Officials say al-Qaida operatives may be fully trained airline pilots

On Tue, 23 Dec 2003 21:26:09 -0800, "G.R. Patterson III"
wrote:

Rich Raine wrote:

I just don't think that will happen.

You haven't known any fundamentalist plug in your favorite religion here. I have.
They'll do that in a heartbeat.

The only recent "fundamentalist" movements I can think of (and I'm
thinking of the past several hundred to thousand years) that has shown
it is capable of mass murder/suicide have been certain strains of
radical Islam.

The last suicidally religious group I can think of would have been the
2nd Century Martyrs of early Christianity, and even they didn't take
innocents with them to death. Everyone else I can think of fielded
people who were willing to be killed for their faith, but only after
putting up a vigorous fight.

So I don't agree fundamentalists from plug in your favorite religion
will "do that in a heartbeat." Can you prove me wrong?

Rob

I wonder who will be the first to suggest eliminating pilots all
together for airlines. It has already been suggested for fighters.
Or maybe the remote control suggestion will pop up again.
Brings new questions to guns in the cockpit now.

My opinion. Whatever these religious wack jobs can cook up, we can
overcome. Maybe special ports of entry and procedures for airliners
from certain countries, or foreign airlines must have approved pilots
on their flights into the US if the threat is deemed realistic.
These chumps days are numbered, and they know it.

On 24 Dec 2003 02:49:14 GMT, (Teacherjh)
wrote:


I can't believe someone would train to get licensed, get a job on the
majors, have a great income, and style of life, and then would throw it all
away to make some guy living in a cave happy by participating in a suicide
attack. I just don't think that will happen.


That's not the way it happens.

The way it happens is that some guy decides to make sombody living in a cave
(or dying on a cross) happy. They then train for the mission, put up with a
"great lifestyle", and finally give their life to God.

I'm sure it's in progress.

Jose

Rich Raine wrote:

I just don't think that will happen.

You haven't known any fundamentalist plug in your favorite religion here. I have.
They'll do that in a heartbeat.

George Patterson
Great discoveries are not announced with "Eureka!". What's usually said is
"Hummmmm... That's interesting...."

in article , Rob Perkins at
wrote on 12/23/03 7:08 PM:

On Tue, 23 Dec 2003 21:26:09 -0800, "G.R. Patterson III"
wrote:

Rich Raine wrote:

I just don't think that will happen.

You haven't known any fundamentalist plug in your favorite religion here. I
have.
They'll do that in a heartbeat.

The only recent "fundamentalist" movements I can think of (and I'm
thinking of the past several hundred to thousand years) that has shown
it is capable of mass murder/suicide have been certain strains of
radical Islam.

Jonestown?

The question is whether the pax would ever be aware of the impending
disaster. Looking out the window, gee, we seem to be a little low....
Not likely the guy is gonna make an announcement and have the folks
in back alert the media - and the USAF...

Background checks on foreign pilots, anyone? BTW - I highly recommend
Lou Martin's book "Wings Over Persia" - google the title. It's a
memoir of his years flying for the Shah of Iran just before the
Revolution. Interesting insights into Middle Eastern (though not
Arab) mind and culture.


(Ross Oliver) wrote in message ...
On Mon, 22 Dec 2003 21:16:56 -0800, Mutts wrote:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/ID/3775771/

Authorities raised the terrorist threat assessment over the weekend
after new intelligence indicated that operatives of Osama bin Laden?s
al-Qaida terror network, possibly trained and licensed to fly
passenger jets, may now be pilots for some foreign airlines, ideally
positioning them to carry out suicide attacks, U.S. officials told NBC
News on Monday.


This was my favorite quote, from CNN:

"Ironically, reinforced cockpit doors now installed on many airliners
would serve to protect a pilot-terrorist from passenger intervention."

(Teacherjh) wrote in message ...

The way it happens is that some guy decides to make sombody living in a cave
(or dying on a cross) happy.

That was a Cheap Shot (caps intentional). Name the last suicide
terrorist - one who deliberately kills large numbers of innocents
along with himself - who was motivated by any variety of
even-close-to-mainstream Christianity. Jim Jones and David Koresh
don't count - their followers numbered in the dozens-to-hundreds, not
the hundreds-of-thousands-to-millions that support radical Islam.
Christianity still produces martyrs - check what's going on in China
and Sudan - but those folks are being *killed by* non-Christians.


They then train for the mission, put up with a
"great lifestyle", and finally give their life to God.

True enough. The 9/11 killers lived in the US for several years,
living (but presumably not enjoying) a nearly-typical suburban
lifestyle.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...d=519&ncid=716

Focusing on cargo planes, they say. Force us to implement security
measures (screen all cargo?) that could bring next-day-air to a
screeching halt. Do FedEx and UPS use foreign-national pilots? Do
foreign-flag cargo operations operate in the US? Hmmm...


"When they are in fact out to get you, paranoia is a healthy state of
mind."


Mutts wrote in message . ..
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/ID/3775771/

Authorities raised the terrorist threat assessment over the weekend
after new intelligence indicated that operatives of Osama bin Laden?s
al-Qaida terror network, possibly trained and licensed to fly
passenger jets, may now be pilots for some foreign airlines, ideally
positioning them to carry out suicide attacks, U.S. officials told NBC
News on Monday.

As long as we are talking about what they COULD be, we should be glad that
they are not Jedi Knights.

Mike
MU-2


"Mutts" wrote in message
...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/ID/3775771/

Authorities raised the terrorist threat assessment over the weekend
after new intelligence indicated that operatives of Osama bin Laden's
al-Qaida terror network, possibly trained and licensed to fly
passenger jets, may now be pilots for some foreign airlines, ideally
positioning them to carry out suicide attacks, U.S. officials told NBC
News on Monday.

"Ross Oliver" wrote in message ...


"Ironically, reinforced cockpit doors now installed on many airliners
would serve to protect a pilot-terrorist from passenger intervention."

Obviously time to implement Archie Bunker's anti-hijacking scheme.
Give out guns to all the passengers. With that many people packing
nobody would try anything.

Martin Hotze wrote:

Heck .. what a stupid idea using a plane for terrorism ... there are so
many other more or less subtile methods of making the people freaking out
...

I'm not sure. Using aircraft is an attack on air-based commerce. The world
needs this.

But take it further. Perhaps after they shut down air-based commerce,
they'll go after sea-based commerce. Bury a nuke in the cargo of some
ship, and it'll never be found until the harbor lights up. But subsequent
to this, all cargo must be screened. Unless the TSA is willing to do a
major turn-around on what they'll pay for screeners (note that they're
reducing staffing size for airport screeners), this will drag sea-based
commerce to an effective halt.

Perhaps the plan is to attack international commerce.

- Andrew