Requirement to fly departure procedures

wrote in message
...

That's all good except they can't clear you to maintain 4,000' in an area
where
their MVA is higher. They can clear you to climb VFR to maintain their
MVA, or
higher.


Why would the tower clear you to climb VFR to the MVA? Why would you
request it?

"Newps" wrote in message
news:glmhb.76878$%h1.66094@sccrnsc02...

Not unless you are taking off and climbing.


ATC can clear below the MVA on radar approaches.

"John Clonts" wrote in message
...

Can you give me a clearance VFR-on-top below the MVA/MEA?


In a straight VFR-on-Top clearance ATC won't mention altitude at all, it's
just "Maintain VFR-on-Top." If the altitude must be restricted to ensure
separation with another IFR aircraft before VFR-on-Top is reached, that
altitude must be at or above the MEA/MIA. As a pilot it's your
responsibility to choose an altitude that complies with FARs 91.159 and
91.177.

wrote:

Newps wrote:


John Clonts wrote:


Can you give me a clearance VFR-on-top below the MVA/MEA?

We have a lot of OTP cargo flights here at night. ATC does not specify
an altitude for OTP operations, sometimes the pilot will specify what
altitude he will be cruising at, sometimes not. Many times he will tell
me he will be cruising at say 6500, well below the MEA. I don't care as
it is not my responsibility. I hand him off to the center and off he
goes. From my monitoring of the center freq I gather they do not care
either.


Here’s what the policy is as set forth in AIM 4-4-7:

e. When operating in VFR conditions with an ATC authorization to "maintain
VFR-on-top/maintain VFR conditions" pilots on IFR flight plans must:
1. Fly at the appropriate VFR altitude as prescribed in 14 CFR Section
91.159.
/snip/

Unless, of course, you qualify under Part 121.657:

(d) Day over-the-top operations below minimum en route altitudes. A
person may conduct day over-the-top operations in an airplane at flight
altitudes lower than the minimum en route IFR altitudes if --

(1) The operation is conducted at least 1,000 feet above the top of
lower broken or overcast cloud cover;

(2) The top of the lower cloud cover is generally uniform and level;

(3) Flight visibility is at least five miles; and

(4) The base of any higher broken or overcast cloud cover is generally
uniform and level and is at least 1,000 feet above the minimum en route
IFR altitude for that route segment.


Happy Flying!
Scott Skylane

wrote in message
...

Won't say it's never done, but you are not suppose to operate on an IFR
flight plan, with a VFR on top restriction, below the applicable minimum
instrument altitude. That is an ATC policy and is set forth in the AIM.


It's also a regulation, which is all that is binding on the pilot.

KP wrote:
John Clonts wrote in message ...

Can you give me a clearance VFR-on-top below the MVA/MEA?


The altitude to maintain assigned in the IFR clearance is "VFR-On-Top. A
specific altitude is not issued.

While maintaining VFR-On-Top it's up to you to comply with 14 CFR Section
91.159(a)
/snip/

See Part 121.657(d), for those who qualify.

Happy Flying!
Scott Skylane

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote:

wrote in message
...

That applies to any local departure procedure for traffic or noise
abatement. It does not apply to IFR departure procedures.


It says "departure procedures established for that airport by the FAA".
That doesn't sound local to me.

If you can find them in a national charting publication, let us know. They
are the product of the airport authority and blessed by the region for that
airport.

wrote in message
...

If you can find them in a national charting publication, let us know.
They
are the product of the airport authority and blessed by the region for
that
airport.


You can find departure procedures in U.S. Terminal Procedures publications.
These procedures are the product of the FAA, not the airport authority.

Steven P. McNicoll wrote:
wrote in message
...

That's all good except they can't clear you to maintain 4,000' in an area

where

their MVA is higher. They can clear you to climb VFR to maintain their

MVA, or

higher.



Why would the tower clear you to climb VFR to the MVA? Why would you
request it?


Simple, there may be a crossing restriction that you can not meet.
Rather than take vectors around the offending terrain, you request a
"VFR climb through x000 feet(MVA), climb and maintain x000 ft.(cruising)"

Happy Flying!
Scott Skylane

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote

wrote
If you can find them in a national charting publication, let us
know. They are the product of the airport authority and blessed
by the region for that airport.


You can find departure procedures in U.S. Terminal Procedures
publications. These procedures are the product of the FAA, not
the airport authority.

Perhaps you haven't seen the departure procedures to which Mr.
Airperson and I have made reference.

Bob Moore