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#31
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
"Jay Honeck" wrote in message oups.com... Now that's bull****. Aggressive leaning is COOLER when done properly (i.e., using the proper temp range when LOP. It also produces lower internal cylinder pressures, more through combustion, lower CHT temps. Not in a carbureted engine. Yes, in a carburated engine. The fuel flows are simply not matched well enough between cylinders to run lean of peak without risking damage. That's a seperate issue, but even that's not completely right. The issue there is the ****ty fuel distribution in horizontally opposed engines. That includes carb engines and FI. The issue IS the sloppy (horrendously) design and workmanship that the two big boys have been getting us schmucks to buy into for the past couple generations. Go and read about the P&W radials and how they ran them during the carburation days, then put the book on display in your hotels library. Now, in a fuel-injected engine (especially with GAMI), that's a whole different world. But in the low compression carbureted world, you run rich of peak, or you risk destroying your engine. You run rich of peak in the wrong range and you still mess up your engine, high compression or low, Mogas or Avgas, carbureted or FI'ed. |
#32
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
"nrp" wrote in message ups.com... Dick Collins in Flying mag had a new '75 Skyhawk that he tried to run on 100LL using aggressive leaning techniques. I recall he got to 800 hours TT before writing a bitter editorial (who would do THAT nowdays?) about his engine's bad case of lead poisoning, and ended with " a four cylinder engine running on three cylinders gives a message that's hard to ignore". What engine does the 75 Skyhawk carry? Collins also wrote an article about a year ago (June '05 ?) after putting GAMI's in his P210 castigating LOP. GAMI and Mac McClellan both returned the broadside as it was obvious he didn't bother to learn the techniques. The manager at GAMI, Tim Roehl, stated in an email, "He has never asked us for assistance in getting it right, or doing it right. We have invited him to come visit us and fly with us, to no avail. I guess he must know everything. Disappointing to mislead so many people in the perseverance of such "old wives tales." GAMI's Jean-Paul Townsend stated in an email, " I would personally pay the $995 for him to go to the Advanced Pilot Seminar. He has been offered a gratis seat before, but he won't take it." Say le vie, I guess. -- Matt --------------------- Matthew W. Barrow Site-Fill Homes, LLC. Montrose, CO |
#33
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
People seem to ignore the fact that lead dibromide, the byproduct of
burning 100LL, is acidic highly corrosive when mixed with water, which is also plenty as a result of combustion. Lead dibromide is formed when Tetra-ethyl lead react swith lead scavenging agent ethylene dibromide during the combustion. The lead scavenging agent is a necessary evil to get rid of the metalic lead after TEL does it job of retarding the combustion. Without it the metalic lead will quickly accumulate in the engine as slush. Other than its high octane value (which isn't needed in 1:7 compression engines), 100LL isn't such a good fuel to begin with. |
#34
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
Collins 172 engine was same as mine. Lyc O-320E2D low compression.
Only mine has been fed a minimum lead diet to get 1700 hrs TT & 30 years since new (i. e. no OH!). Interesting RC attitudes on the GAMI observations. I think he was very aggressive in leaning his 172 to the point of roughness - and he got plenty of that thru the years he had it. At the time though his 172 problems sure scared hell out of us & our (then) new bird. His is history. We still have ours. |
#35
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
Jay Honeck wrote: Geez Jay, better get yourself educated on leaning. Leaning properly on the ground means way, way lean of peak which by definition is downright cold EGT's although on the ground at low power there's no such thing as high EGT. Welcome to 1952, where you have to move levers on the panel in order to make your plane run properly while on the ground. And you say MOGAS is bad? I never said that. I used it for 7 years in my 182, wish I could still use it. You seem to have a real bummer of an engine. I don't really lean on the ground with my 520 and don't have any problems. Strange how I have to do none of that, when I run with mogas. The engine just purrs like a kitten, without any input from me at all. Ditto here. |
#36
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
("M" wrote)
Lead dibromide is formed when Tetra-ethyl lead react swith lead scavenging agent ethylene dibromide during the combustion. The lead scavenging agent is a necessary evil to get rid of the metalic lead after TEL does it job of retarding the combustion. Without it the metalic lead will quickly accumulate in the engine as slush. Do you know how many lbs. of actual lead are in ...100 gallons of 100LL? Curious ....unfortunately, so are the Green Meanies. Montblack http://www.sensesofcinema.com/contents/cteq/03/26/yellow_submarine.html Blue Meanie |
#37
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
"Montblack" wrote:
Do you know how many lbs. of actual lead are in ...100 gallons of 100LL? From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avgas : "Avgas 100LL contains a maximum of 2 grams of lead per US gallon" |
#38
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
So you point is that lead scavenging agent isn't needed because there's
not that much lead in the 100LL? |
#39
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
"M" wrote in message oups.com... People seem to ignore the fact that lead dibromide, the byproduct of burning 100LL, is acidic highly corrosive when mixed with water, which is also plenty as a result of combustion. Lead dibromide is formed when Tetra-ethyl lead react swith lead scavenging agent ethylene dibromide during the combustion. The lead scavenging agent is a necessary evil to get rid of the metalic lead after TEL does it job of retarding the combustion. Without it the metalic lead will quickly accumulate in the engine as slush. Other than its high octane value (which isn't needed in 1:7 compression engines), 100LL isn't such a good fuel to begin with. Baloney. 100LL is the best fuel made and can't be duplicated Your problems sound like "The sky is falling" Karl ATP CFI ETC "Curator N185KG |
#40
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
On Thu, 11 May 2006 10:08:01 -0700, "Matt Barrow"
wrote: "Jay Honeck" wrote in message roups.com... Geez Jay, better get yourself educated on leaning. Leaning properly on the ground means way, way lean of peak which by definition is downright cold EGT's although on the ground at low power there's no such thing as high EGT. Welcome to 1952, where you have to move levers on the panel in order to make your plane run properly while on the ground. And you say MOGAS is bad? Strange how I have to do none of that, when I run with mogas. The engine just purrs like a kitten, without any input from me at all. Nice change of subject when caught with your pants down. curious who was right there to jump on, also. TC |
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