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#21
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ZZZ Rocket Racer LeagueZZZ
Gig 601Xl Builder wrote:
But these aren't gliders. Of course neither is the space shuttle. BUT. But if he expects the engine to quit mid-flight before he even gets in the plane, can it still be considered an emergency? -- Frank Stutzman Bonanza N494B "Hula Girl" Boise, ID |
#22
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ZZZ Rocket Racer LeagueZZZ
On Tue, 22 Apr 2008 08:56:59 -0700 (PDT), Harry K
wrote: On Apr 22, 5:59*am, ChuckSlusarczyk wrote: In article , Ron Wanttaja says... On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 14:10:07 -0700, John Ousterhout wrote: Better define "Race," Filbert...two planes chasing each other, like the fake Reno races at Oshkosh? *Or an actual competition where the winners aren't pre-programmed? According to Wikipedia, the race course is at 1,500 feet, following a computer-generated course. *Funny thing is, five minutes worth of clicking on the RRL site didn't lead to a description that even gave THAT much information. Until you find out what RRL's definition of a "race" is, I wouldn't place any bets. Hmmm perception and reality at work here? The zoom touch is alive and well LOL!!! Did find this picture on the RRL site, which is a real howler: http://www.rocketracingleague.com/ga...s/images/runwa... Note how the runway is just two wingspans wide, and the grandstands are RIGHT at the runway edge. *We're finally seeing the results of Campbell's input. :-) That certainly isn't FAA's idea of a "crowd line" try having an airshow with the crowd line so close to the action...NOT!! more perception and reality problems. Each race (again, according to Wikipedia) is supposed to last 90 minutes, with the planes carrying four minutes of fuel. *World record for a rocket pit stop is something like three hours. *Even if they get that down to 15 minutes (including the time to tow the plane to the fuel station and back to the runway), that's STILL a lot of gliding time. I can hear the race announcer now ." Ladies and gentleman the race is on and see that imaginary race course in the sky ? See how many of you can tell who's winning the race OOOPPPS time for a pit stop while the action switches to the pits for refueling. While they're purging the tanks and doing a pre cool now's the time to go for a dinner and visit of our sales mall.There you can enjoy a sit down meal and dancing while the kids buy overpriced rocket models and play *in the game room. After dinner and dancing return to your seats for the exciting conclusion of the ROCKET *RACING's First heat.Thrills ,chills and excitement await us as the Racers try to start their engines and OOOPPS we had a flame out ...Time to visit out inhouse theater and watch an exciting movie staring the hero of stage screen and Tv as he stars in the exciting movie the "Amazing Adventures of Capt Zoom hero of the Universe". While the refueling continues the Burbank RC Flyers will do a demonstration of pylon racing with REAL model pylon racers.Now that's racing *folks...While we're waiting for the Pylon Racers to show up .Take a visit to our ..... I can hardly wait.... Chuck S RAH-14/1 ret That is just about my opinion of this pipe dream from the day I first heard about it. It is running on what? 2 years? 3 years? now and no progress that I have heard about, no planes flying that have been reported in the news... Bottom line? Don't hold your breath folks. Harry K ************************************** Does anyone think Moller has some mony in this? Big John |
#23
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ZZZ Rocket Racer LeagueZZZ
On Tue, 22 Apr 2008 15:21:50 +0000 (UTC), Frank Stutzman
wrote: Ron Wanttaja wrote: Well, let's see: OK, Ron, I'll agree with all your points except for the very first one: 1. Each race ends with an emergency (e.g., an aircraft without of fuel). By this definition there are a powerful lot of soaring events/races that are nothing but emergencies. Oh, I'll grant you it's not technically an emergency since it's the intent to land dry. But then, these aren't sailplanes. "Landing-out" in a Schempp-Hirth is likely to be a LOT more survivable than if a RRL racer can't make the runway. The Space Shuttle deadsticks, too, but they've got very pricey simulators and the Gulfstream to practice with. Can't do a lot of touch-and-goes with four minutes of fuel.... The airplanes and pilots are all festooned with cameras, transmitting data to the ground in real-time. Everyone will have a front-row seat to the accidents. You can replace #1, if you like, with: "If the FIRST racer to land crashes on the runway, all the following ones are going to be in a world of hurt...." I expect the FAA will demand contingency plans in place (alternate runways, landing on taxiways, etc.) but odds are there'll be somebody badly positioned if the primary runway goes down. Will the fire trucks even be allowed to respond before all the racers have landed? Ron Wanttaja |
#24
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ZZZ Rocket Racer LeagueZZZ
On Apr 22, 12:30*pm, Gig 601Xl Builder
wrote: BobR wrote: Harry K wrote: Bottom line? *Don't hold your breath folks. Harry K Could we ask ZOOM to hold his breath while we wait? *BFG The problem is they seem to have bought a perfectly good kit company. http://kitplanesmag.blogspot.com/200...league-announc... Rocket Racing League Announces Schedule, Velocity Aircraft Sold Positioning itself as a "new entertainment sports league that combines the exhilaration of racing with the power of rocket engines," the Rocket Racing League announced that it will stage its first exhibition race at Oshkosh this year. The vehicles will be liquid-oxygen-fueled rockets in modified Velocity airframes. Three more exhibition races will be held at Reno (September 10-14), at the X-Prize Cup (Las Cruces, NM, date TBA), and at Aviation Nation, Nellis Air Force Base (November 8-9). No doubt to ensure an adequate supply of airframes, RRL's subsidiary, Rocket Racing Composite Corporation, has purchased Velocity Aircraft. It is expected that Velocity will continue selling and servicing the Velocity as an Experimental/Amateur-Built aircraft. According to RRL, "Under the terms of the agreement, Velocity Aircraft will become a wholly owned division of Rocket Racing Composite Corp. and will produce an airframe that will be consistent for all competing Rocket Racers. Through a rigorous research and development, all Velocity-constructed Rocket Racers will be equipped with the safest-possible airframe for any kind of aircraft. The cockpit seats for all Rocket Racers will be reinforced to withstand impacts up to 20G load and other safety measures will be added using a methodology similar to that of F-1 and Indy Car to better protect pilots and passengers alike." According to the press release, "Scott Baker, president of Velocity, Inc. offered his enthusiastic remarks that, 'Velocity is truly excited to be a part of Rocket Racing. Many of the technology advances that are planned for the Rocket Racer models transcend and offer performance and comfort benefits to Velocity owners who use their aircraft for personal and business travel.' " No word on the availability of the rocket engine for homebuilders. I notice an awful lot of "wills" in there and no "do"s. Reads just like a press release for vapor ware. It only says they will be doing 'lots of things' and not one "we have done" in relation to acturally _building_ a plane. If all they have done is what is quoted above, they aren't even gonna come close to having flyable airframes by Oshkosh. Harry K |
#25
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ZZZ Rocket Racer LeagueZZZ
Harry K wrote:
On Apr 22, 12:30 pm, Gig 601Xl Builder wrote: BobR wrote: Harry K wrote: Bottom line? Don't hold your breath folks. Harry K Could we ask ZOOM to hold his breath while we wait? BFG The problem is they seem to have bought a perfectly good kit company. http://kitplanesmag.blogspot.com/200...league-announc... Rocket Racing League Announces Schedule, Velocity Aircraft Sold Positioning itself as a "new entertainment sports league that combines the exhilaration of racing with the power of rocket engines," the Rocket Racing League announced that it will stage its first exhibition race at Oshkosh this year. The vehicles will be liquid-oxygen-fueled rockets in modified Velocity airframes. Three more exhibition races will be held at Reno (September 10-14), at the X-Prize Cup (Las Cruces, NM, date TBA), and at Aviation Nation, Nellis Air Force Base (November 8-9). No doubt to ensure an adequate supply of airframes, RRL's subsidiary, Rocket Racing Composite Corporation, has purchased Velocity Aircraft. It is expected that Velocity will continue selling and servicing the Velocity as an Experimental/Amateur-Built aircraft. According to RRL, "Under the terms of the agreement, Velocity Aircraft will become a wholly owned division of Rocket Racing Composite Corp. and will produce an airframe that will be consistent for all competing Rocket Racers. Through a rigorous research and development, all Velocity-constructed Rocket Racers will be equipped with the safest-possible airframe for any kind of aircraft. The cockpit seats for all Rocket Racers will be reinforced to withstand impacts up to 20G load and other safety measures will be added using a methodology similar to that of F-1 and Indy Car to better protect pilots and passengers alike." According to the press release, "Scott Baker, president of Velocity, Inc. offered his enthusiastic remarks that, 'Velocity is truly excited to be a part of Rocket Racing. Many of the technology advances that are planned for the Rocket Racer models transcend and offer performance and comfort benefits to Velocity owners who use their aircraft for personal and business travel.' " No word on the availability of the rocket engine for homebuilders. I notice an awful lot of "wills" in there and no "do"s. Reads just like a press release for vapor ware. It only says they will be doing 'lots of things' and not one "we have done" in relation to acturally _building_ a plane. If all they have done is what is quoted above, they aren't even gonna come close to having flyable airframes by Oshkosh. Harry K I read the book. They actually did (a demo?) race - once. Richard -- (remove the X to email) Now just why the HELL do I have to press 1 for English? John Wayne |
#26
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ZZZ Rocket Racer LeagueZZZ
Gig 601Xl Builder wrote:
Rocket Racing League Announces Schedule, Velocity Aircraft Sold And yet all the posters I've seen lately, still reflect the use of some form of EZ, Long-Eze, etc... ie. It looks quite a bit different than a Velocity... |
#27
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ZZZ Rocket Racer LeagueZZZ
On Tue, 22 Apr 2008 14:30:30 -0500, Gig 601Xl Builder
wrote: The problem is they seem to have bought a perfectly good kit company. http://kitplanesmag.blogspot.com/200...-schedule.html Rocket Racing League Announces Schedule, Velocity Aircraft Sold [....] No doubt to ensure an adequate supply of airframes, RRL's subsidiary, Rocket Racing Composite Corporation, has purchased Velocity Aircraft. It is expected that Velocity will continue selling and servicing the Velocity as an Experimental/Amateur-Built aircraft. One has to wonder why having an "adequate supply of airframes" was in doubt. Assuming RRL was already paying for all the racer development costs, it seems strange that they felt they had to buy the company itself. The only obvious answer is that Velocity had be ready to go out of business, and the only way RRL could protect its source of airframes was to buy the company. I took a look at my set of Aircraft Registration databases. Here's the change in the number of Velocities registered per year since 2001: Year Net Increase ---- -- 2001 29 2002 18 2003 22 2004 11 2005 9 2006 10 2007 7 Note that this is the *net* increase in the number of aircraft registered as Velocities...and that in most cases, this reflected a kit that had probably been purchased three or more years earlier. (Note that the actual number of completed aircraft per year is generally higher...for instance, I show 12 Velocities with new airworthiness certificates in 2007). Obviously, Velocity sales had peaked in the late '90s. Not too farfetched to think that the owners were considering shutting the line down. Contrast that to the RV juggernaut: Year Net Increase ---- -- 2001 308 2002 328 2003 373 2004 424 2005 360 2006 429 2007 445 Ron Wanttaja |
#28
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ZZZ Rocket Racer LeagueZZZ
Ron Wanttaja wrote:
Obviously, Velocity sales had peaked in the late '90s. Not too farfetched to think that the owners were considering shutting the line down. They were doing a factory "Quick Build" option, but it wasn't kneaux "2 Weeks 2 Taxi" thingie either... I like the gull wing doors so much better than the old lift the roof, by climbing in over the backend method they originally had... |
#29
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ZZZ Rocket Racer LeagueZZZ
Ron Wanttaja wrote:
On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 14:10:07 -0700, John Ousterhout wrote: But I'll issue a public apology to Jim Campbell if he ever acts as PIC in a Rocket Race. Better define "Race," Filbert...two planes chasing each other, like the fake Reno races at Oshkosh? Or an actual competition where the winners aren't pre-programmed? According to Wikipedia, the race course is at 1,500 feet, following a computer-generated course. Funny thing is, five minutes worth of clicking on the RRL site didn't lead to a description that even gave THAT much information. Until you find out what RRL's definition of a "race" is, I wouldn't place any bets. I guess I just assumed that everyone would agree with me that an exhibition is not a race. But for those in doubt, I meant a real Rocket Racing League event with multiple rockets competing. - Filbert |
#30
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ZZZ Rocket Racer LeagueZZZ
"Big John" wrote in message
... ************************************** Does anyone think Moller has some mony in this? No, but I bet he could sue for copyright infringement. |
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