KitPlanes - Home Page by Ron Wanttaja

Scott wrote in message ...
Nah, you don't want to use composer. Real Men and Women write in HTML!



Been there, Doing that for 5 years now...

Scott

Scott is that HTML 4? Did 4 ever catch on? I was trying to learn it
(just for grins) before various women started distracting me from that
and flying. ;-)

pac

On Sun, 10 Aug 2003 11:53:14 GMT, bonomi@c-ns. (Robert Bonomi) wrote:

In article ,
Barnyard BOb -- wrote:

....... or vigins.

I'm still trying to decide on a good definition to fit that v-word

Small gray birds that haven't met BOb yet? :-)

Ron Wanttaja

On Sun, 10 Aug 2003 11:41:26 +0000, Scott wrote:

Ha! REAL REAL Men write in Machine Language! We don't need no stinkin'
mnemonics!!

C9 22 FF E0 10 1C ...

HA! I resemble that remark. I took a class in machine language about
twenty years ago (on the 8080, I think) and soon after bought a VIC-20.
Tried to write a flight simulator in straight BASIC, but it ran too slow.
So I bought the "Programmer's Guide to the VIC-20" and taught myself the
6502 machine language.

My 8080 course had given me forms to hand-write my program (one column for
the address in hex, one column for the mnemonic, another column for the
command in hex, and a wide column for the description), and I wrote a BASIC
program that would translate an input hex value into decimal and "poke" it
into the next memory location.

Biggest problem I had was with adding patches to fix stuff. If I didn't
include a lot of NOPs (No operations, null areas), I'd have to reassign all
the memory locations and re-type the whole durned program.

I ended up selling the program to a Silicon Valley software company. But
it wasn't until they wanted a Commodore 64 version of the program that they
discovered I was programming in straight machine code. They wanted a copy
of the "assembler code", so I sent them Xerox copies of my handwritten
sheets. They were absolutely aghast.

I got a gen-u-wine assembler program from them....

Ron Wanttaja

In article , Roger Halstead
writes:


Assembly? You give up on Machine code?

Roger Halstead (K8RI EN73 & ARRL Life Member)
www.rogerhalstead.com
N833R World's oldest Debonair? (S# CD-2)



I did machine code in the eary years then moved on to assembly. I don't miss
either.


Bob Reed
www.kisbuild.r-a-reed-assoc.com (KIS Builders Site)
KIS Cruiser in progress...Slow but steady progress....

"Ladies and Gentlemen, take my advice,
pull down your pants and Slide on the Ice!"
(M.A.S.H. Sidney Freedman)

In article , Roger Halstead
writes:


After using Netscape composer, MS Word, and MS Front Page I try to do
almost all of my HTML by hand coding.

I sometimes use Front Page, but only after creating the page first.
Never create one in Front Page. It creates huge files of bloat code
and adds about 3 to 5 pages of definitions at the beginning.

I only used composer a couple of times and it took several days to get
the page back to normal, but FP is bad and saving in HTML from a Word
doc is worse.

Roger Halstead (K8RI EN73 & ARRL Life Member)
www.rogerhalstead.com
N833R World's oldest Debonair? (S# CD-2)



If you would rather spend your time on content instead of HTML then try the
AOLPRESS product. It is free and very easy to use. Not fancy by any means but
works.


Bob Reed
www.kisbuild.r-a-reed-assoc.com (KIS Builders Site)
KIS Cruiser in progress...Slow but steady progress....

"Ladies and Gentlemen, take my advice,
pull down your pants and Slide on the Ice!"
(M.A.S.H. Sidney Freedman)

On Sun, 10 Aug 2003 08:38:21 -0400, Warren & Nancy
wrote:

All right you computer guys! Why is it that there are more and more web sites that
Netscape can't read? How are they programming, and why?

The composers are using MS applications that are not completely NS
compliant. The latest incarnation of NS reads almost anything IE does
and it's one whale of a lot better than the earlier versions.
Particularly Vs 6 which was so bad I took it off the machines.

I've not been keeping up on it but the latest versions of MS office
and Front Page use XHTML (Extended HTML) and Netscape can not
interpret some of the commands. Course even the earlier versions of ME
IE and Netscape, what ever version, were not completely compatible.

If for instance you program a page using Front Page, the thing sets up
links to runs some of the code from the MS site which includes the
version, who did it, and a bunch of other stuff. Not that I'd accuse
MS of intentionally writing stuff that wouldn't run on other peoples
browsers...

FP and Word create code that is huge. A really big list of
definitions at the beginning and then they format *every* line. Even
if it's a big paragraph they still format every line. You can easily
end up with 3 to 5 lines of formatting code for one short line of
text. That means a ten line paragraph could end up taking 50 lines of
source which adds to the time to load the page.

It's bloated and sloppy programming, but it makes it easy for the
beginner to create a fancy page with flashing banners, crawling text,
and changing colors that are pretty, but difficult to read and
disliked by most users.

For me it's far easier to save the word doc as a text file and then
add the HTML tags.

Frames were considered bad form for some time. Now, many pages use
them. If not overdone they are kinda handy.

HTML itself only has about a couple dozen commands, but they can be
used in many ways It's very straight forward and easy to use if you
don't try to get too fancy. and it's a pain for e-mail and news
groups. Both my mail and news readers are set for plain text only to
prevent malicious code and tracking means to be loaded.

OTOH XHML has quite a few more commands. Again it will pull some of
the operating procedures from links.

Roger Halstead (K8RI EN73 & ARRL Life Member)
www.rogerhalstead.com
N833R World's oldest Debonair? (S# CD-2)


Damn, it's frustrating!

Warren

Roger Halstead wrote:

On Sat, 09 Aug 2003 21:45:30 +0000, Scott
wrote:

Nah, you don't want to use composer. Real Men and Women write in HTML!



Been there, Doing that for 5 years now...

After using Netscape composer, MS Word, and MS Front Page I try to do
almost all of my HTML by hand coding.

I sometimes use Front Page, but only after creating the page first.
Never create one in Front Page. It creates huge files of bloat code
and adds about 3 to 5 pages of definitions at the beginning.

I only used composer a couple of times and it took several days to get
the page back to normal, but FP is bad and saving in HTML from a Word
doc is worse.

Roger Halstead (K8RI EN73 & ARRL Life Member)
www.rogerhalstead.com
N833R World's oldest Debonair? (S# CD-2)


Scott
http://corbenflyer.tripod.com
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ParasolAirplanes
Building RV-4
Gotta Fly or Gonna Die!


Jerry Wass wrote:

Yeah Man!
Thanks Ron !
I was just tryin to learn how to do that--my network provider will give me a site,
& the best thing--(I didn't know till you told me) My Nutscrape 4.8 has the
Composer
too!!--2WINGS2U--Jerry

RobertR237 wrote:

Hey Ron,

Ok, now that I am infamous, where are the riches you promised.

Just got my September issue of KitPlanes and saw the story on Building a Home
Page. Great article and I was pleased to see my Web Page in the composite shot
at the beginning of the article. I was really surprised to see a much larger
shot and caption on one of the following pages.

Thanks for the coverage and I am watching the mailbox every day for that
fortune you promised. ;-)

Bob Reed
www.kisbuild.r-a-reed-assoc.com (KIS Builders Site)
KIS Cruiser in progress...Slow but steady progress....

"Ladies and Gentlemen, take my advice,
pull down your pants and Slide on the Ice!"
(M.A.S.H. Sidney Freedman)

Warren & Nancy wrote:

All right you computer guys! Why is it that there are more and more web sites that
Netscape can't read? How are they programming, and why?

Damn, it's frustrating!

Warren

HTML is an evolving specification. What your old browser knows of
HTML 4.01 and style sheets is likely wrong and/or incomplete, hence
the poor rendering. Style sheets are here to stay -- they obviate the
need for much of the formatting that litters older HTML code. As more
web programmers migrate to the new specification, more web pages will
fail to render correctly in older browsers. The fix, for you, is to
update to a current web browser. I recommend Mozilla. Mozilla is the
browser upon which the latest Netscape is based. With Mozilla, you'll
get the best browser sans the commercial trappings of its Netscape
derivative. Once you've experience the tabbed browsing features of
Mozilla, you'll never look back. A Mozilla hint: Set preferences so
that your middle mouse button (mouse wheel depress) opens a new tab in
Mozilla when clicked on a link. Also, set preferences to load new
tabs in the background. Another great feature in Mozilla is pop-up
control, either globally or on a per-site basis. Don't like that
pop-up? Simple, right click it and select "Disallow pop-ups from this
site". Mozilla rocks.

Don't let the mozilla web site confuse you, it's geared towards
programmers and offers ancillary programs that you don't need. All
you need is the latest stable release of Mozilla for your platform
(Mozilla 1.4 as of this post). Look in the upper left hand corner for
the correct download link.

http://www.mozilla.org

David O -- http://www.AirplaneZone.com

....... or vigins.

I'm still trying to decide on a good definition to fit that v-word

Small gray birds that haven't met BOb yet? :-)

Ron Wanttaja
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Whew.
I thought I read....

small GAY birds.


Barnyard BOb --

On 10 Aug 2003 16:56:02 GMT, osit (RobertR237)
wrote:

In article , Roger Halstead
writes:


After using Netscape composer, MS Word, and MS Front Page I try to do
almost all of my HTML by hand coding.

I sometimes use Front Page, but only after creating the page first.
Never create one in Front Page. It creates huge files of bloat code
and adds about 3 to 5 pages of definitions at the beginning.

I only used composer a couple of times and it took several days to get
the page back to normal, but FP is bad and saving in HTML from a Word
doc is worse.

Roger Halstead (K8RI EN73 & ARRL Life Member)
www.rogerhalstead.com
N833R World's oldest Debonair? (S# CD-2)



If you would rather spend your time on content instead of HTML then try the
AOLPRESS product. It is free and very easy to use. Not fancy by any means but
works.

Ever since having been a customer of AOL way back in the early days
I've had an aversions to anything with the letters AOL in it. However
It sounds like it might be worthwhile investigating.

Not that Word and FP don't create nice looking and functional pages.
They do. It's just they use about five times as much resources than
what are needed. Plus the source code is difficult to read as much of
it is calls.

Thanks, Bob,

Roger


Bob Reed
www.kisbuild.r-a-reed-assoc.com (KIS Builders Site)
KIS Cruiser in progress...Slow but steady progress....

"Ladies and Gentlemen, take my advice,
pull down your pants and Slide on the Ice!"
(M.A.S.H. Sidney Freedman)

Roger Halstead (K8RI EN73 & ARRL Life Member)
www.rogerhalstead.com
N833R World's oldest Debonair? (S# CD-2)

Yes, HTML 4 is what I write in.

Scott


pac plyer wrote:

Scott wrote in message ...
Nah, you don't want to use composer. Real Men and Women write in HTML!



Been there, Doing that for 5 years now...

Scott

Scott is that HTML 4? Did 4 ever catch on? I was trying to learn it
(just for grins) before various women started distracting me from that
and flying. ;-)

pac

--

Scott
http://corbenflyer.tripod.com
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ParasolAirplanes
Building RV-4
Gotta Fly or Gonna Die!