GLIDING INTERNATIONAL -- RESEARCH

wrote on 11/4/2019 4:52 AM:
All this hand ringing... THIS IS NOT a complex problem!
The vast majority of accidents can be crammed into 4 general catagories:
1. False dependance on aux engine
2.aging of general soaring populous
3. Lack of “situational specific “ experience
4. Lack of currancy, not flying regularly ( related to #3.

1. The rash of motor equiped sailplane accidents speaks for itself and is Fricking up the insurance rates for all of us. Flying such that ya depend on that aux power is just plain criminal.

I'm not aware of a "rash of motor equiped sailplane accidents", at least in the
USA, and I know a lot of motorglider pilots. How many accidents are you talking
about, and what is the time period?

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorg...ad-the-guide-1

The good old days, when you didn’t have to worry about a motor starting and there was NO chance of dying in a fiery crash, unless you hit a fuel truck.

Eric 6 i know of personally in the last 2 years

I have to disagree branko, saying accidents are complex is the usual dodge we have been using for yeats. Just like stall/spin, weve been discussing this for decades ad nausium. Simple, fly the Fin aircraft properly and as someone here stated always fly in such a way as to give yourself options.

Psychological factors ALWAYS come into play but when its all boiled down you end up with crappy airmanship and, improper decisions irreguardless of what precipitated them be it cockiness or fear or inexperience.

On Monday, November 4, 2019 at 11:01:36 AM UTC-8, wrote:
I have to disagree branko, saying accidents are complex is the usual dodge we have been using for yeats. Just like stall/spin, weve been discussing this for decades ad nausium. Simple, fly the Fin aircraft properly and as someone here stated always fly in such a way as to give yourself options.

Psychological factors ALWAYS come into play but when its all boiled down you end up with crappy airmanship and, improper decisions irreguardless of what precipitated them be it cockiness or fear or inexperience.

If we don't analyze the psychological factors that precipitate bad decisions and if we don't learn how to recognize them and remedy them, we won't make much progress in avoiding future bad decisions.

Branko XYU

I agree its not an eigher-or but needs to be a both-and, however I feel the fundamental problem doesnot lie in the psychological factors. Those are gonna be with us forever. The problem lies in diminished airmanship skills. There is an overdependance of technology (aux motors, high L/D) at the expense of actually knowing how to properly handle your machine, the wx, the terrain. These more elemental factors are imop bigger determining perimeters in accident creation and accident avoidance.

Those are all significant contributing factors, it would be hard to argue otherwise.

My original point was that we usually make up our minds about the main causes of accidents based on anecdotal evidence, personal experience and personal inclinations. A better, scientific, approach would be to look at the statistics based on reliable data, and analyzing the root causes.

What Gliding International published does not qualify as scientific approach, not by a long shot. Saying that "our problematic area of soaring flight relates to the landing phase" says nothing about what causes these types of accidents, nor how to avoid them, given that "the landing phase" itself is generally unavoidable.

Branko XYU

LoL “landing phase generally unavoidable� very well said. Definitely agree, study of a more detailed approach definitely needed.

wrote on 11/4/2019 11:44 AM:
I agree its not an eigher-or but needs to be a both-and, however I feel the
fundamental problem doesnot lie in the psychological factors. Those are gonna
be with us forever. The problem lies in diminished airmanship skills. There is
an overdependance of technology (aux motors, high L/D) at the expense of
actually knowing how to properly handle your machine, the wx, the terrain.
These more elemental factors are imop bigger determining perimeters in accident
creation and accident avoidance.

Pilots with diminished skills can (and often do) compensate by increasing their
margins. Low skills do not inevitably lead to an unsafe pilot. We all know of many
very experienced, current pilots that died in glider accidents. Psychological
factors affect the selection of margins and the obedience to them - two reasons
psychological factors are important.


--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorg...ad-the-guide-1

wrote on 11/4/2019 10:53 AM:
Eric 6 i know of personally in the last 2 years

All in the US, and all due to false dependence on aux power? Who?

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorg...ad-the-guide-1