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tso altimeter



 
 
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  #1  
Old December 6th 10, 09:34 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Phoenixmotoman
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Posts: 1
Default tso altimeter

I want to install a Winter 4FGH 40 altimeter with an EASA Form 1
certificate in my S-LSA motorglider with the Becker TSO'd
transponder. My avionics shop says that the altimeter must be TSO'd
as well. Can anyone cite FAA regulations about this issue? Any
information would be welcome.
  #2  
Old December 6th 10, 10:23 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Tim Mara
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Posts: 375
Default tso altimeter

the Winter 4FGH40 is TSO'd, that's what the EASA Form one is and says
so.....certifed the same as and accepted here in the USA the same as they
accept our approvals
tim
Please visit the Wings & Wheels website at www.wingsandwheels.com



"Phoenixmotoman" wrote in message
...
I want to install a Winter 4FGH 40 altimeter with an EASA Form 1
certificate in my S-LSA motorglider with the Becker TSO'd
transponder. My avionics shop says that the altimeter must be TSO'd
as well. Can anyone cite FAA regulations about this issue? Any
information would be welcome.



  #3  
Old December 7th 10, 12:00 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
John Smith
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Posts: 195
Default tso altimeter

Am 06.12.10 22:23, schrieb Tim Mara:
the Winter 4FGH40 is TSO'd, that's what the EASA Form one is and says
so.....


Just to nitpick: EASA Form 1 is just what it's called: a form. The form
per se doesn't mean an instrument is TSOed, it can as well be written on
the form that it isn't. However, in practice, you're correct: An
instrument usually only comes with a Form 1 when it's TSOed.

EASA Form 1 is the equivalent of FAA Form 8130-3. The USA and EASA
country mutually acknowledge each other's form.
  #4  
Old December 7th 10, 03:07 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Andy[_1_]
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Posts: 1,565
Default tso altimeter

On Dec 6, 2:23*pm, "Tim Mara" wrote:
the Winter 4FGH40 is TSO'd, that's what the EASA Form one is and says
so.....certifed the same as and accepted here in the USA the same as they
accept our approvals



The TSO for altimeter, pressure actuated, sensitive type, is C10b. I
have a Winter 4FGH40 in my sailplane . It was recently returned from
Winter after overhaul with an EASA Form 1. Nowhere on that form, or
in any Winter spec, can I find a statement that the Winter 4FGH40
complies with TSO C10b.

Tim, please give me a reference to a Winter spec that claims TSO C10b
compliance.

My form 1 in this case merely certifies that the work done (overhaul)
was accomplished in accordance with FAR-145 and the work item is
satisfactory for release to service.

As to the OP's question - I know of no requirement for your altimeter
to be TSO compliant. Get your avionics shop to show the regulation,
and if they can't take your work somewhere else.

Andy
  #5  
Old December 7th 10, 06:48 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Rex
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Posts: 14
Default tso altimeter

I would look into the requirements for LSA aircraft. I do not believe
LSA aircraftt are required to have TSO'd equipment of any type. ALso
many aircraft manufacturers list approved equipment. Most of the
European manufacturers include the Becker and Winter equipment. This
is considered approval data.
Rex
  #6  
Old December 7th 10, 06:31 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Tim Mara
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Posts: 375
Default tso altimeter

If it is for use with a Transponder then the TSO is a
requirement....Transponders are TSO (only) installations and the requirement
for the TSO also is in connection with the altimeter....providing it is for
altitude reporting transponders (mode C)
tim
Please visit the Wings & Wheels website at www.wingsandwheels.com

"Rex" wrote in message
...
I would look into the requirements for LSA aircraft. I do not believe
LSA aircraftt are required to have TSO'd equipment of any type. ALso
many aircraft manufacturers list approved equipment. Most of the
European manufacturers include the Becker and Winter equipment. This
is considered approval data.
Rex

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  #7  
Old December 7th 10, 06:56 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Darryl Ramm
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Posts: 2,403
Default tso altimeter

On Dec 7, 9:31*am, "Tim Mara" wrote:
If it is for use with a Transponder then the TSO is a
requirement....Transponders are TSO (only) installations and the requirement
for the TSO also is in connection with the altimeter....providing it is for
altitude reporting transponders (mode C)
tim
Please visit the Wings & Wheels website


I've already pojnted to the FARs ti clarify both main points but you
seem to be disagreeing so can you point to a FAR to substantiate
either claim here? So again/in more detail...

Transponders themselves are strictly a "meets the performance and
environmental requirements of TSO blah" see 14CFR 91.215 so it is
technically up to the person signing off the installation to determine
this. Which has allowed transponders without TSO approval to be
installed. But most shops will say that will only install a
Transponder with TSO approval. But this us really not relevant to the
original question.

For non-IFR aircraft I do not believe adding a transponder requires
the altimeter to be TSOed. See my earlier post and the FARs quoted
there.

If you want to disagree please quote the relevant FARs.

Darryl
  #8  
Old December 7th 10, 11:05 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
John Smith
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Posts: 195
Default tso altimeter

Am 07.12.10 03:07, schrieb Andy:
The TSO for altimeter, pressure actuated, sensitive type, is C10b. I
have a Winter 4FGH40 in my sailplane . It was recently returned from
Winter after overhaul with an EASA Form 1. Nowhere on that form, or
in any Winter spec, can I find a statement that the Winter 4FGH40
complies with TSO C10b.


My form 1 in this case merely certifies that the work done (overhaul)
was accomplished in accordance with FAR-145 and the work item is
satisfactory for release to service.


Which is how the form 1 works. If a manufactorer sells a new instrument
with a form 1, then the TSO norm to which the instrument complies (if
any) is written to that form. If you get an instrument overhauled, then
that form 1 says that is has been overhauled according to the
regulations by a repair shop with a license (if so), and nothing more.
The new form 1 doesn't replace the older.

Winter sells both TSOed and not TSOed altimeteres. As you can guess,
they differ heavily in price (you get about three non-TSOed for one
TSOed). Looking at the price, the 4FGH40 seems to be TSOed. But if you
want to know, why don't you just send a mail to Winter and ask? Winter
tends to be pretty responsive, at least so has been my experience.
  #9  
Old December 7th 10, 02:47 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Mike Schumann
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Posts: 539
Default tso altimeter

On 12/7/2010 5:05 AM, John Smith wrote:
Am 07.12.10 03:07, schrieb Andy:
The TSO for altimeter, pressure actuated, sensitive type, is C10b. I
have a Winter 4FGH40 in my sailplane . It was recently returned from
Winter after overhaul with an EASA Form 1. Nowhere on that form, or
in any Winter spec, can I find a statement that the Winter 4FGH40
complies with TSO C10b.


My form 1 in this case merely certifies that the work done (overhaul)
was accomplished in accordance with FAR-145 and the work item is
satisfactory for release to service.


Which is how the form 1 works. If a manufactorer sells a new instrument
with a form 1, then the TSO norm to which the instrument complies (if
any) is written to that form. If you get an instrument overhauled, then
that form 1 says that is has been overhauled according to the
regulations by a repair shop with a license (if so), and nothing more.
The new form 1 doesn't replace the older.

Winter sells both TSOed and not TSOed altimeteres. As you can guess,
they differ heavily in price (you get about three non-TSOed for one
TSOed). Looking at the price, the 4FGH40 seems to be TSOed. But if you
want to know, why don't you just send a mail to Winter and ask? Winter
tends to be pretty responsive, at least so has been my experience.


Are there any physical differences between the TSOed and non-TSOed
versions, or are you just paying extra for the paperwork?

--
Mike Schumann
  #10  
Old December 7th 10, 02:24 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Andy[_1_]
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Posts: 1,565
Default tso altimeter

On Dec 6, 7:07*pm, Andy wrote:

My form 1 in this case merely certifies that the work done (overhaul)
was accomplished in accordance with FAR-145 and the work item is
satisfactory for release to service.


Sorry, typing error, it certifies JAR-145 not FAR-145 compliance.

 




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