Recovery by Spot

Just back from a long weekend at Mifflin...

We had a glider land at the big field near the South end of Raystown ridge Sunday about 1930 local (30 minutes before sunset). His was the last glider flying, no one heard his landing call on 123.3. There is no cell coverage and no available land line phone for several miles around this remote field. At sunset, we noticed we were short one glider. We found the pilot by consulting his spot page, noted multiple pings in same location and an "Okay" msg. Access to this field is difficult, includes a locked gate, so authorities were involved. They got the pilot out late evening, glider recovered on Monday. Despite our assurances that the pilot was okay, the cav was sent complete with fire and emergency medical support.

Coincidentally, this pilot and I were discussing our lack of satisfaction with Spot the evening before. Both of us planned not to renew our subscriptions.

This incident underscores the obvious problems with cell tracking, PLBs (only communicates with .gov functionaries, provides no data, only a non-specific call for emergency help), Spot (one way comm without confirmation, only sends canned msgs to pre-arranged email and txt via email, many potential points of failure, toy like reliability). Inreach might be better? Perhaps. If your device hasn't been bricked by a software "update".

It's probable in this specific incident that we'd have figured things out (albeit with significant uncertainty) from a cell based tracking device. I expect the flight track, time of day and lack of other communication would have made the Raystown field the first place we'd look, but having a firm location and okay msg was pretty huge here. I'm not rethinking any of my misgivings about Spot, but in this specific instance it was a big help.

best regards,
Evan Ludeman / T8

At 02:47 02 May 2018, Tango Eight wrote:
Just back from a long weekend at Mifflin...
.....................
We had a glider land at the big field near the South end of Raystown
ridge............There is no cell coverage............



Evan,

Curious if the pilot considered using the "emergency calls only" function
of
his phone as this might have accessed the AT&T Mobility network which is
shown as having good coverage in the Raystown Lake / Mill creek area
https://www.nperf.com/en/map/US/5206...urgh/2420.ATT-
Mobility/signal/?
ll=40.31353734645162&lg=-78.18030219742496&zoom=10

Max

At 02:47 02 May 2018, Tango Eight wrote:
Just back from a long weekend at Mifflin...
.....................
We had a glider land at the big field near the South end of Raystown
ridge............There is no cell coverage............



Evan,

Curious if the pilot considered using the "emergency calls only" function
of
his phone as this might have accessed the AT&T Mobility network which is
shown as having good coverage in the Raystown Lake / Mill creek area
https://www.nperf.com/en/map/US/5206...urgh/2420.ATT-
Mobility/signal/?
ll=40.31353734645162&lg=-78.18030219742496&zoom=10

Max

El martes, 1 de mayo de 2018, 23:47:21 (UTC-3), Tango Eight escribió:
Just back from a long weekend at Mifflin...

We had a glider land at the big field near the South end of Raystown ridge Sunday about 1930 local (30 minutes before sunset). His was the last glider flying, no one heard his landing call on 123.3. There is no cell coverage and no available land line phone for several miles around this remote field. At sunset, we noticed we were short one glider. We found the pilot by consulting his spot page, noted multiple pings in same location and an "Okay" msg. Access to this field is difficult, includes a locked gate, so authorities were involved. They got the pilot out late evening, glider recovered on Monday. Despite our assurances that the pilot was okay, the cav was sent complete with fire and emergency medical support.

Coincidentally, this pilot and I were discussing our lack of satisfaction with Spot the evening before. Both of us planned not to renew our subscriptions.

This incident underscores the obvious problems with cell tracking, PLBs (only communicates with .gov functionaries, provides no data, only a non-specific call for emergency help), Spot (one way comm without confirmation, only sends canned msgs to pre-arranged email and txt via email, many potential points of failure, toy like reliability). Inreach might be better? Perhaps. If your device hasn't been bricked by a software "update".

It's probable in this specific incident that we'd have figured things out (albeit with significant uncertainty) from a cell based tracking device. I expect the flight track, time of day and lack of other communication would have made the Raystown field the first place we'd look, but having a firm location and okay msg was pretty huge here. I'm not rethinking any of my misgivings about Spot, but in this specific instance it was a big help.

best regards,
Evan Ludeman / T8

Hi Evan,

We fly in a VERY remote area, central Chilean Andes and coast mtns, mostly covered by fields that you don't want to land, ... at least in my club, the use of SPOT is mandatory for XC flights. Club gliders have their own assigned SPOT, they have standarized messages for each button which are written on every glider's checklist in case of use, and their track is shown in the same webpage.

I agree that SPOT is not reliable at all (mostly during constant tracking), but sometimes we have absolutely no cel coverage, so it's a very good option. Just carry spare batteries ALWAYS, and make sure that the device is facing up to the clear sky while sending the message. If you're looking for a tracking system, probably FLARM, Mode S TPDR, or a cellphone based system would be better, IF YOU HAVE COVERAGE.

At least my opinion is that SPOT implementation in our club has been a success. Every outlanded glider for the last years has been spotted and supported inmediately, regardless cel coverage. Although, thanks god we haven't used the SOS button yet.

Francisco
Club de Planeadores de ValparaÃ*so

On the glider retrieve with the pilot the next day we found that there was excellent coverage with Verizon. You could see the tower.

I was unaware that you could use an emergency call function to get out of network. I have been at the southern part of the Everglades with no verizon coverage (there is some attention coverage) and had no roaming option. Any idea how to start an emergency call. From a lock screen?

RR

Great stuff (but he missed the best day)
On the lock screen of the phone, if there is a message: "emergency calls only" you can get out to the authorities. But we generally don't want them involved in a retrieve.
InReach is a far superior method of communication than (certainly the present) SPOT. Before getting stuck in the middle of nowhere, install the Earthmate app and use it to connect via bluetooth to the InReach. Texts can then be sent to anyone using the touch keyboard of the phone. No, voice to text won't work as you're out of range.
My InReach is in a container attached to a hard point on the parachute harness. Both made by a parachute rigger.
Jim

Take a look at Republic Wireless.Â* It works on all carriers and no
roaming charges.Â* Not affiliated, just a long-time happy customer.

On 5/2/2018 6:10 AM, RR wrote:
On the glider retrieve with the pilot the next day we found that there was excellent coverage with Verizon. You could see the tower.

I was unaware that you could use an emergency call function to get out of network. I have been at the southern part of the Everglades with no verizon coverage (there is some attention coverage) and had no roaming option. Any idea how to start an emergency call. From a lock screen?

RR


--
Dan, 5J

On Tuesday, 1 May 2018 20:47:21 UTC-6, Tango Eight wrote:
Just back from a long weekend at Mifflin...

We had a glider land at the big field near the South end of Raystown ridge Sunday about 1930 local (30 minutes before sunset). His was the last glider flying, no one heard his landing call on 123.3. There is no cell coverage and no available land line phone for several miles around this remote field. At sunset, we noticed we were short one glider. We found the pilot by consulting his spot page, noted multiple pings in same location and an "Okay" msg. Access to this field is difficult, includes a locked gate, so authorities were involved. They got the pilot out late evening, glider recovered on Monday. Despite our assurances that the pilot was okay, the cav was sent complete with fire and emergency medical support.

Coincidentally, this pilot and I were discussing our lack of satisfaction with Spot the evening before. Both of us planned not to renew our subscriptions.

This incident underscores the obvious problems with cell tracking, PLBs (only communicates with .gov functionaries, provides no data, only a non-specific call for emergency help), Spot (one way comm without confirmation, only sends canned msgs to pre-arranged email and txt via email, many potential points of failure, toy like reliability). Inreach might be better? Perhaps. If your device hasn't been bricked by a software "update".

It's probable in this specific incident that we'd have figured things out (albeit with significant uncertainty) from a cell based tracking device. I expect the flight track, time of day and lack of other communication would have made the Raystown field the first place we'd look, but having a firm location and okay msg was pretty huge here. I'm not rethinking any of my misgivings about Spot, but in this specific instance it was a big help.

best regards,
Evan Ludeman / T8

Back in 2012 at the 15M Nationals at Mifflin, Evan you were flying in this contest, a glider went into the trees during the task. The pilot activated the SPOT SOS and the crew came into the club house with the message(s) on their phone. The glider pilot was unable to try his cell phone due to losing their reading glasses during the crash. We were mapping the location and trying to determine which county agency to contact. When the correct county agency was contacted they had received a 911 call as the pilot had recovered the glasses and accessed cell phone.

However the location determined by triangulating the cell phone was many many miles off, I do not remember exact number but greater than 10 miles. One of the tow planes was sent out with a spotter and verified the location and directed emergency folks to the scene. Te county agency was skeptical about the coordinates we had from SPOT as they were unfamiliar with the devices.

Yes I will always fly with a satellite based tracker and notification device

I'd like to ask a purely hypothetical question, applied to this scenario... Had this pilot been equipped with ADS-B "out" and no SPOT or other alternate means of satellite communication/alerting methodologies, what would have been the sequence of events for finding him? Let's make an assumption that he was being tracked by ATC at some (or most) of the flight. Would it have helped or not? Would it have been better/easier to find him? If so with what tools?

Is ADS-B 'out' a reasonable alternative to SPOT or is it just riddled with too many limitations (perhaps your mileage will vary depending on the ATC coverage in your area and the tools for tracking)?

Gents,

You forgot about one more device we all have installed: VHF radio. Tune
in 121.5 MHZ and ask for a message relay. All airliners monitor 121,500
so the "coverage" is very good.

Wojciech