floats coming on and off

Talking with some of the sea plane operations, it seems pretty common
to take floats on and off. However, the rigging and all for the floats
(rudders, etc) seems complicated. Is it actually that easy to put
floats on and off? If I bought a Champ could I just pick up a used
pair of EDO float and put them on every once in awhile (I know
insurance is another issue..)? Most of the floats for 2 place planes
look very similar, are they generic to type?


-robert

(Robert M. Gary) wrote in message . com...
Talking with some of the sea plane operations, it seems pretty common
to take floats on and off. However, the rigging and all for the floats
(rudders, etc) seems complicated. Is it actually that easy to put
floats on and off?

It's more complicated than changing a tire, but not unreasonable to do
at the beginning and end of the season, especially if the shop does it
often.

If I bought a Champ could I just pick up a used
pair of EDO float and put them on every once in awhile (I know
insurance is another issue..)? Most of the floats for 2 place planes
look very similar, are they generic to type?

The rule with floats is that 1 float needs to be capable of supporting
90% of the max gross weight of the plane. Many manufacturers name
their floats based on the weight they can support, e.g. "Edo 2100" can
hold up 2100 lbs.

Each model of float by each mfr. will have an STC allowing it to be
installed on certain airframes. Also, sometimes the STC for float A
allows an increase in the gross weight (b/c the floats generate lift
in flight) while float B, which is no different really, did not do to
testing to obtain this modification. Worth checking each model to see
who offers the best overall package.

Also, a Champ would not be my choice of airframe, I'd much prefer a
PA-18, but if you just want to go for a ride around the lake it's
probably plenty.

Training is very important. Every landing is being made off-airport
and the equipment is less forgiving. If you haven't earned your rating
yet and want to learn with a bunch of real professionals, check these
guys out:

http://arctic.net/akfloats/

Just be forewarned that once you've flown in Alaska everything else
will pale in comparison.

Best,
-cwk.

There is some specialized equipment needed. A hoist of some kind. I go on
and off floats every other year. A Cessna 185 takes three men four hours to
convert to floats.

For many installations an STC is not necessary. For instance, EDO 2960's are
certified on a Cessna 185 and do not require an STC. However, a set of
Aerocets require an STC.


Karl
"C Kingsbury" wrote in message
om...
(Robert M. Gary) wrote in message
. com...
Talking with some of the sea plane operations, it seems pretty common
to take floats on and off. However, the rigging and all for the floats
(rudders, etc) seems complicated. Is it actually that easy to put
floats on and off?

It's more complicated than changing a tire, but not unreasonable to do
at the beginning and end of the season, especially if the shop does it
often.

If I bought a Champ could I just pick up a used
pair of EDO float and put them on every once in awhile (I know
insurance is another issue..)? Most of the floats for 2 place planes
look very similar, are they generic to type?

The rule with floats is that 1 float needs to be capable of supporting
90% of the max gross weight of the plane. Many manufacturers name
their floats based on the weight they can support, e.g. "Edo 2100" can
hold up 2100 lbs.

Each model of float by each mfr. will have an STC allowing it to be
installed on certain airframes. Also, sometimes the STC for float A
allows an increase in the gross weight (b/c the floats generate lift
in flight) while float B, which is no different really, did not do to
testing to obtain this modification. Worth checking each model to see
who offers the best overall package.

Also, a Champ would not be my choice of airframe, I'd much prefer a
PA-18, but if you just want to go for a ride around the lake it's
probably plenty.

Training is very important. Every landing is being made off-airport
and the equipment is less forgiving. If you haven't earned your rating
yet and want to learn with a bunch of real professionals, check these
guys out:

http://arctic.net/akfloats/

Just be forewarned that once you've flown in Alaska everything else
will pale in comparison.

Best,
-cwk.

Most people figure about a day to change.

Mike
MU-2


"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message
om...
Talking with some of the sea plane operations, it seems pretty common
to take floats on and off. However, the rigging and all for the floats
(rudders, etc) seems complicated. Is it actually that easy to put
floats on and off? If I bought a Champ could I just pick up a used
pair of EDO float and put them on every once in awhile (I know
insurance is another issue..)? Most of the floats for 2 place planes
look very similar, are they generic to type?


-robert

Training is very important. Every landing is being made off-airport
and the equipment is less forgiving. If you haven't earned your rating
yet and want to learn with a bunch of real professionals, check these
guys out:

http://arctic.net/akfloats/

Thanks. I did both my private and commercial sea ratings with Terry
Campbell at Norcal aviation http://www.norcalaviation.com . Terry was
featured on a Discovery Wings program on sea instructors. Technically,
I'm also a sea instructor now.

-Robert, CFI (land and sea).

(C Kingsbury) wrote in message . com...
(Robert M. Gary) wrote in message . com...
Talking with some of the sea plane operations, it seems pretty common
to take floats on and off. However, the rigging and all for the floats
(rudders, etc) seems complicated. Is it actually that easy to put
floats on and off?

It's more complicated than changing a tire, but not unreasonable to do
at the beginning and end of the season, especially if the shop does it
often.

How do you get the plane from the lake to the airport after putting wheels on?

"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message
om...

How do you get the plane from the lake to the airport after putting
wheels on?


Sometimes seaplanes are landed on wet grass runways. Some airports adjacent
to water have seaplane ramps.

(Robert M. Gary) wrote in message . com...

How do you get the plane from the lake to the airport after putting wheels on?

Just land on the runway with the floats still on

In areas with high densities of floatplanes you'll find seaplane docks
with colocated runways. The kind of planes you typically see floats on
don't need big fancy runways to operate from, a nice long stretch of
grass will suffice.

Personally, my win-the-lottery plane would have to be a Caravan on
amphibs. The floats cost about as much as the plane and I don't even
want to think about insurance, but talk about a recreational vehicle!

Amphibs have two problems: weight and maintenance cost. I hear they're
murder at annual time.

Best,
-cwk.

On 15 Aug 2004 17:37:36 -0700, (C Kingsbury)
wrote:


Amphibs have two problems: weight and maintenance cost. I hear they're
murder at annual time.

Have been around a couple Wipline amphibs (Beaver and 206) and a
single Edo amphib (185), no salt-water ops.

Really didn't think they were too bad to "annual". We had a stack of
shoring blocks and used a fork lift to left 'em up prior to
inspecting/lubing the gear.

Climbing up and down onto/into/out of the airplane is "murder" on the
knees, though...

TC

Many years ago I had an Aeronca Sedan on Edo 2000s. It took a big day
each time to change the floats for the wheels etc. We lifted the
airframe by the engine mount using three 4 X 4s as a tripod, although
looking back on it I wouldn't recommend that from a lifting stress
standpoint.

Don't plan on landing on wet grass with floats. I have heard that
dewey grass is more slippery, but a lot of float planes have ended on
their backs after such a stunt.

We built a three wheeled (a non swiveling nose wheel worked well)
dolly for the spring takeoff from a hard surface runway, using a drag
chute to stop the dolly after liftoff. In the fall we ramped it extra
high on shore and converted it to wheels after freezeup, flying it off
the ice back to a field to get it worked on.

The first consideration on a float plane is where are you going to
keep it. Hull insurance rates are outrageous. A cousin of mine was in
the aircraft insurance business, and among other things insured four
float planes. In one summer he lost all 4 of them!