10,500 feet is way the heck up there!

Orval
what are you flying - a comanche ?


Orval Fairbairn wrote:

In article ,
"G.R. Patterson III" wrote:

Dale wrote:

I come down a little faster than you though, normally around
3000-3500fpm. G

If I try more than about 1,000 fpm, the CHTs get out of the green on the low
side pretty quick.

George Patterson
A woman's perfect breakfast occurs when she's sitting at the table
sipping
gourmet coffee while looking at pictures of her son on the cover of
Sports
Illustrated, her daughter on the cover of Business Week, her boyfriend
on
the cover of Playgirl, and her husband on the back of the milk carton.

I always keep at least cruise power on when descending, until I descend
low enough to maintain 2300/23", gradually enriching the mixture as I
descand. I like to start descent 20-40 miles out, letting the speed
increase, to make up for speed lost in climb. With normal cruise about
150 mph IAS at 10000, I can build up to about 170-180 MPH on descent (no
worry, because redline is 230 MPH). That way, there is no spiralling
down at destination or cylinder cooling.

"Wayne" wrote in message
news
1 mile high is a pressure of around 12.2 PSI. so dropping from 5280'
to
sea level (14.7 PSI) (splash) would make a 2-1/2 PSI increase in pressure.
If you did that in 1 minute, then that would be 5280 FPM decent rate.

Compare to S.C.U.B.A. It's not that hard on the ears. In sea water,
every 33 feet is equal to 1 atmosphere of air (14.7PSI) A realitively fast
decent (2 minute) 132' would be like dropping around 23-1/2 times faster
or
124,000 FPM A 58.8PSI increase in less than 2 minutes and it's not that
hard
to do.

Anyone seen that girl that did that free dive to, I forget 500 feet
deep
or some crazy amount like that?

Try it with a cold and it can get real uncomfortable though.

The trip back up is where you need to go slowly or risk the bends.
Won't happen in a free dive. This is a result of taking a breath from some
depth (as little as 4 feet down) and then not exhaling when returning to the
surface, or staying at a certain depth for a long period of time and not
using decompression stops on the way back up :-)

I have only ever
dropped fast like that a few times in a plane. What's that equal out to in
a
160 nmph dive? I never realized an altimeter could move that fast.

What a great picture though. Next time I go far away, I will have to
hold the altitude, and get a shot like that. Yours turned out very well.
That was through a window?
Wayne



Benefits of a big head, I guess. ;-)

You routinely descent at 3500 feet per minute, Ben?

My ears never bother me in normal flight, but dropping *that* fast might
cause someone some pretty severe discomfort.
--

"John E. Carty" wrote in message
.. .
The trip back up is where you need to go slowly or risk the bends.
Won't happen in a free dive. This is a result of taking a breath from some
depth (as little as 4 feet down) and then not exhaling when returning to
the
surface

The "bends" result solely from too rapid an ascent, whereas holding your
breath is a problem no matter how slowly you ascend. The two are both
dangerous, but are not the same thing.

Otherwise, your point is accurate as far as I know.

Pete

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message news:DS_ib.770859$Ho3.201262@sccrnsc03...
Don't your ears bother you?

One thing I noticed when I started flying was that my ears stopped popping
after about 20 hours. I thought it was normal to get acclimated, but when
I mentioned it to some other local pilots they said they all still have
to clear their ears.

Benefits of a big head, I guess. ;-)

You routinely descent at 3500 feet per minute, Ben?

My ears never bother me in normal flight, but dropping *that* fast might
cause someone some pretty severe discomfort.


Couple of things; You think 10.5 seems high? Try spending 300 hours
or so not getting above 600 agl, then going up to the "high" altitude
of 1200'! When I looked at the altimeter, it hit me that, hey, I used
to think this was LOW altitude. And this was just from a summer
towing banners. I can only imagine what those Ag pilots think!

Two, a friend of mine used to fly jumpers in a King Air. Surface to
14,000 and back in about 10 minutes, most of it in a climb. He had to
be going down over 6000 fpm. After a few hundered hours of that, his
ear drums had so much scar tissue on them that they wouldn't 'seal'
enough to cause pain. Don't know how true it was, but that's what he
told me, only way I can think of he could manage to do that day after
day.

--
Mike

In article ,
"G.R. Patterson III" wrote:


If I try more than about 1,000 fpm, the CHTs get out of the green on the low
side pretty quick.

MP just above bottom of the green, RPM bottom of the green or a little
lower, lean to peak.

--
Dale L. Falk

There is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing
as simply messing around with airplanes.

http://home.gci.net/~sncdfalk/flying.html

In article 9I_ib.130302$%h1.131919@sccrnsc02,
"Jay Honeck" wrote:

I come down a little faster than you though, normally around
3000-3500fpm. G

Crikey!

Don't your ears bother you?

Eh, valsalva on way down. Skydivers in freefall are doing 10000 to
12000 fpm.

--
Dale L. Falk

There is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing
as simply messing around with airplanes.

http://home.gci.net/~sncdfalk/flying.html

Won't happen in a free dive. This is a result of taking a breath from some
depth (as little as 4 feet down) and then not exhaling when returning to
the
surface, or staying at a certain depth for a long period of time and not
using decompression stops on the way back up :-)


Not entirely accurate, but close. Freediving rarely results in bends (aka
DCS, decompression sickness), as you a point out. The other condition (DCI,
decompression illness) includes "overexpansion injury", or poppin' a lung in
the vernacular. This also rarely affects freedivers as the volume in their
lungs decreases with depth, and expands back to near the original volume
upon ascent (unless they cheat and take a hit off a scuba tank at depth.)

Breathing compressed air at depth really loads up your tissues with
nitrogen, putting one at higher risk. But the root cause of DCS is the
nitrogen coming out of solution (your tissues) too rapidly, no matter what
the amount or where it came from. People can and do get bent (DCS)
freediving.

--Matthew

On Tue, 14 Oct 2003 22:35:15 GMT, Jay Honeck wrote:
You routinely descent at 3500 feet per minute, Ben?

My ears never bother me in normal flight, but dropping *that* fast might
cause someone some pretty severe discomfort.

Funnily enough, it's never bothered me when slower descents have.

When towing gliders for a busy glider club, I used to find some sink and
spiral down in the sink. I could get the VSI (+-6000 feet/min model) to
peg down if I did that. Never bothered me in the slightest. Nor did spins
which have a similar descent rate in the planes I've done them in.

However, slow descents make my ears pop!

--
Dylan Smith, Castletown, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net
"Maintain thine airspeed, lest the ground come up and smite thee"

On Tue, 14 Oct 2003 20:17:03 -0400, G.R. Patterson III
wrote:
Dale wrote:

I come down a little faster than you though, normally around
3000-3500fpm. G

If I try more than about 1,000 fpm, the CHTs get out of the green on the low
side pretty quick.

If you're coming down because you need to come down without letting the
CHTs get too low, you can always spiral (that's what we did when towing
gliders behind a Pawnee). The best spiral technique I found for the Pawnee
was this. The plane has quite a lot of dihedral, so I made the higher wing
almost perpendicular to the horizon and pulled, maintaining Va. 6000fpm
down was easy (particularly in sink).

The main problem was glider up, spiral down, glider up, spiral down on
a hot day got tiring very very quickly even for someone in their 20s and
in good physical condition. I made some of my worst landings in my poor
C140 after flying home after a day of glider towing.

At the club I tow for now, things aren't nearly as hectic and we also have
a winch, so I just enjoy the view and make an unhurried power descent.

--
Dylan Smith, Castletown, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net
"Maintain thine airspeed, lest the ground come up and smite thee"

On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 02:04:38 GMT, Mike Rapoport
wrote:
Well, the hill behind my house in NV is over 10,600'...

Ah, but you cheat. You have turbines and pressurization :-)

--
Dylan Smith, Castletown, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net
"Maintain thine airspeed, lest the ground come up and smite thee"