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Fatal Towplane Accident 5-9-20



 
 
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  #21  
Old May 11th 20, 05:35 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Getyourhandsoffthatthingontow
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Default Fatal Towplane Accident 5-9-20

"In 33 years of flying sailplanes I was given the rope once. The tow pilot was new and only had 3 tow's prior. It was a WAVE day and it was bumpy on tow. He gave me the rope at 400 ft. I was directly behind the tow plane when it happen. The tow pilot had never flew in wave conditions before. I was unhappy because it was a glider ride I was performing. BTW, that was the last day that tow pilot towed.
Regards,"
xxx tow pilot
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  #22  
Old May 11th 20, 05:48 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
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Default Fatal Towplane Accident 5-9-20

I’ve been towing for 35 years and have had kitting incidents, all with the schweizer hitch, and mostly pawnee’s. You can believe I am paying serious attention the first 500 ft of every tow!
I only had one instance of s schweizer hitch not releasing immediately. A 2-33 kitted severely and I yanked that release almost immediately. I rolled hard left then yanked again and she released. I got the load pulling more sideways than upwards. Thankfully I had the altitude to make that radical move with my nose pointing 60degrees downward.
There are alot of idiot glider flyers out there. This incident was caused by a 800 hour flier who dropped his phone and tried to retreave it when we were about 500 ft agl.
Dan
  #23  
Old May 11th 20, 07:28 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
john firth
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Default Fatal Towplane Accident 5-9-20

On Sunday, May 10, 2020 at 10:57:01 AM UTC-4, Paul Agnew wrote:
Very sad to read this tragic news this morning.

http://www.kathrynsreport.com/2020/0...fatal.html?m=1

Comments (anonymous) on the webpage indicate kiting may have been a significant factor.

Sincere condolences to the family of the tow pilot and to the members of the club.

Paul Agnew
Jupiter, FL


It might be interesting to get the statistics from Oz where low tow
is standard. ( anywhere else with low tow)
John F
  #24  
Old May 11th 20, 07:29 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Jonathan St. Cloud
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Default Fatal Towplane Accident 5-9-20

On Monday, May 11, 2020 at 5:59:13 AM UTC-7, Karl Striedieck wrote:
There are a few things that will make the Schweizer release a safer mechanism.

1 Inverting the release will eliminate all friction in the actuation.

2 Tow plane's release lever should be instantly accessible and have a high leverage configuration.

3 A careful dressing of the movable part of the release so that it is slightly curved where the capture slides off. This eliminates the increased force that the sliding capture generates as it starts sliding aft.

4 Tow pilots should include in their daily checklist a what if regarding rapidly getting rid of a kiting glider: where's the handle and which way does it go.


In Helicopters, the longline has two release mechanisms. An electronic one on the cyclic (stick) which can be push with thumb, and a manual one on the stick (brake type of handle). You are already holding the stick and the load is dumped fast, just a thought
  #25  
Old May 11th 20, 08:52 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Sci Fi
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Default Fatal Towplane Accident 5-9-20

If you have ever tried to move your arms when undergoing a high G
manoeuvre, you will realise the difficulty of grabbing hold of anything.

As the rope angle will not change much, having the release mechanism auto
release is also not so probable. Maybe some electronic Angle of Attack
device is needed that would detect any upset, and chop the rope instantly.
  #26  
Old May 11th 20, 09:06 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
John Foster
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Default Fatal Towplane Accident 5-9-20

On Monday, May 11, 2020 at 2:00:06 PM UTC-6, Sci Fi wrote:
If you have ever tried to move your arms when undergoing a high G
manoeuvre, you will realise the difficulty of grabbing hold of anything.

As the rope angle will not change much, having the release mechanism auto
release is also not so probable. Maybe some electronic Angle of Attack
device is needed that would detect any upset, and chop the rope instantly.


Not a bad idea, but I'd link it to the artificial horizon instead of the AOA. But I'm not an aeronautical engineer, so what do I know?
  #27  
Old May 11th 20, 09:59 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
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Default Fatal Towplane Accident 5-9-20

On Monday, May 11, 2020 at 2:28:15 PM UTC-4, john firth wrote:
On Sunday, May 10, 2020 at 10:57:01 AM UTC-4, Paul Agnew wrote:
Very sad to read this tragic news this morning.

http://www.kathrynsreport.com/2020/0...fatal.html?m=1

Comments (anonymous) on the webpage indicate kiting may have been a significant factor.

Sincere condolences to the family of the tow pilot and to the members of the club.

Paul Agnew
Jupiter, FL


It might be interesting to get the statistics from Oz where low tow
is standard. ( anywhere else with low tow)
John F


Valley Soaring Club in NY uses low tow.
About 70,000 towns by club and preceding commercial operation with no upsets.
That said, it could happen tomorrow.
I do believe upset is less likely in low tow however.
UH
  #28  
Old May 11th 20, 10:08 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Nick Kennedy[_3_]
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Default Fatal Towplane Accident 5-9-20

Couple of observations from the cheap seats.

1. This has been a ongoing problem with NO solution since the first aerotow ever.
I wonder when the first tug upset fatality took place, in the '20's?

2. These accidents are [ I think ] 100% on the glider pilot.
We glider pilots have to do a better job while on tow period. No matter what happens if you get out of line, your first move has to be to release. Forget the canopy, snake, bee, your phone, electrical fire, anything really, etc etc.

3. From the pictures it appears to me the towplane impacted the runway, but I'm not sure, but it looks like it to me. If so, the tug was probably still very low and and any type of release isn't going to save the day. It probably happened in a very few seconds.

Damn *this sucks,* BAD.

Its So unfair to the tug pilot, and his family.
I'm into this gliding stuff for fun and this IS NOT fun.
We as a group HAVE to do better than this.
Nick
T


  #29  
Old May 11th 20, 10:32 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Nick Kennedy[_3_]
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Default Fatal Towplane Accident 5-9-20

I've flown Low Tow on both ends of the rope in Australia
It works up high. Its kinda weird for the glider pilot. Its a very different sight picture.
But, when the tug is 50' in the air, during the initial T.O. it doesn't stop a kite like what happened in Byron Ca.
That kite accident is pure glider pilot error.
Even if the elevator is unconnected, it's still glider pilot error.
You've got to release *immediately* when things go out of parameters.
Don't try and save it especially when low say below 1000' IMHO
Nick
T

  #30  
Old May 11th 20, 11:45 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot)
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Default Fatal Towplane Accident 5-9-20

Ummmm.......later post mirrors my post here......
Our club does low tow predominantly.....but we teach both (I am an ex CFIG....didn't do a renewal years ago because of work travel)...,
Dufis on the glider end can muck up any tow..... went to a funeral of a friend due to a squirrel we ran off. Kiting issue....

I have "quite a few aerotows" over decades.....worst were low power tug with a water laden 15M ship.....
Beyond that....you're current, discussion with tug pilot, discussion with locals...may be "sporty" but doable....
Issue is peeps that don't do low tow, tend to do,"stupid low tow".....lack of conversation....that whole wind gradient thingy...
Look in most gliding books.....low tow is recommended for cross country....
Our group is maybe 1 of 2 or 3 in the US of A that do low tow normally.....

Sucks for the loss...condolences for all involved...bad day in general....
 




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