated 1960s design.

--
He thinks too much: such men are dangerous.
Julius Caesar I:2

Paul J. Adam MainBoxatjrwlynch[dot]demon{dot}co(.)uk

"M. J. Powell" wrote in message
...

Delete 'Austrian', Insert 'Swiss'?

Mike.
Swiss are NOT part of EU (just surrounded by it!)

David

"Tomas By" wrote in message
...
Alan Minyard writes:
On Tue, 22 Jun 2004 00:10:25 +0100, "Paul J. Adam"
wrote:

In message , Alan Minyard
writes
Interesting comment, since the EU does not have "modern fighters"

Eurofighter? Rafale? Gripen?

Not capable, modern a/c

Bit hard to deny that Gripen is (and has been since '97) the most
"modern" fighter in service.

As for "capable", on usenet, who knows.

And more importantly, how many Gripens can the EU (as a body) commit to
action anywhere in the world? None. Nada. Zilch. Its rapid reaction force,
which we heard so much about when it was first conceived, but much less
about as time pointed to the lack of practical requirements for its
formation, much less the laughable thought that the EU could ever be
coersced or encouraged to really coalesce around the thought of actually
deploying that paper dragon, is more aptly described as a "rapid reaction
farce". The inability of the EU to reach a single acceptable course of
action regarding Iraq a year or so ago points to the fact that the body is
"not ready for prime time" when it comes to foreign policy; too many of the
member nations seem to consider their *own* dealings with that body as being
an element of *foreign* policy!

Brooks


/Tomas

Alan Minyard wrote:

Harrier is not a capable strike a/c, although it has been used
as such on occasion. The Tornado is OK if you have air supremacy.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

With that qualification, you could deliver some mean munitions with an
old Vickers Vimy.

:-)

"Ragnar" a écrit dans le message de
...


Gee, I worked at MAC HQ from 86 to 92 and we had lots of C-141s going to
Chad in 86-87. Seems the French needed help . . . . again.


Well, it's not very suprising that MAC planes were sent over there, given
the fact that US military advisors were present in Chad since the beginning
of the 80's, the US and France being the two only nations militarily helping
the Chadian government.

See : http://www.country-data.com/cgi-bin/query/r-2376.html

It's not the French you were supporting, it was the Chadians.

See also :
http://www.country-data.com/cgi-bin/query/r-2377.html
and
http://www.country-data.com/cgi-bin/query/r-2378.html


I'm not denying the role the United States played in Chad, nor saying that
they didn't help the French in probably more ways than officialy stated but
your initial statements ("large hand in getting the French in Chad", "large
hand in supporting them", "the US stepped in to get troops there", "France
couldn't support themselves once deployed", etc...) are just false.
Pdt Mitterrand had good relationships with the different US administrations
he had to deal with (by today's standard, I guess they were even excellent)
but he was also quite aware of the many subtle, diplomatic, attempts on the
part of the US to increase their influence in Africa and diminish France's
one. Wether it complies or not with your biased view of facts, he clearly
refused the US direct help in 1983.
Note also that neither operation Manta neither operation Epervier were
gigantic deployments and while revealing the limits of the French forces
projection means, it was not beyonf their capabilities.

Nowadays, when French troops are deployed, be it in Africa or somewhere
else, they use more civilian An124s than AMC C-5s.


ArVa

"Paul J. Adam" wrote in message
...
In message , Thomas J.
Paladino Jr. writes
"Paul J. Adam" wrote in message
...
Eurofighter? Rafale? Gripen?

How many of them are actually in service? Hmmm....

More than there are F-22s or JSFs

Tornado GR.4? Harrier GR.9?

How many?

Eighty-four Tornado GR.4s in seven frontline squadrons, plus forty-two


Where did you get these figures from if you don't mind me asking? I was
pretty sure that 140 had went through the GR4 MLU hangars?

In message , Ian
writes
"Paul J. Adam" wrote in message
...
Eighty-four Tornado GR.4s in seven frontline squadrons, plus forty-two

Where did you get these figures from if you don't mind me asking? I was
pretty sure that 140 had went through the GR4 MLU hangars?

http://www.raf.mod.uk/

There may be more in attrition reserve and otherwise off the books, but
that's the cited operational strength.

--
He thinks too much: such men are dangerous.
Julius Caesar I:2

Paul J. Adam MainBoxatjrwlynch[dot]demon{dot}co(.)uk

From: "ArVa" no.arva.spam_at_no_os.fr


The strategic airlift has been accomplished by French Air Force Transalls

ArVa

Transalls are strategic airlift? Tactical perhaps?

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

"Kevin Brooks" writes:
And more importantly, how many Gripens can the EU (as a body) commit to
action anywhere in the world?

Actually...

There is now something called the `Swedish Air Force Rapid Reaction
Unit JAS 39'

http://www.f17.mil.se/article.php?id=7841

(The page seems not to be available in English unfortunately)

/Tomas