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How common are aircraft partnerships compared to outright ownerships?
I've come to the point where I'm looking to get into owning an
aircraft. However, I've read (and calculated) that the break-even point for owning comes after about 150-200 hours per year. I'm not going to be doing nearly that amount of flying. In fact, I don't know anybody other than a CFI or some other commercial pilot who would. So, it seems that a partnership would be "the way to go" for most people who want to vacation or take extended trips with an aircraft. If so, however, how come they're so *hard* to find? I don't see any listed in trade-a-plane or on any aircraft commerce sites like mooneymart or whatnot. Based upon the number of listings that I've come across, partnerships are downright endangered species. Are they? And, if not, how do I go about *finding* them? - Joe |
#2
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Put some ads up on the bulletin boards at local airports. There are
usually several partnerships available. Ask around. |
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#4
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you might try looking at http://www.aopa.org at the aviation classified ads
(click on the link near the top of the window, more-or-less centered in the banner). By the way, I completely agree that sharing an airplane is (from a financial perspective) the only way to go, assuming of course that you are able to find a good partnership. Good luck! - Leonard wrote in message oups.com... I've come to the point where I'm looking to get into owning an aircraft. However, I've read (and calculated) that the break-even point for owning comes after about 150-200 hours per year. I'm not going to be doing nearly that amount of flying. In fact, I don't know anybody other than a CFI or some other commercial pilot who would. So, it seems that a partnership would be "the way to go" for most people who want to vacation or take extended trips with an aircraft. If so, however, how come they're so *hard* to find? I don't see any listed in trade-a-plane or on any aircraft commerce sites like mooneymart or whatnot. Based upon the number of listings that I've come across, partnerships are downright endangered species. Are they? And, if not, how do I go about *finding* them? - Joe |
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#7
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On 5 Aug 2005 01:23:51 -0700, wrote:
I've come to the point where I'm looking to get into owning an aircraft. However, I've read (and calculated) that the break-even point for owning comes after about 150-200 hours per year. I'm not going to be doing nearly that amount of flying. In fact, I don't know anybody other than a CFI or some other commercial pilot who would. So, it seems that a partnership would be "the way to go" for most people who want to vacation or take extended trips with an aircraft. If so, however, how come they're so *hard* to find? I don't see any listed in trade-a-plane or on any aircraft commerce sites like mooneymart or whatnot. Based upon the number of listings that I've come across, partnerships are downright endangered species. First, partnerships and clubs are probably the predominant way of owning an aircraft or at least part of one. You might look into local flying clubs as well as partnerships. They are *usually* more flexible, less expensive, and may have more available aircraft. As others have already said, check out the bulletin boards at the local airports and if you don't find anything, post a note that your are looking for a partnership, or club to join. Normally I'd expect to fly more and pay less in a club than a partnership, but much depends on who you have for partners or club members. Either way, when in partnerships of clubs you have to pay even more attention to the preflight and become extra attentive as far as things that might fail. For the break even point that too varies. I found it to be around 75 to 100 hours for what I'm flying. There are couple of flying clubs around here (Central Michigan) that figure some where between $40 and $50 per hour. One has a Cherokee 180 (Hershey Bar wing - old one, but with a modern panel including a 430) and the other has a very nice 172 that is reasonably well equipped. Renting runs $75 to $100 an hour with a new 172 renting for around $125, or $135 per hour. Are they? And, if not, how do I go about *finding* them? Good Luck, Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member) (N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair) www.rogerhalstead.com - Joe |
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Roger wrote:
First, partnerships and clubs are probably the predominant way of owning an aircraft or at least part of one. You might look into local flying clubs as well as partnerships. They are *usually* more flexible, less expensive, and may have more available aircraft. I fly in a large club (200+ members) and a couple of times in the last year I have seriously looked into buying, both solo and partnership, but quite frankly the club is such a good deal I can't justify buying. In the club I pay dues of $45/mo, and $80/hr wet to fly 160 hp Piper Warrior II's with Apollo GPS and coupled autopilot. The club has a fleet of four of them. That is the sum total of my airplane expenses and includes a very good insurance policy (all club members are named insureds), access to a hangar with offices that the club owns, and social events. Since joining the club I've been flying on average 6 hours a month, which is 72 hours a year. I know exactly how much it has cost me and I also know exactly how much it will cost me in the future to fly. I ran the spreadsheet on buying a low-end plane by myself, and also on buying into a 3-way partnership on a little bit nicer plane. I never could make it work out without significant fudging, even leaving out the unknowns like how long before I need an overhaul, repairs, etc. My perception of the advantages and disadvantages of club vs. ownership: Advantages: 1. Cheaper 2. Absolutely predictable and controllable expenses (don't want to spend as much this month? Don't fly as much). 3. No financial risk (unexpected maint, value-killing ADs, sudden medical problem that makes an owned plane a white elephant, etc) 4. Maintenance not all my responsibility (members chip in to do maintenance but it doesn't all fall on one or two people). Financially, each squawk doesn't mean more $$$ out of my pocket. 5. With a fleet of four basically identical planes, not completely grounded by squawks, annuals, overhauls, etc. 6. I fly planes with better avionics and more capability than I could afford to buy myself 7. It's easy to figure exactly what it costs me to fly (yes this can also be a disadvantage . Disadvantages: 1. Availability -- don't count on being able to fly on a nice weekend day unless you reserved well ahead. This is the flip side of advantage #5. 2. Don't totally control my own fate. For example: Accidents or negligence by other members could affect the club's insurance situation (partnerships have this problem too, but with a club there's more people, therefore more variables). Another example: if the club board decides to sell or replace an airplane or change aircraft types, or specify different avionics from what I like, I have very little say in the matter. 3. Even though it's cheaper in the long run, it's emotionally hard to write a large check when returning from a long trip. More flying means you pay more, whereas when you own more flying means it gets cheaper (on a per-hour basis, anyway) 4. Must follow club SOP's, for example minimum runway lengths, required preapproval for grass strips, etc. For me this is not a problem because it ameliorates the first concern in disadvantage #2, plus my own personal mins exceed the SOPs but others might find it too restrictive. 5. Some clubs may restrict flexibility for long trips (though mine is pretty liberal on it and it hasn't been a problem for anyone as far as I know). 6. Easy to figure exactly what it costs to fly 7. No pride of ownership. I've concluded that I'd like to own a plane someday, but it will have to be when I have a lot more money than I do now. C'mon, stock market! |
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xyzzy wrote:
5. With a fleet of four basically identical planes, not completely grounded by squawks, annuals, overhauls, etc. This is one of my favorite "why a club" answers. The other related answer (which may not apply to your club) is that in a club has different types of aircraft, there's some diversity in your flying. - Andrew |
#10
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Andrew Gideon wrote:
xyzzy wrote: 5. With a fleet of four basically identical planes, not completely grounded by squawks, annuals, overhauls, etc. This is one of my favorite "why a club" answers. The other related answer (which may not apply to your club) is that in a club has different types of aircraft, there's some diversity in your flying. We also have 152's, which are such low-end trainers that hardly any non-student pilots fly them, and Mooneys, and there are some members that fly both Warriors and Mooneys. Most members just fly one type though, because each type caters to a different market. We're having that discussion now, looks like the club board has decided to sell two of the four Warriors and buy 2 172's. I personally don't like it because unless a pilot is willing to stay current in both types (which is an added expense and hassle), everyone's fleet availability just got cut in half -- I actually argue worse than in half because having one other plane of a type is much worse than having three others of the type when you show up for your instrument lesson and find the NAV radio on the plane you reserved is squawked. Others like the diversity of flying more, and quite frankly I think some members just like shopping for airplanes. Looks like the diversity/shopping crowd has won the argument. That's why the "you don't control your own fate" disadvantage has recently been added to my list of pros and cons for club vs. owning. |
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