Have you ever...

Ha! I hadn't even *thought* of that, but now that you mention it...

One of Mary's uncles took us flying....
Only much later, when I began flight training, did I casually do some
checking on him, just to see what his ratings were. Imagine my
surprise when I discovered he wasn't listed as a pilot at all!

Wow. And your related to this guy. ;-) I'm never going in a plane
with you. And if you come out west please notify the FCC to put
up a NOTAM.

Your story sounds like some of the "accidents" on the NTSB website.
I put accident in quotes because any time a person without a license
goes flying and crashes it's no accident. That is expected as it
is almost intentional. Looking back I'm sure you shake your head.
I do it with this friend of a friend in Germany. He's a statistic
waiting to happen.

Gerald

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message

Yes, my first CFI-I.

He was a hot dog. I flew with him twice and then quit him.

A few weeks later he was trying to show someone how close to the threshold
he could put the wheels on landing. He came up a few feet short and badly
damaged the aircraft and his career, but fortunately no ones health.

wrote in message
...
[...]
doesn't mean that I'm going to climb into an airplane with what is
still, when you think about putting your life in their hands, a TOTAL
STRANGER. Again, it's a no-brainer that you don't take *car* rides from
total strangers ... why are airplane rides any different?

Be careful about your generalizations. In the scenario you describe, I see
no reason to accept a ride. But there are plenty of examples of passengers
who are total strangers to the pilot accepting rides, as are there examples
of taking car rides from total strangers, all in very reasonable, accepted
situations.

Pete

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
news:X%16e.33363$NW5.4119@attbi_s02...
...refused to fly with someone you felt was not entirely safe? (With that
person acting as PIC, not as a passenger in your own plane.)

I had it happen earlier this year, for the first time, ever, and it felt,
well, weird.

I think I did the right thing, but it's hard to say. That funny little
voice in my head just kept saying "stay on the ground..." -- so I did.

Never heard that voice before.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"


Yes, I will not fly with any private or non-professional commercial pilot
except in the right seat unless they have demonstrated TO ME that they are
competent. I may simply be paranoid.

Mike
MU-2

"Peter Duniho" wrote:
Be careful about your generalizations. In the scenario you describe, I see
no reason to accept a ride. But there are plenty of examples of passengers
who are total strangers to the pilot accepting rides, as are there examples
of taking car rides from total strangers, all in very reasonable, accepted
situations.

I didn't make any generalizations. In the scenario described, I knew
*nothing* about this person, not even his name, and he was not an
acquaintance of anyone I knew ... just a man driving through the airport.

I don't know what examples there are of people taking car rides or plane
rides from total strangers--no one I know gets into a car with a person
they don't even know. I'm not talking about taxicab drivers, limo
drivers, courtesy rides from maintenance shops, charter pilots or CFIs
doing Discovery Flights...that's a completely different scenario where
the passenger has initiated the ride/flight as part of a service they
are paying for. I was talking about a total stranger assuming you would
have no qualms about hopping into an airplane with him.

Wow. And your related to this guy. ;-)

Only by marriage!

And if you come out west please notify the FCC to put
up a NOTAM.

I know my radio procedures aren't perfect, but can they really put out
NOTAMs?

;-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

wrote in message
...
I didn't make any generalizations.

I guess it was someone else who wrote: "it's a no-brainer that you don't
take *car* rides from total strangers". Sounds like a generalization to me.

[...]
I don't know what examples there are of people taking car rides or plane
rides from total strangers--no one I know gets into a car with a person
they don't even know.

One of the volunteer things I have done was to drive total strangers. They
didn't know me, I didn't know them.

Last I heard, EAA was still doing Young Eagles flights. Again, total
strangers.

And believe it or not, there are people who still hitch-hike. Some risk?
Sure. But flying with someone you know doesn't preclude risk either.

I would say the issue is only a "no-brainer" for someone without a brain.
Otherwise, there is some thinking involved. You have to weigh the various
aspects of the situation.

Pete

"Peter Duniho" wrote:
I guess it was someone else who wrote: "it's a no-brainer that you don't
take *car* rides from total strangers". Sounds like a generalization to me.

Take one sentence out of context, and of course it sounds like a
generalization. In context, however, I was referring to situations like
the one described -- someone you don't know walks up to you and assumes
you're going flying together.

One of the volunteer things I have done was to drive total strangers. They
didn't know me, I didn't know them.

Did you just pick people at random on the street that you assumed needed
rides? or were you a volunteer with some sort of program that matched up
drivers with people needing rides? -- two very different things. In
fact, in some parts, a man offering rides to people at random,
especially ladies, may well prompt someone to call the police.

Last I heard, EAA was still doing Young Eagles flights. Again, total
strangers.

Again, that's a completely different situation that what I was
discussing. Young Eagle flights and the EAA are established programs.
Those participating, on both sides, may not know one another, but there
is at least an *implied* understanding of that program. That's one notch
up from being a "total" stranger and different than some stranger
offering you a ride at random.

And believe it or not, there are people who still hitch-hike. Some risk?
Sure. But flying with someone you know doesn't preclude risk either.

EXACTLY. That was the point!
In the scenario being discussed, I wasn't hitching an airplane ride.

You have to weigh the various aspects of the situation.

Yes, and that was Jay's original question, if anyone has ever refused to
fly with someone.

Jay Honeck wrote:
And if you come out west please notify the FCC to put
up a NOTAM.
I know my radio procedures aren't perfect, but can they really put out
NOTAMs?
;-)


Oh I meant a NOTAM on the newsgroup and not a FSS NOTAM.

Gerald

wrote in message
...
Take one sentence out of context, and of course it sounds like a
generalization. In context, however, I was referring to situations like
the one described

The context was about airplanes. Your comment specified cars. How can you
possibly claim that your comment was NOT a generalization. You specifically
generalized from airplanes to cars, and from a specific stranger to all
strangers generally.

[...] That's one notch
up from being a "total" stranger and different than some stranger
offering you a ride at random.

Thus the problem with generalizations. When you fail to qualify your
statement, it becomes inaccurate. Just because someone else is vouching for
a person, that does not keep them from being a total stranger. It simply
makes them a different kind of total stranger.

Thank you for illustrating exactly the problem with generalizations I was
talking about.

And believe it or not, there are people who still hitch-hike. Some risk?
Sure. But flying with someone you know doesn't preclude risk either.

EXACTLY. That was the point!
In the scenario being discussed, I wasn't hitching an airplane ride.

Because you refused, true. But it's reasonably analagous to hitch-hiking,
which is not a uniformly dangerous practice.

Yes, and that was Jay's original question, if anyone has ever refused to
fly with someone.

Actually, his question was "Have you ever refused to fly with someone you
felt was not entirely safe?" That's a very different question from "have
you ever refused to fly with someone you did not know to be entirely safe?"

The person you described was not someone you had any reason to believe "was
not entirely safe." The only reason for declining the ride was your lack of
knowledge about him, not some specific knowledge about him.

Pete