Why did Bush join the national guard?

From: (ArtKramr)
Date: 9/8/2004 1:39 PM Central Daylight Time
Message-id:

Subject: Why did Bush join the national guard?
From: (B2431)
Date: 9/8/2004 8:15 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

No I wasn't there, but you yourself have said that would be the case.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired


That says it all.


Arthur Kramer

Nice selective editing, art.

Would you be so kind as to take your ill mannered tantrums elsewhere?

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

From: (ArtKramr)
Date: 9/8/2004 1:43 PM Central Daylight Time
Message-id:

Subject: Why did Bush join the national guard?
From: "Kevin Brooks"
Date: 9/8/2004 5:24 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:


"ArtKramr" wrote in message
...
Subject: Why did Bush join the national guard?
From: Ian MacLure
Date: 9/7/2004 9:36 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

(ArtKramr) wrote in
:

Subject: Why did Bush join the national guard?
From: (B2431)
Date: 9/7/2004 1:52 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

I'll bet he saw more combat than you did and he flew C-54s.


A C-54 is not a combat aircraft. Seeing "action" implies that you have
done harm to the enemy. You can't do harm to the enemy in an unarmed

So being fired on multiple times doesn't count.
Taxiing in wearing substantial portions of your
deceased copilot and good friend doesn't count.
Having a second copilot killed during landing doesn't count.
Flying onto disputed airfields doesn't count?
Losing 20 ft of fuselage to an artillery round and flying whats
left of the airplane to Guam doesn't count?
So I guess whatever it was he was delivering under fire could not
have been that important.
Well, I'm glad you cleared that up.

I have a friend who was a C-47 driver on D-Day, dropped paras.
I guess what he did doesn't count.

A gentleman I sat next to in our town band went ashore with the
first wave on D-Day but he was only a doctor so I guess he doesn't
count.

airliner. Flying combat airccraft is one thing, Flying airliners is
something else.

Does the word tactical transport mean anything to you?
Do you know what day it is even?

IBM



There is the tip of the spear. Then there is everything else. The very
best are
at the tip of the spear. Where were you?

Then you must not have been at the "tip of the spear", being as you have
repeatedly proven to be anything but "the very best" (how can a pilot
washout call himself the "very best"?).

Brooks



Arthur Kramer



You weren't even good enough to make it to combat at all. How pathetic you
are
little boy hiding under a desk while a war raged and men fought.


Arthur Kramer


Eddie Slovik, George Lincol Rockwell, Tim McVeigh, Bennedict Arnold etc were
"good enough to make it to combat." Gee, how selective can one get?

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

ArtKramr wrote:

Subject: Why did Bush join the national guard?
From: "Steven P. McNicoll"
Date: 9/8/2004 4:59 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: .net


"ArtKramr" wrote in message
...

Do you know why they have pilots on bombers? Just for one reason
which was to put a bombardier over a target for 30 seconds.


Every bomber required at least one pilot, but not every bomber required a
bombardier.



The pilot is only a bus driver to deliver him where he can hurt the enemy.
So don't make too big a deal of pilots . Some are good and some are
not..If you get one who can fly a good bomb run, not dump your gyro
and keep the wings level so you don't dump bombs all over the landscape,
you are lucky.But good bomb run pilots are not all that easy to find. And
as far as judging pilots performance on a bomb run, no one is more
qualified to make that judgement than a bombardier. But this is a subject
you would know nothing about.


Sounds like you're bitter over washing out of pilot training and being made
a bombardier.



Never was in pilot traning.Sounds like you are bitter for not fighting for your
country. But you cant blame me for that. You have only yourself to blame.

Art, in WWII, if a drunken pilot got to snorting too much coke, could
him mom get get a transfer to Alabama where he wouldn't seem so unusual?
Or did that start in the early 1970s?

Cheers

--mike




Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

Subject: Why did Bush join the national guard?
From: Mike Dargan
Date: 9/8/2004 7:11 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: FZO%c.60619$3l3.48557@attbi_s03

ArtKramr wrote:

Subject: Why did Bush join the national guard?
From: "Steven P. McNicoll"
Date: 9/8/2004 4:59 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: .net


"ArtKramr" wrote in message
...

Do you know why they have pilots on bombers? Just for one reason
which was to put a bombardier over a target for 30 seconds.


Every bomber required at least one pilot, but not every bomber required a
bombardier.



The pilot is only a bus driver to deliver him where he can hurt the enemy.
So don't make too big a deal of pilots . Some are good and some are
not..If you get one who can fly a good bomb run, not dump your gyro
and keep the wings level so you don't dump bombs all over the landscape,
you are lucky.But good bomb run pilots are not all that easy to find. And
as far as judging pilots performance on a bomb run, no one is more
qualified to make that judgement than a bombardier. But this is a subject
you would know nothing about.


Sounds like you're bitter over washing out of pilot training and being made

a bombardier.



Never was in pilot traning.Sounds like you are bitter for not fighting for
your
country. But you cant blame me for that. You have only yourself to blame.

Art, in WWII, if a drunken pilot got to snorting too much coke, could
him mom get get a transfer to Alabama where he wouldn't seem so unusual?
Or did that start in the early 1970s?

Cheers

--mike




Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer



I think what you would get is 20 years in federal prison.


Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

"Mike Dargan" wrote

Art, in WWII, if a drunken pilot got to snorting too much coke, could him mom get get a
transfer to Alabama where he wouldn't seem so unusual? Or did that start in the early
1970s?

Cheers

--mike

Mike, can you tell us if you stopped beating your wife?

ArtKramr wrote:

Subject: Why did Bush join the national guard?
From: "Steven P. McNicoll"
Date: 9/8/2004 4:59 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: .net


"ArtKramr" wrote in message
...

Do you know why they have pilots on bombers? Just for one reason
which was to put a bombardier over a target for 30 seconds.


Every bomber required at least one pilot, but not every bomber required a
bombardier.



The pilot is only a bus driver to deliver him where he can hurt the enemy.
So don't make too big a deal of pilots . Some are good and some are
not..If you get one who can fly a good bomb run, not dump your gyro
and keep the wings level so you don't dump bombs all over the landscape,
you are lucky.But good bomb run pilots are not all that easy to find. And
as far as judging pilots performance on a bomb run, no one is more
qualified to make that judgement than a bombardier. But this is a subject
you would know nothing about.


Sounds like you're bitter over washing out of pilot training and being made
a bombardier.



Never was in pilot traning.Sounds like you are bitter for not fighting for your
country. But you cant blame me for that. You have only yourself to blame.

Art, in WWII, if a drunken pilot got to snorting too much coke, could
him mom get him a transfer to Alabama where he wouldn't seem so unusual?
Or did that start in the early 1970s?

Cheers

--mike




Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

(ArtKramr) wrote in
:

[snip]

You weren't even good enough to make it to combat at all. How
pathetic you are little boy hiding under a desk while a war raged and
men fought.

Course it could be no one was foolish enough to try anything on
his watch or mine. Its not like we could go around randomly
attacking every Tom, Dhijk, and Abdool now is it?

IBM

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....
He's certainly overqualified to be a bombardier judging by
your sorry ass.

IBM


Probably not fair to lump all bombardiers in with the sorry example we have
to contend with on this news group.

Jack G.

(B2431) wrote in
:

[snip]

Eddie Slovik, George Lincol Rockwell, Tim McVeigh, Bennedict Arnold
etc were "good enough to make it to combat." Gee, how selective can
one get?

Yup and ole Timmy McV got hisself a Bronze Star just like somebody
else we could mention. Only difference is, that young Tim appears
to actually have merited his award and got to keep it.

IBM

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In article iCR%c.7474$Va5.2248@trnddc01, Jack G
wrote:

...
He's certainly overqualified to be a bombardier judging by
your sorry ass.

IBM


Probably not fair to lump all bombardiers in with the sorry example we have
to contend with on this news group.

Well, Artie may have been a fine bombardier 58 years ago but I'm afraid
the brain has turned to fat at this late date.

And, yes, I am unworthy. I am a coward and never went into battle. I
hang my head.

raoul

Jack G.