Any fliers?

"Krztalizer" wrote in message
...
|
| Was flying a C-54E up until the forest service tanker massacre last week.
|
| Hopefully it will be fixed and I will have a airtanker pilot career of
more
| than 3 weeks duration.
|
|
| Ron, I was thinking about you when I heard the decision to ax all the old
| firebombers in the fleet. Any word yet on how soon they will replace
them, or
| how they will provide qualified pilots for the "new" firebombers? That
747
| firebomber is freakin' amazing.
|
| Good luck in the future.
| v/r
| Gordon



Is the 747 firebomber a serious proposition ???????


I first thought it was a Photoshop fantasy - then a proof of concept - but
is it actually something that sober people are actually doing the numbers on
?



Cheers


Dave Kearton

Ron, I was thinking about you when I heard the decision to ax all the old
firebombers in the fleet. Any word yet on how soon they will replace them,
or
how they will provide qualified pilots for the "new" firebombers? That 747
firebomber is freakin' amazing.

Good luck in the future.
v/r
Gordon

The contracts were cancelled after the NTSB published a report saying that
there was not a system in place to assure airworthyness, and the Forest Circus
took that to mean they are the ones liable if anything goes wrong.

The western governors are up in arms, and congress might work on some kind of
emergency measure to bring the FAA into it somehow for some kind of inspection
program that they sign off on. The planes have been inspected heavily over the
past 2 years, and are probably safer than anytime since they came out of the
factory.

The planes are not grounded, we flew them back to the home base, they could
still be hired by states if they want. but I am optimistic something will be
soon soon to bring them back in operation.

As for that 747 system, thats an evergreen project, with some rumors of
homeland security funding. They are tanking up some additional planes now too
apparently, so I kinda suspect something fishy might be going on there.

I was out your way 2 weeks ago out of San Bernardino. Flew on a fire on camp
pendleton, temecula, riverside, and others during that busy week there.

The fleet has to be replaced soon, and hopefully forest service and congress
will help, because at the low ball rates the FS pays, they only maintain the
planes they have.

50 hours in the C-54 and hoping for more!



Ron
Tanker 65, C-54E (DC-4)
Silver City Tanker Base

Is the 747 firebomber a serious proposition ???????


I first thought it was a Photoshop fantasy - then a proof of concept - but
is it actually something that sober people are actually doing the numbers on
?



Cheers


Dave Kearton

They have an aircraft tanked up, and have done lots of drops. I think there
are some situations that it can be good in, but I can think of a whole lot of
others too it might not be that great.

However, a lot of the concerns expressed about it being too big, were also said
when the B-17 was being introduced into forest fire work.


Ron
Tanker 65, C-54E (DC-4)
Silver City Tanker Base

Sigh ....

True on both counts. Let's overlook the last (unmentioned) criterion.

R / John

"John R Weiss" wrote in message
news:h_Tpc.63391$iF6.5578946@attbi_s02...
"Krztalizer" wrote...
R / John (former fighter guy

Oh, blarney. John, there is no such thing as a 'former fighter pilot'
and
you
know it. You'll have fangs to the day you die.

...not to mention a big watch. :-)

"Ron" wrote in message
...

Ron, I was thinking about you when I heard the decision to ax all the old
firebombers in the fleet. Any word yet on how soon they will replace them,
or
how they will provide qualified pilots for the "new" firebombers? That 747
firebomber is freakin' amazing.

Good luck in the future.
v/r
Gordon

The contracts were cancelled after the NTSB published a report saying that
there was not a system in place to assure airworthyness, and the Forest Circus
took that to mean they are the ones liable if anything goes wrong.

The western governors are up in arms, and congress might work on some kind of
emergency measure to bring the FAA into it somehow for some kind of inspection
program that they sign off on. The planes have been inspected heavily over
the
past 2 years, and are probably safer than anytime since they came out of the
factory.

The planes are not grounded, we flew them back to the home base, they could
still be hired by states if they want. but I am optimistic something will be
soon soon to bring them back in operation.

As for that 747 system, thats an evergreen project, with some rumors of
homeland security funding. They are tanking up some additional planes now too
apparently, so I kinda suspect something fishy might be going on there.

I was out your way 2 weeks ago out of San Bernardino. Flew on a fire on camp
pendleton, temecula, riverside, and others during that busy week there.

The fleet has to be replaced soon, and hopefully forest service and congress
will help, because at the low ball rates the FS pays, they only maintain the
planes they have.

50 hours in the C-54 and hoping for more!

I hope you enjoyed them.....I know I did in the Rescue versions we flew, and I
hope you have many more. She's almost as good and forgiving a bird as the
gooney, an earlier Douglas contribution to aviation history.

George Z.

I hope you enjoyed them.....I know I did in the Rescue versions we flew, and
I
hope you have many more. She's almost as good and forgiving a bird as the
gooney, an earlier Douglas contribution to aviation history.

George Z.

I certainly have enjoyed it, although I think those mixtures are certainly in
an inconvenient place for the copilot.

Those douglas series 4/6/7 planes are really well built. The four has 2 wing
spars and a backup in case that fails. The main complaint I have about the 4
is that it is really underpowered. They fixed that in the 6 and 7.

My captain took a SA-7 hit over Africa in a DC-7, made it back to the airport.


Ron
Tanker 65, C-54E (DC-4)
Silver City Tanker Base

I was out your way 2 weeks ago out of San Bernardino. Flew on a fire on camp
pendleton, temecula, riverside, and others during that busy week there.

That area is such a tinderbox, I believe it will be keeping firefighters in
business forever. :\

Thanks for helping - sure not looking forward to late summer here. I'm betting
you'll be invited back.

v/r
Gordon

Is the 747 firebomber a serious proposition ???????



Dave, would I ever lie to you?

no comments, all the rest of you bums out there.

G

"Krztalizer" wrote in message
...
|
| Is the 747 firebomber a serious proposition ???????
|
|
|
| Dave, would I ever lie to you?
|
| no comments, all the rest of you bums out there.
|
| G



Coupla years ago we had a pair of Canadairs (415s IIRC) on a demo tour,
during our fire season. The positioning flight was free - just pay the
hours on duty.


The distributors just didn't understand that $27M per airframe can buy a
whole lot of smaller and more useful planes. Every now and again they
give it another try, maybe they have too much money.


Our fires are generally different than yours, no lakes, no really large
dams and the nearest refilling point is at least half an hour away.
A dozen airtrucks with 1,800L on board is cheaper than one plane with
6,000L.


Here, the major fires are fought with helos and 'cab ranks' of smaller
planes lining up for a run and then going off to an empty field to land and
top up.




Cheers


Dave Kearton

Our fires are generally different than yours, no lakes, no really large
dams and the nearest refilling point is at least half an hour away.
A dozen airtrucks with 1,800L on board is cheaper than one plane with
6,000L.

Not uncommon to see a variety of bombers working multiple fires in a relatively
small geographic area. Looks like hell in a bowl. Worst part is ashfall,
knowing each fleck floating down is the remains of a 80 year old tree or
someone's bedroom furnishings. I hate that aspect of socal living.

yfG