Cessna BRS

Morgans wrote:
"Gig 601XL Builder" wrote

That weight is the only the BRS itself and not what would have to be
done to the airframe itself to add the system and while it doesn't
seem like a lot it is about 10% of the useful load of an LSA

130+ pounds? No way!

1300 pounds of useful load. what LSA's are you flying?

"Gig 601XL Builder" wrote

1300 pounds of useful load. what LSA's are you flying?

Ahh. 10% of _ _USEFUL LOAD_ _ .

My reading comprehension is way down today, I guess. g
--
Jim in NC

Morgans wrote:
"Gig 601XL Builder" wrote

1300 pounds of useful load. what LSA's are you flying?

Ahh. 10% of _ _USEFUL LOAD_ _ .

My reading comprehension is way down today, I guess. g

Been there done that.

"Gig 601XL Builder" wrDOTgiaconaATsuddenlink.net wrote:
That weight is the only the BRS itself and not what would have to be
done to the airframe itself to add the system and while it doesn't
seem like a lot it is about 10% of the useful load of an LSA and it is
weight that is much further back than the fuel tanks so it will count
for more in virtually any LSA installation.

Well somehow the Flight Design CT manages to include a BRS as standard
equipment yet still weigh in at only 649 lbs yet still provide an airframe
capable of a 1320 lbs gross weight. (Properly equipped for day VFR looks to
cost ~$105k. Adding navcom radios also adds weight above their 649 lbs.
http://www.flightdesignusa.com/ )

The CT is the kind of competition Cessna has to go up against. That's why
Cessna may not have any choice but to include a parachute. But I'm still
counting on their bean-counters (possibly with assistance from their un-
imaginative engineering and manufacturing side) to nix the idea.

Don't forget to add to the price that it will have to repacked every 6
years. While I don't know what they charge I'd bet it ain't cheap.

Repacking cost is not an "unknown" or particularly hard to find information
- it is listed on BRS Parachutes web site right here (under "BRS Products"
menu item "BRS Repack Center"):
http://www.brsparachutes.com/Default.aspx?TabId=25

About US$1500 for the LSA models. Amortized over 6 years, ~$21/month.
Hardly a show-stopping cost at ~6 large Starbucks Lattes/month (assuming a
venti Latte costs $3.50.) ;-)

Plus I never really liked the idea of having an explosive device right
behind my head. And yes, I not particularly thrilled about having one
in front of me aimed at my chest in my car either, but a lot more of
those have been built and I figure most of the bugs have been worked
out.

Can't help you there. How many people have died from exploding BRS rockets
so far?

Jim Logajan wrote:
"Gig 601XL Builder" wrDOTgiaconaATsuddenlink.net wrote:
That weight is the only the BRS itself and not what would have to be
done to the airframe itself to add the system and while it doesn't
seem like a lot it is about 10% of the useful load of an LSA and it
is weight that is much further back than the fuel tanks so it will
count for more in virtually any LSA installation.

Well somehow the Flight Design CT manages to include a BRS as standard
equipment yet still weigh in at only 649 lbs yet still provide an
airframe capable of a 1320 lbs gross weight. (Properly equipped for
day VFR looks to cost ~$105k. Adding navcom radios also adds weight
above their 649 lbs. http://www.flightdesignusa.com/ )

The CT is the kind of competition Cessna has to go up against. That's
why Cessna may not have any choice but to include a parachute. But
I'm still counting on their bean-counters (possibly with assistance
from their un- imaginative engineering and manufacturing side) to nix
the idea.



Flight Design has done a fantastic job with the CT. How they got the weight
to that level amazes me. If Cessna were smart they'd just buy Flight Design
out and make the CT their LSA entry in the market. It's high wing and they
could say CT stands for Cessna Traveler or some other word that starts with
T.

I thought about a BRS in the Zenith I'm building. It was going to take up
virtually all of my cargo space plus I just didn't see the need for it.







Don't forget to add to the price that it will have to repacked every
6 years. While I don't know what they charge I'd bet it ain't cheap.

Repacking cost is not an "unknown" or particularly hard to find
information - it is listed on BRS Parachutes web site right here
(under "BRS Products" menu item "BRS Repack Center"):
http://www.brsparachutes.com/Default.aspx?TabId=25

About US$1500 for the LSA models. Amortized over 6 years, ~$21/month.
Hardly a show-stopping cost at ~6 large Starbucks Lattes/month
(assuming a venti Latte costs $3.50.) ;-)


I never said it was an unknown I just said I didn't know it. I'm sure that
$1500 is what they charge when you ship it to them. A&P will add some more
to that to take it out and put it back. It is cheaper than I expected
though.



Plus I never really liked the idea of having an explosive device
right behind my head. And yes, I not particularly thrilled about
having one in front of me aimed at my chest in my car either, but a
lot more of those have been built and I figure most of the bugs have
been worked out.

Can't help you there. How many people have died from exploding BRS
rockets so far?

Not that I know of but hasn't they started warning rescue folks that they
might blow during the rescue process?

Plus I never really liked the idea of having an explosive device right
behind my head. And yes, I not particularly thrilled about having one in
front of me aimed at my chest in my car either, but a lot more of those
have
been built and I figure most of the bugs have been worked out.


I never liked either idea, and still don't!

Peter
( Sparing y'all the rant)

"Skyman1957" wrote in message
oups.com...

Thanks John. But what I'm looking for is your gut feeling, not
evidence of. The theory is that asked a straight forward question
the majority or average response of a large number of people is allot
more reliable than individual experts. From the book "The Wisdom of
Crowds" if your interested.

Like the majority that once believed the Earth was flat and that Poseiden
ruled the seas?

Cessna will not install a BRS on any of their aircraft. Surprisingly, it
increases liabity issues instead of diminishing them.

"anon" wrote in message
m...

"Skyman1957" wrote in message
oups.com...

Thanks John. But what I'm looking for is your gut feeling, not
evidence of. The theory is that asked a straight forward question
the majority or average response of a large number of people is allot
more reliable than individual experts. From the book "The Wisdom of
Crowds" if your interested.

Like the majority that once believed the Earth was flat and that Poseiden
ruled the seas?

Cessna will not install a BRS on any of their aircraft. Surprisingly, it
increases liabity issues instead of diminishing them.


I would have to agree with that too.

Although a BRS can be a life saver, it is also something that can fail or be
misused. I think still lessons to be learned about their use and
installation before they will be considered an undisputable advantage, and a
smart aircraft producer would be well advised to keep it optional.

"anon" wrote in message
m...

"Skyman1957" wrote in message
oups.com...

Thanks John. But what I'm looking for is your gut feeling, not
evidence of. The theory is that asked a straight forward question
the majority or average response of a large number of people is allot
more reliable than individual experts. From the book "The Wisdom of
Crowds" if your interested.

Like the majority that once believed the Earth was flat and that Poseiden
ruled the seas?

Cessna will not install a BRS on any of their aircraft. Surprisingly, it
increases liabity issues instead of diminishing them.


However, the Cirrus is actually outselling Cessna and the wogs say it is
because of the chute aboard. I suspect Cessna is going to start seriously
looking at putting parachutes on all of their single engine airplanes except
perhaps the Caravan! :-)

Highflyer
Highflight Aviation Services
Pinckneyville Airport ( PJY )

PS: The rec.aviation flyin at Pinckneyville is coming up soon. May 18, 19,
and 20. See the faq and photos at http://www.ousterhout.net/pjy-faq.html
Send Mary an email if you are coming at to make sure she
lays in enough food for you. She is already cooking and shopping.

"Highflyer" wrote in message ...
However, the Cirrus is actually outselling Cessna and the wogs say it is
because of the chute aboard.

I suspect that is has more to do with the fact that the Cirrus is fast, and
new, and sorta sexy without being complicated to fly.

I suspect Cessna is going to start seriously looking at putting parachutes on
all of their single engine airplanes

You can already put a BRS on a 152 or 172 for a lot less money than it
would cost you to buy a new Cirrus, and Cessna BRS STCs ain't exactly flying
off of the shelves.