Getting confused with ATC order...Violation?

Hello-

I am a student pilot. I was out flying solo today and was instructed
by ATC to fly a heading of 210. I thought he said 110 and I flew on
that heading. He then told me it looks like your going the wrong
direction i need you to fly 210. I got a bit locked up and said 210.
I ended up on 210 but I really kinda got "mike fright".

Anyway, I just wanted to know if this would constitute a violation and
if I might receive something in the mail, etc? He later told me to
"resume own navigaion" and I did not know what that meant...I asked
him if I could do my airwork and he said resume on navigation meant I
can do anything I want.

He did not ask me to call a land line or anything like that, though
when I requested to change to my CTAF as I had the airport in site, he
said frequency change approved and squalk VFR when I am on the ground.

Any thoughts?
SD

RubberWatch wrote:
Hello-

I am a student pilot. I was out flying solo today and was instructed
by ATC to fly a heading of 210. I thought he said 110 and I flew on
that heading. He then told me it looks like your going the wrong
direction i need you to fly 210. I got a bit locked up and said 210.
I ended up on 210 but I really kinda got "mike fright".

Anyway, I just wanted to know if this would constitute a violation and
if I might receive something in the mail, etc? He later told me to
"resume own navigaion" and I did not know what that meant...I asked
him if I could do my airwork and he said resume on navigation meant I
can do anything I want.

He did not ask me to call a land line or anything like that, though
when I requested to change to my CTAF as I had the airport in site, he
said frequency change approved and squalk VFR when I am on the ground.

Any thoughts?
SD

Yes. If you are directed by ATC to do something and you screw it up,
don't panic or get mike fright. The world won't come to an end; trust me.
Two things might happen. You will either be told of the error by ATC and
asked to correct it as you were here, or you yourself will notice the
error. Either way, key the mike, acknowledge the mistake openly and in a
professional manner and follow as ATC from that point directs.

The main thing to remember when dealing with ATC is that their prime
concern is your safety and the safety of other traffic. Nither you OR
ATC are perfect and mistakes will happen. What's important is that any
and all mistakes are corrected. It's not a blame game. It's a safety
game, and the trick is to minimize the mistakes.
By acknowledging a mistake with ATC you are helping them help you.
Believe me, they are not out there to write you up or diminish you in
any way.
Shoot straight with ATC all the time.....EVERY TIME!

--
Dudley Henriques

On Apr 3, 8:01 pm, RubberWatch wrote:
Hello-

I am a student pilot. I was out flying solo today and was instructed
by ATC to fly a heading of 210. I thought he said 110 and I flew on
that heading. He then told me it looks like your going the wrong
direction i need you to fly 210. I got a bit locked up and said 210.
I ended up on 210 but I really kinda got "mike fright".

A couple of questions first...

Did you announce you were a student pilot?
Which ATC were you talking to? (A tower? Class B?)


Dan Mc

On Apr 3, 5:33 pm, Dan wrote:
On Apr 3, 8:01 pm, RubberWatch wrote:

Hello-

I am a student pilot. I was out flying solo today and was instructed
by ATC to fly a heading of 210. I thought he said 110 and I flew on
that heading. He then told me it looks like your going the wrong
direction i need you to fly 210. I got a bit locked up and said 210.
I ended up on 210 but I really kinda got "mike fright".

A couple of questions first...

Did you announce you were a student pilot?
Which ATC were you talking to? (A tower? Class B?)

Dan Mc

Hi-

First of all, thank you to everyone who has promptly replied to my
posting. Either everyone is helpful, on different time zones, or many
pilots are internet junkies like myself
To clarify...

I was in E class airspace. believe in E airspace communication is
not required but recommended while VFR


I was talking to a ARTCC (Approach) , not a tower...typically I depart
a non towered airport and fly to a practice area but stay on norcal
approach while in the area....another thing he mentioned to me was
that I had "multiple targets near marysville" which I take to mean
that I was flying to an area that had alot of air traffic?

I did announce to him that I was a student pilot about midway into the
communication. I was on a heading of 300 when I was told to "alter
course 90 degrees to the right temporarily." Looking back on it I was
confused by his instruction and I did alter towards a heading of 060
and then somehow I heard him say 210. That is when things got thrown
off for me.

On Thu, 3 Apr 2008 20:22:09 -0700 (PDT), RubberWatch
wrote:


I was in E class airspace.

Technically, ATC has no jurisdiction to "victor" VFR aircraft
operating within Class E airspace. Controllers often do attempt to do
that, but compliance is at the discretion of the Pilot In Command
(PIC).
[i]
believe in E airspace communication is not required but
recommended while VFR

That is correct.

Ask your instructor about Cockpit Resource Management and/or do a web
search. It's always best for the PIC to employ all the tools at his
disposal, and a controller at a radar scope provides an additional
means of spotting and avoiding conflicting air traffic. In congested
urban areas, and indeed other areas, the prudent pilot will request
Radar Traffic Advisory Service (Flight Following) and burn a landing
light to enhance his conspicuity (FAA Operation Light On).

I was talking to a ARTCC (Approach) , not a tower...

Generally Air Route Traffic Control Centers ('Center' in the
vernacular) control the en route phase of flights.

Approach/Departure Control controllers are generally operating from a
Terminal Radar Approach CONtrol facility or TRACON. They typically
coordinate flights climbing to or descending from their en route
altitudes.

typically I depart a non towered airport and fly to a practice area
but stay on norcal approach while in the area....another thing he
mentioned to me was that I had "multiple targets near marysville"
which I take to mean that I was flying to an area that had alot of
air traffic?

So you were receiving Radar Traffic Advisory Service from an Approach
Control facility (NorCal TRACON located in Sacramento), and the
controller "suggested" that you change course to avoid potential
conflicting air traffic. The "targets" refer to the display of
individual aircraft depicted on the controller's radar screen, not
something for you to aim at. :-)


I did announce to him that I was a student pilot about midway into the
communication. I was on a heading of 300 when I was told to "alter
course 90 degrees to the right temporarily."

You were "advised" to alter your course by the controller. As PIC,
you have sole authority (and responsibility) for your flight
operations within Class E (and G) airspace.

It seems many CFIs fail to instill the concept of "command" in their
students.

Here are dictionary definitions of the word 'command':
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/command

The concept of being in command is often new to a flight student. I
can't emphasize strongly enough, that the flight crew member acting as
Pilot In Command must assume command responsibility for his flight
operations, and not abandon his responsibility to others. Because of
this necessity to command, I believe becoming an airman should be a
life changing experience for those unaccustomed to commanding.

Looking back on it I was
confused by his instruction and I did alter towards a heading of 060
and then somehow I heard him say 210. That is when things got thrown
off for me.

Radio communications can be difficult in the noisy environment. If
you haven't yet, consider purchasing an Active Noise Reduction
headset; you'll never go back to a passive headset.

At this stage in your flight training, these sort of errors are
common. But now that you've experienced this one, you'll be vigilant
to see that it isn't repeated. And after you have earned your Airmans
Certificate, you'll continue to make other errors and learn from them,
hence the cliche "license to learn."



--
There's an old saying that every pilot starts with a full bag of
luck, and empty bag of experience - the trick being to fill the
bag of experience before you empty the bag of luck"
-- Colin Southern

"Larry Dighera" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 3 Apr 2008 20:22:09 -0700 (PDT), RubberWatch
wrote:


I was in E class airspace.

Technically, ATC has no jurisdiction to "victor" VFR aircraft

I hesitate to nitpick an otherwise excelent post, but for the benefit of the
OP wish to note that the correct spelling should be "vector".
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/vector
[i]
operating within Class E airspace. Controllers often do attempt to do
that, but compliance is at the discretion of the Pilot In Command
(PIC).

believe in E airspace communication is not required but
recommended while VFR

That is correct.

Ask your instructor about Cockpit Resource Management and/or do a web
search. It's always best for the PIC to employ all the tools at his
disposal, and a controller at a radar scope provides an additional
means of spotting and avoiding conflicting air traffic. In congested
urban areas, and indeed other areas, the prudent pilot will request
Radar Traffic Advisory Service (Flight Following) and burn a landing
light to enhance his conspicuity (FAA Operation Light On).

I was talking to a ARTCC (Approach) , not a tower...

Generally Air Route Traffic Control Centers ('Center' in the
vernacular) control the en route phase of flights.

Approach/Departure Control controllers are generally operating from a
Terminal Radar Approach CONtrol facility or TRACON. They typically
coordinate flights climbing to or descending from their en route
altitudes.

typically I depart a non towered airport and fly to a practice area
but stay on norcal approach while in the area....another thing he
mentioned to me was that I had "multiple targets near marysville"
which I take to mean that I was flying to an area that had alot of
air traffic?

So you were receiving Radar Traffic Advisory Service from an Approach
Control facility (NorCal TRACON located in Sacramento), and the
controller "suggested" that you change course to avoid potential
conflicting air traffic. The "targets" refer to the display of
individual aircraft depicted on the controller's radar screen, not
something for you to aim at. :-)


I did announce to him that I was a student pilot about midway into the
communication. I was on a heading of 300 when I was told to "alter
course 90 degrees to the right temporarily."

You were "advised" to alter your course by the controller. As PIC,
you have sole authority (and responsibility) for your flight
operations within Class E (and G) airspace.

It seems many CFIs fail to instill the concept of "command" in their
students.

Here are dictionary definitions of the word 'command':
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/command

The concept of being in command is often new to a flight student. I
can't emphasize strongly enough, that the flight crew member acting as
Pilot In Command must assume command responsibility for his flight
operations, and not abandon his responsibility to others. Because of
this necessity to command, I believe becoming an airman should be a
life changing experience for those unaccustomed to commanding.

Looking back on it I was
confused by his instruction and I did alter towards a heading of 060
and then somehow I heard him say 210. That is when things got thrown
off for me.

Radio communications can be difficult in the noisy environment. If
you haven't yet, consider purchasing an Active Noise Reduction
headset; you'll never go back to a passive headset.

At this stage in your flight training, these sort of errors are
common. But now that you've experienced this one, you'll be vigilant
to see that it isn't repeated. And after you have earned your Airmans
Certificate, you'll continue to make other errors and learn from them,
hence the cliche "license to learn."



--
There's an old saying that every pilot starts with a full bag of
luck, and empty bag of experience - the trick being to fill the
bag of experience before you empty the bag of luck"
-- Colin Southern

On 2008-04-04, Private wrote:
Technically, ATC has no jurisdiction to "victor" VFR aircraft
I hesitate to nitpick an otherwise excelent post, but for the benefit of the
OP wish to note that the correct spelling should be "vector".
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/vector

"Got the vector, Victor?"
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
http://www.hercules-390.org (Yes, that's me!)
Buy Hercules stuff at http://www.cafepress.com/hercules-390

On Fri, 4 Apr 2008 09:39:39 -0700, "Private"
wrote:

the correct spelling should be "vector".

Thank you.

On Apr 4, 6:57 am, Larry Dighera wrote:ATC does
have

Technically, ATC has no jurisdiction to "victor" VFR aircraft
operating within Class E airspace. Controllers often do attempt to do
that, but compliance is at the discretion of the Pilot In Command
(PIC).


The Class E airspace near Marysville would be within the outer area
associated with Beale AFB Class C airspace. Class C services are
provided to participating traffic and VFR aircraft can be vectored.

On Fri, 4 Apr 2008 08:51:09 -0700 (PDT), "Steven P. McNicoll"
wrote:

On Apr 4, 6:57 am, Larry Dighera wrote:ATC does
have

Technically, ATC has no jurisdiction to "victor" VFR aircraft
operating within Class E airspace. Controllers often do attempt to do
that, but compliance is at the discretion of the Pilot In Command
(PIC).


The Class E airspace near Marysville would be within the outer area
associated with Beale AFB Class C airspace.

It looks that way he http://skyvector.com/perl/code?id=KMYV&scale=3

Class C services are provided to participating traffic and VFR
aircraft can be vectored.

So that's only true for ATC vectoring VFR flights operating in Class E
airspace generally within 30 miles of a Class C airport. I hadn't
consulted a chart when I made my statement.

To be more accurate, I should have said, "Technically, ATC has no
jurisdiction to "victor" VFR aircraft operating within Class E
airspace unless they are within a Class C outer area." Is that
consistent with your view of the regulations/orders?

Thanks for your input.