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#21
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They used to say you could "polish" the frost smooth with a rag or gloved hand, although I have not heard of that in a long time and I would never do it on a supercritical wing shape. *Maybe* a light single engine, but never a business jet. But even so, that still leaves the question of the top of the T tail. Best answer is a quick spray down with the deice truck - wouldn't take much to get rid of a morning frost. "They" still say you can polish, at least for 135 operations! Sec. 135.227 - Icing conditions: Operating limitations. (a) No pilot may take off an aircraft that has frost, ice, or snow adhering to any rotor blade, propeller, windshield, wing, stabilizing or control surface, to a powerplant installation, or to an airspeed, altimeter, rate of climb, or flight attitude instrument system, except under the following conditions: (1) Takeoffs may be made with frost adhering to the wings, or stabilizing or control surfaces, if the frost has been polished to make it smooth. Karl |
#22
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"Darkwing Duck" theducksmail"AT"yahoo.com wrote in message ... "Blueskies" wrote in message .. . "zatatime" wrote in message ... On Wed, 02 Feb 2005 13:50:35 -0900, Scott Skylane wrote: Blueskies wrote: /snip/ Someone on a respirator with head injuries was hit while driving his car, and a couple more were injured when hit... Well, he shouldn't have been driving in the first place!!! LOL!!! That's exactly what I was thinking!!! z LOL - OK, I get it! Sad day for a couple of folks - just heard two died... Not that I can find anywhere - http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...ap/plane_crash Still a wild deal. I flew IN a Challenger a couple times, amazing plane. Beats my 172! Yep, nothing I can find now. Damn TV. I guess still not a good day, but not as bad as before?!?! |
#23
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Darkwing Duck wrote:
"Blueskies" wrote in message .. . "zatatime" wrote in message . .. On Wed, 02 Feb 2005 13:50:35 -0900, Scott Skylane wrote: Blueskies wrote: /snip/ Someone on a respirator with head injuries was hit while driving his car, and a couple more were injured when hit... Well, he shouldn't have been driving in the first place!!! LOL!!! That's exactly what I was thinking!!! z LOL - OK, I get it! Sad day for a couple of folks - just heard two died... Not that I can find anywhere - http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...ap/plane_crash Still a wild deal. I flew IN a Challenger a couple times, amazing plane. Beats my 172! Except at short-field takeoffs and landings! :-) Matt |
#24
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Peter R. wrote:
Joe Johnson wrote: To Peter R. and Gary Mishler. Say for sake of argument that the pilots missed a thin layer of frost. If discovered, are there any remedies short of a full, formal deicing? I am not qualified to answer as I have no experience in anything greater than a single engine piston aircraft. That said, when my aircraft was frosted over in those three incidents, my only fly-able option was to request a complete aircraft deicing. Fortunately, in all three cases the line crew was available, had the deice fluid nearby, and did it for free. I tipped them generously. If deicing were not an option, I would have had to get a hotel and wait until the frost melted off the next day, or some liquid deicing were available. In no case would I have attempted to take off with it on the wing surface. Why? It is acceptable to "polish the frost smooth" per FAR 91.527. Matt |
#25
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"Jim Burns" wrote in message ... Thank you for pointing this out. The "visable moisture" requirement is for in-flight icing, not frost. Temp/Dewpoint at TEB yesterday morning was M04/M08. Obviously the "collecting surface" was below freezing and the temp dewpoint spread was narrow enough for the humidity to sublimate and create frost on the wings. Jim Sounds like we're closing in on an answer, or at the very least reasonably informed speculation. |
#26
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Matt Whiting wrote:
Why? It is acceptable to "polish the frost smooth" per FAR 91.527. Three words: New paint job -- Peter ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- |
#27
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"Peter R." wrote in message ... Matt Whiting wrote: Why? It is acceptable to "polish the frost smooth" per FAR 91.527. Three words: New paint job -- Peter Those cans of spray-on windshield de-icer, which are mostly alcohol, seem to do a great job, even on very heavy frost. Seems like two or three, and a towel for a wipedown, would be a good thing to carry. Save the paint, fast, complete, and not two expensive when compared to a paint-job, airport de-ice (if available), or a new plane and crew. -- Jim in NC |
#28
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"Matt Whiting" wrote in message ... Darkwing Duck wrote: "Blueskies" wrote in message .. . "zatatime" wrote in message ... On Wed, 02 Feb 2005 13:50:35 -0900, Scott Skylane wrote: Blueskies wrote: /snip/ Someone on a respirator with head injuries was hit while driving his car, and a couple more were injured when hit... Well, he shouldn't have been driving in the first place!!! LOL!!! That's exactly what I was thinking!!! z LOL - OK, I get it! Sad day for a couple of folks - just heard two died... Not that I can find anywhere - http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...ap/plane_crash Still a wild deal. I flew IN a Challenger a couple times, amazing plane. Beats my 172! Except at short-field takeoffs and landings! :-) Matt Yeah, but the Challenger had a BATHROOM! |
#29
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"Matt Whiting" wrote in message
Peter R. wrote: ... If deicing were not an option, I would have had to get a hotel and wait until the frost melted off the next day, or some liquid deicing were available. In no case would I have attempted to take off with it on the wing surface. Why? It is acceptable to "polish the frost smooth" per FAR 91.527. Interesting. It seems a rather dubious practice to me. It would indeed appear to be legal in the US - but, FWIW, it isn't legal in Canada. |
#30
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On 2/2/05 8:24 AM, in article ,
"Jon Kraus" wrote: It looks like the Challenger skidded off the runway and crashed into a warehouse at TEB. Isn't this the same kind of plane that crashed on takeoff in Colorado? It looks like the plane remained intact so hopefully the passengers and crew are OK. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,146112,00.html Jon Kraus PP-ASEL-IA '79 Mooney 201 4443H It seems to me that beyond the fact that they did ultimately crash, this crew made the right decision to abort the takeoff and avoided an accident that would likely have been much worse. -- Jeff 'The Wizard of Draws' Bucchino Cartoons with a Touch of Magic http://www.wizardofdraws.com More Cartoons with a Touch of Magic http://www.cartoonclipart.com |
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