MXSMANIC - The posts don't add up

Wolfgang Schwanke wrote:
Mxsmanic wrote in
:

Owen writes:

$100 in France?
Multiply everything by three for France.

A C150 or C152 can be rented starting at ca 90 EUR/h here in Germany,
about 140 EUR/h with instructor. France should be the same. Of course
you don't have to do 60 mins.

140 an hour dual really isn't *that* much higher than in the US.

Kev writes:

It depends on what you're trying to understand. As much as I defend
your asking naive questions about flight, it's also perfectly clear to
everyone here that 30 minutes in a real airplane would utterly change
your (mis)conceptions of flying (that you've gained over hundreds of
sim hours).

I've been told this many times about many things over my lifetime, and
with only one or two exceptions, I've been told wrong. Perhaps such
experiences do dramatically change the viewpoints of many people, but
not me. My guess is that most people underestimate what I understand
in the absence of experiences similar to their own; they project.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

Mxsmanic wrote:
Kev writes:
It depends on what you're trying to understand. As much as I defend
your asking naive questions about flight, it's also perfectly clear to
everyone here that 30 minutes in a real airplane would utterly change
your (mis)conceptions of flying (that you've gained over hundreds of
sim hours).

I've been told this many times about many things over my lifetime, and
with only one or two exceptions, I've been told wrong. Perhaps such
experiences do dramatically change the viewpoints of many people, but
not me.

I guarantee that your view would change in this case. You see, almost
everyone who first flew, had misconceptions similar to yours. Use of
yoke, rudder, throttle, instruments, how to taxi, use the radio, heck
almost everything. A single ride can change a lot of that to one big
"aha!" of awakening. Especially the trim part. You'll see how
unrealistic a sim experience is in that respect.

My guess is that most people underestimate what I understand
in the absence of experiences similar to their own; they project.

Perhaps, but see above. What you're missing is that many others had a
similar experience.

While I think that you are very observant, your questions and
statements do make it abundantly clear that you overestimate what you
understand on this topic. You're basically at the point of someone who
knows how to ride a bicycle, and thinking that the experience is
equivalent to driving a car.

Kev

Kev wrote:
Mxsmanic wrote:
Kev writes:
It depends on what you're trying to understand. As much as I defend
your asking naive questions about flight, it's also perfectly clear to
everyone here that 30 minutes in a real airplane would utterly change
your (mis)conceptions of flying (that you've gained over hundreds of
sim hours).
I've been told this many times about many things over my lifetime, and
with only one or two exceptions, I've been told wrong. Perhaps such
experiences do dramatically change the viewpoints of many people, but
not me.

I guarantee that your view would change in this case. You see, almost
everyone who first flew, had misconceptions similar to yours. Use of
yoke, rudder, throttle, instruments, how to taxi, use the radio, heck
almost everything. A single ride can change a lot of that to one big
"aha!" of awakening.

I second that.

On 10/17/06 9:03 PM, in article ,
"Mxsmanic" wrote:

Kev writes:

It depends on what you're trying to understand. As much as I defend
your asking naive questions about flight, it's also perfectly clear to
everyone here that 30 minutes in a real airplane would utterly change
your (mis)conceptions of flying (that you've gained over hundreds of
sim hours).

I've been told this many times about many things over my lifetime, and
with only one or two exceptions, I've been told wrong. Perhaps such
experiences do dramatically change the viewpoints of many people, but
not me. My guess is that most people underestimate what I understand
in the absence of experiences similar to their own; they project.

Nearly everyone here has had experience with flight simulators (hundreds, if
not thousands of hours in my case) before they went on to climb into a real
cockpit.
--
Jeff 'The Wizard of Draws' Bucchino

Cartoons with a Touch of Magic�
http://www.wizardofdraws.com

More Cartoons with a Touch of Magic�
http://www.cartoonclipart.com

Wizard of Draws wrote:
On 10/17/06 9:03 PM, in article ,
"Mxsmanic" wrote:

Kev writes:

It depends on what you're trying to understand. As much as I defend
your asking naive questions about flight, it's also perfectly clear to
everyone here that 30 minutes in a real airplane would utterly change
your (mis)conceptions of flying (that you've gained over hundreds of
sim hours).
I've been told this many times about many things over my lifetime, and
with only one or two exceptions, I've been told wrong. Perhaps such
experiences do dramatically change the viewpoints of many people, but
not me. My guess is that most people underestimate what I understand
in the absence of experiences similar to their own; they project.

Nearly everyone here has had experience with flight simulators (hundreds, if
not thousands of hours in my case) before they went on to climb into a real
cockpit.

I never did. Then again, I've never been into computer games...not a
slam, just a statement. I did try both MSFS and the school's FTD when
i was working on my instrument, and kept crashing. Until then, my
instructor didn't know that the FTD had an ELT go off if it crashed.
g We decided that spending the money on the actual airplane was a
better use of time and money.

FWIW, I barely passed the sim section of driver's ed, too.

In article C15B0F89.9F11C%jeffbDELETEME@DELETEMETOOwizardofd raws.com,
Wizard of Draws wrote:

Nearly everyone here has had experience with flight simulators (hundreds, if
not thousands of hours in my case) before they went on to climb into a real
cockpit.

ahem... older pilots tend not to have sim experience of any value prior to
getting into a real cockpit. For example, I did my primary training in 1987.
MSFS was a horrible toy at that time. And my first flight was in 1973, when
a friend of my father got me hooked on flying with a xc in an arrow. Not
many sims available in 1973.

--
Bob Noel
Looking for a sig the
lawyers will hate

"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
...
Dave Stadt writes:

You would never understand.

There's nothing to understand. Thirty minutes is not worth hundreds
of hours of simulation in most contexts, unless, for example, one
wishes to die at the end of a spin, instead of surviving.

A half hour of real flight is worth eons of sitting behind a game.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

Emily wrote in news:9qWdnZhYJo4-
:

Wolfgang Schwanke wrote:
Mxsmanic wrote in
:

Owen writes:

$100 in France?
Multiply everything by three for France.

A C150 or C152 can be rented starting at ca 90 EUR/h here in Germany,
about 140 EUR/h with instructor. France should be the same. Of course
you don't have to do 60 mins.

140 an hour dual really isn't *that* much higher than in the US.

At 4:33 AM EDT, the excange rate quoted was 1 USD = 0.7974 Euro. That
makes 140 Euro = $175.57.

--
Marty Shapiro
Silicon Rallye Inc.

(remove SPAMNOT to email me)

Marty Shapiro wrote:
Emily wrote in news:9qWdnZhYJo4-
:

Wolfgang Schwanke wrote:
Mxsmanic wrote in
:

Owen writes:

$100 in France?
Multiply everything by three for France.
A C150 or C152 can be rented starting at ca 90 EUR/h here in Germany,
about 140 EUR/h with instructor. France should be the same. Of course
you don't have to do 60 mins.
140 an hour dual really isn't *that* much higher than in the US.

At 4:33 AM EDT, the excange rate quoted was 1 USD = 0.7974 Euro. That
makes 140 Euro = $175.57.

Right...not that much higher. The way people talk, I was expecting well
over $200...kind of like renting a helicopter in the US.