FAI (IGC) rules for US Club Class Nationals - Petition

In contrast, Winscore was designed "from the ground up" as a scoring program specifically for US competition. It is supported "locally" and Guy Byars is obviously committed to keeping Winscore current.

Why change? Lets keep things "Made in the USA"!


Hey, leave me out of this one!

I agreed to upgrade Winscore for 2013 to score using the IGC/FAI rules in addition to the US-SSA rules. I have had requests for this in the past, and it is a good improvement to the program regardless of the current debate.

I plan to have any distance (radii SMTD... etc) specified in the IGC rules in km to be a user input. That way the program can be used by the purists, or those that want things specified in convenient statute miles.

Scoring software is not an issue in this debate.

Guy Byars

Sean, your proposal by definition is going to limit participation and hurt Sports class. You cut off access to a bunch of not-quite-competitive gliders at the upper end, and I guarantee you will scare off the newby sports class guys with your "foreign, unsafe" FAI rules that emphasize start gaggling and mass landouts (remember, newbies still read Soaring cover to cover).. And how many club class racers really care if they get seeding points? They may just want to race.


Kirk, Sports Class will continue to have the same results even if Club Class gliders move into a separate class at the same venue. Yes, the Sports Class category will have fewer gliders because some are now in the Club Class category. Organizers will be happy to see increased overall participation.. Based on petition and previous marketing results I see a meaningful participation increase.

Suggesting a newbie will be scared off is ludicrous. IGC rules are at minimum just as safe as US rules. If a newbie has a Club Class glider, the option of flying US rules in Sports Class is an option. This petition is about having a choice. I have flown IGC contests many times. I have not experienced your ascertation of increased start gaggling and mass landouts under IGC rules. How many IGC contests have you flown to base your opinion?

Sean Franke (HA)



Setup a contest - advertise it as FAI and see who comes. Let anyone race, but if they are outside Club Class just score them as guests, and don't task for them (tough on 2-33s and ETAs, so what...). See what happens - and if is a success, petition the USTC to recognise the scores for US Club Class team selection.



Good luck - really. I truly hope Club Class works (and figure in a few years my LS6 will be legal, anyway), but I'm not sure the current approach is working.



Kirk

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On Friday, December 21, 2012 2:41:42 AM UTC+1, wrote:

Kirk, Sports Class will continue to have the same results even if Club Class gliders move into a separate class at the same venue. Yes, the Sports Class category will have fewer gliders because some are now in the Club Class category. Organizers will be happy to see increased overall participation. Based on petition and previous marketing results I see a meaningful participation increase.

Sean, you can't have it both ways - Club Class gliders are the core of Sports class. Personally, I don't care for Sports class, so it's academic, but a new guy in the sport with his newly purchased ASW-19 might think otherwise.

Suggesting a newbie will be scared off is ludicrous. IGC rules are at minimum just as safe as US rules. If a newbie has a Club Class glider, the option of flying US rules in Sports Class is an option. This petition is about having a choice. I have flown IGC contests many times. I have not experienced your ascertation of increased start gaggling and mass landouts under IGC rules. How many IGC contests have you flown to base your opinion?

Sean, you are being elitist - something I'm accused of frequently! Ask pilots of racing gliders who don't race why they don't race and you will get a lot of answers, but a lot are scared off by "all the rules". Advertising a contest as following "foreign FAI rules" is not going to make those pilots more likely to show up! And please note that I didn't say FAI rules are more dangerous, I said that someone who is thinking about getting into the sport and gets his information from reading Soaring or RAS is probably going to get that impression. Read Moffat's Winning - I thought it was exciting, but some would find it scary!

Again, I wish you guys luck. But the "we are the hotshots and want to do things our way because we know better" attitude is getting a bit old ;^) Just do it.

Kirk
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Starting to look for a 15M regional to go to this summer...

Kirk,

Looks like Moriarty will be having a conventional Region 9 Contest this year.

The Petition has hit 50 signatures!

When I get back from vacation after Xmas I have 4 more who are having browser based trouble signing the petition.

Next goal is 60. Funny, I arbitrarily selected a goal of 100. Even I thought there was no chance of reaching it. Now I am beginning to wonder :-).

We will definitely apply to the SSA for a waiver for an FAI Club Class in Ionia (R6N) this season. So If you are interested please sign up for Region 6 North, sign up for Sports Class and send me an email about your intentions to fly FAI Club. There should be a fairly strong turnout (could be as high as 15-18)!

Merry Xmas and happy holidays to everyone. I am enjoying this debate and no matter what happens I am very much looking forward to soaring next season!

Best,

Sean
F2

54 signatures.

On Thursday, January 3, 2013 10:31:34 AM UTC-5, Sean F (F2) wrote:
54 signatures.

It appears that we may already be as high as 75 signatures. I have learned over the holidays that it is likely that numerous signers have not had their signatures appear on the website due to not responding to the verification email (which may have gone into your spam folder).

Please take a look in your spam folder under the search "petition" and respond to this email via the link provided OR simply resign and check your inbox to confirm the signature.

Here is the link to sign the TRUE US Club Class petition: http://www.thepetitionsite.com/262/8...fb_connected=1

Best,

Sean Fidler
F2/7T

56 signatures (about 10 having some kind of tech difficulty).

Thats now well over 50 current US contest pilots, most OWNING Club Class gliders and have been doing so for many years (committed), many TOP US CONTEST PILOTS (Sean, Sarah, Peter, etc), many top Jr's, many average Joe's who are asking for the rules committee to approve what it was asked for in the first place, and IGC Club Class Nationals to qualify US pilots for the World Championships.

If you would like to see the signatures OR sign the petition yourself...just click this link: http://www.thepetitionsite.com/262/8...fb_connected=1

Sean
F2

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On Tuesday, January 29, 2013 9:24:59 AM UTC-5, Sean F (F2) wrote:
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Heinz