CFII Before CFI

Anyone care to chime in on this one? An applicant going for the CFII
before the CFI. Am in process of doing it right now with a student.
Odd as it may seem.......
Oh Yeh, its for helicopter......

I thought a CFII was an add-on to CFI?

On Aug 17, 3:45 pm, Ol Shy & Bashful wrote:
Anyone care to chime in on this one? An applicant going for the CFII
before the CFI. Am in process of doing it right now with a student.
Odd as it may seem.......
Oh Yeh, its for helicopter......

On Aug 17, 3:50 pm, kevmor wrote:
I thought a CFII was an add-on to CFI?

In the really old days (before me), the CFI was an add-on to the CP-
ASEL rating and the CFII was free if you were a CFI and instrument
rated. Actually, I believe a lot of countries don't offer a CFII
rating and just allow all CFIs to be CFIIs.

-Robert

Ol Shy & Bashful wrote
Anyone care to chime in on this one? An applicant going for the CFII
before the CFI. Am in process of doing it right now with a student.
Oh Yeh, its for helicopter......

No such thing as CFI or CFII.....
It's all "Flight Instructor" with ratings...

(c) The following ratings are placed on a flight instructor certificate
when an applicant satisfactorily accomplishes the training and
certification requirements for the rating sought:

(1) Aircraft category ratings—

(i) Airplane.

(ii) Rotorcraft.

(iii) Glider.

(iv) Powered-lift.

(2) Airplane class ratings—

(i) Single-engine.

(ii) Multiengine.

(3) Rotorcraft class ratings—

(i) Helicopter.

(ii) Gyroplane.

(4) Instrument ratings—

(i) Instrument—Airplane.

(ii) Instrument—Helicopter.

(iii) Instrument—Powered-lift.

No reason that one cannot first become a Flight Instructor-Instrument-
Helicopter.

Bob Moore
Flight Instructor, Airplane Single Engine, Instrument Airplane

On Aug 17, 3:45 pm, Ol Shy & Bashful wrote:
Anyone care to chime in on this one? An applicant going for the CFII
before the CFI. Am in process of doing it right now with a student.
Odd as it may seem.......
Oh Yeh, its for helicopter......

Its not common but its certainly possible. The benefit is that you
break your hardest checkride (the CFI) into two parts. During the CFII
you will cover all the FOI stuff during the oral so when you go for
the CFI checkride it will be about 1/2 as hard. Otherwise you take a
really hard checkride with the initial CFI and then the CFII is an
easy add-on.
The downside is that a CFII can do very little. The rating is so
limited that its not really marketable.

-Robert, CFII

"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message
ups.com...

During the CFII you will cover all the FOI stuff during the oral so when
you go for
the CFI checkride it will be about 1/2 as hard. Otherwise you take a
really hard checkride with the initial CFI and then the CFII is an
easy add-on. The downside is that a CFII can do very little. The rating is
so
limited that its not really marketable.

Fascinating. I called about a CFI job in Hillsboro and the chief recruiter
said they prefer CFIIs because their students don't like to switch
instructors after their PPL. I thought that was a little odd, so I talked
to a friend whose a rotorcraft student out there and he described the place
as a pilot mill where the instructors were paid very little under the
expectation that they would bolt to the airlines at the first opportunity.

I'm not sure I'm interested in a "Do you want fries with that?" style flying
job, but if so, there's a case for the extra 'I'.

-c

I think there a bit of confusion there. I believe Robert is describing a
"CFII" as someone with only an Instrument-Airplane rating. They cannot teach
Private, Commercial, BFRs, checkouts, etc. Pretty much all they can do is
IFR & IPCs (someone correct me if I'm wrong).

The Hillsboro place wants CFIs who ALSO have the Instrument-Airplane.


"Gattman" wrote in message
...

"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message
ups.com...

During the CFII you will cover all the FOI stuff during the oral so when
you go for
the CFI checkride it will be about 1/2 as hard. Otherwise you take a
really hard checkride with the initial CFI and then the CFII is an
easy add-on. The downside is that a CFII can do very little. The rating
is
so
limited that its not really marketable.

Fascinating. I called about a CFI job in Hillsboro and the chief
recruiter
said they prefer CFIIs because their students don't like to switch
instructors after their PPL. I thought that was a little odd, so I talked
to a friend whose a rotorcraft student out there and he described the
place
as a pilot mill where the instructors were paid very little under the
expectation that they would bolt to the airlines at the first opportunity.

I'm not sure I'm interested in a "Do you want fries with that?" style
flying
job, but if so, there's a case for the extra 'I'.

-c

On Aug 17, 6:07 pm, "Steven Barnes" wrote:
I think there a bit of confusion there. I believe Robert is describing a
"CFII" as someone with only an Instrument-Airplane rating. They cannot teach
Private, Commercial, BFRs, checkouts, etc. Pretty much all they can do is
IFR & IPCs (someone correct me if I'm wrong).

The Hillsboro place wants CFIs who ALSO have the Instrument-Airplane.

"Gattman" wrote in message

...



"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message
oups.com...

During the CFII you will cover all the FOI stuff during the oral so when
you go for
the CFI checkride it will be about 1/2 as hard. Otherwise you take a
really hard checkride with the initial CFI and then the CFII is an
easy add-on. The downside is that a CFII can do very little. The rating
is
so
limited that its not really marketable.

Fascinating. I called about a CFI job in Hillsboro and the chief
recruiter
said they prefer CFIIs because their students don't like to switch
instructors after their PPL. I thought that was a little odd, so I talked
to a friend whose a rotorcraft student out there and he described the
place
as a pilot mill where the instructors were paid very little under the
expectation that they would bolt to the airlines at the first opportunity.

I'm not sure I'm interested in a "Do you want fries with that?" style
flying
job, but if so, there's a case for the extra 'I'.

-c

CFII's can also teach instrument procedures in a flight simulator and
have it count as time with a "qualified instructor" even thought that
instructor isn't qualified to instruct in airplanes.

On Aug 17, 5:11 pm, "Gattman" wrote:
"Robert M. Gary" wrote in oglegroups.com...

During the CFII you will cover all the FOI stuff during the oral so when
you go for
the CFI checkride it will be about 1/2 as hard. Otherwise you take a
really hard checkride with the initial CFI and then the CFII is an
easy add-on. The downside is that a CFII can do very little. The rating is
so
limited that its not really marketable.

Fascinating. I called about a CFI job in Hillsboro and the chief recruiter
said they prefer CFIIs because their students don't like to switch
instructors after their PPL.

That's because he's assuming the CFII is also a CFI (which 99% of
CFIIs are). However, if you hold a CFII and not a CFI rating then you
couldn't have had PPLs in the first place so the above wouldn't apply.
You would be very hard pressed to find a job as a CFII without being a
CFI-ASEL/AMEL/ or something as well.

-Robert, CFII (and CFI)

I've read that some part 141 schools will do the CFII before the CFI due to
lower time and PTS requirements for the CFII.
Jim

"Ol Shy & Bashful" wrote in message
oups.com...
Anyone care to chime in on this one? An applicant going for the CFII
before the CFI. Am in process of doing it right now with a student.
Odd as it may seem.......
Oh Yeh, its for helicopter......