Round out and flare with fully open spoilers in a PW-6? Other gliders?

"Flair" is either a natural aptitude for something or a synonym for
panache.

Flare is rounding out the end of something, think flared trousers or flared
tubing. In our case it refers to the transition from a (relatively) steep
approach path to a brief period of flight parallel to the landing surface.
Whether you land on the mainwheel or both wheels together is irrelevant, &
purely a matter of choice.

One reason for landing on both wheels is that it's virtually impossible to
bounce back into the air again.

Really good point. Thank you for pointing this out to me.

On Wednesday, March 28, 2018 at 1:45:05 PM UTC-4, b4soaring wrote:

Flare is rounding out the end of something, think flared trousers or flared
tubing. In our case it refers to the transition from a (relatively) steep
approach path to a brief period of flight parallel to the landing surface..

That sounds about right. In Vermont, at least at Sugarbush, I'm pretty sure that the 'flare' refers to the last stage of the 'roundout'. The flare is part of the roundout?

Kinda like the cuff of a pair of 'flared bell bottoms' (this will make sense to the RAS demographic

During a steep 'full airbrake' descent. I start to roundout slowly at about 30-50 feet AGL, then seamlessly and gradually transition to the flare.

Post-flare and after entering level flight just above the runway, the stick comes back gradually, and the nose goes up, as the speed bleeds off. If I'm simultaneously opening the airbrakes to increase drag in ground effect, the stick comes back faster and in harmony with the increase in drag. I don't have a label for that stage.

I always thought that the 'run out' begins after the wheels touch pavement and wheel braking becomes an option, but it might be more correct to say that the 'run out' starts when the glider enters level flight just above the runway, because the pilot has the option to put the wheels down at that point and do a 'wheel landing'.

If I have opened another can of worms, maybe it will help pass the time until that first flight of the season.

On Monday, March 26, 2018 at 7:47:36 PM UTC-4, son_of_flubber wrote:
The PW-6 has very effective spoilers, and some other gliders have even more effective spoilers. Assuming C.G. is within limits and runway is level, is it possible to round out and flare with the spoilers fully open? Does one need extra airspeed? How much extra? (Yep. I know it is advisable to reduce spoilers before entering roundout.)

How do you teach steep descent to students? How steep? How fast?

I saw this question come up in a discussion of a fatal accident in a SZD 51-1 Junior. Student pilot opened 'full spoilers' and failed to flare.

Is a 'full spoiler flare' required to obtain glider certification in EASA?

And finally, does the PW-6 have spoilers or airbrakes?

Define Flair, "Arriving in style", just like Rick Flair! WOW

Yeah, sorry for the spelling police ;^)

Flare vs Flair
Brake vs Break
(etc.)

The nuns beat it into me a long time ago - spelling is improtent!

66

I see what you did there.....hopefully "tongue in cheek"..........

As I stated before, it is GOOD to push the envelope at the home field on a normal day......never know when you need to really push it in a real situation.
In my previous post here, full flaps was hard on the flap seals, so I didn't do it many times since I was part of the, "fix the seals" crew. If you needed it, use it, otherwise, practice was fine unless you wanted to fix the seals.....

On Friday, March 30, 2018 at 10:05:18 AM UTC-7, kirk.stant wrote:
Yeah, sorry for the spelling police ;^)

Flare vs Flair
Brake vs Break
(etc.)

The nuns beat it into me a long time ago - spelling is improtent!

66

The nuns beat it into me too but I am old and my brane (see what I did there?) has shrunk to the size of a walnut.

The nuns beat it into me a long time ago - spelling is improtent!

Dyslexics Untie!

Hmmm.... I thought it was, "Bad spellers untie".

For yours it should be, "etinu"

On Friday, March 30, 2018 at 3:30:05 PM UTC-4, Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:
it is GOOD to push the envelope at the home field on a normal day

Yup, medical attention will be there quicker,
and there's more help to stuff the pieces back in the trailer...

OK, I chewed on this for a day.
My normal, "sanity checks before I reply" were not available.

My original comment was towards, "pushing the POH limits".
Nothing more, nothing less.

If you misread my post, fine. Do you change your reply?

If not........do you propose peeps, "landing wherever on the local field, have others push it back" and then "hope" they don't break stuff when under stress and landing off field?

I am good for training for the worst, hoping you don't need it.
Your reply (maybe out of context?.......giving you an out here dude.......) is just do whatever, good luck when your butt is pinched up.
Yes, I have misread a landing site, dealt with it, didn't break anything.

I wanted to argue about some electrical stuff, but let it lay.
I am not backing off this, unless, you misread my "intention" in this thread.

Ball in your court.

Popcorn........

[waiting for the calls or emails saying I should let this die.......]......,